Phil Gould

[Carlton]

As GM he would need full control and would need to exercise it at his professional discretion, if not it is a job with title only and little else.

I dont agree that he needs full control, he should not be trying to do the coach or the recruitment managers jobs for them. Having oversight and doing the job on a day to day basis are different things. The GM of Football should not be going down to the field when they are training and taking over from the coach.

 

[Carlton]

Doesn't Mary and Millward both report to the CEO. A CEO who is a former Dragons player who played at the top level.

Our problem is that Mary, Millward and Johnston are owned by the 'old boys club'. Hiring Gould as the Director of Football with a place on the SGI Board would be the best we can do at the moment.

Our CEO can spend his time being in charge of things other than football. Maybe he and Doust together can do something about the refurbishment of the Taj.

Possm this is exactly what I said, the only difference is I dont think Gould is the person we need.

 

[BennyV]

There's no boys club. A connection to your history is a good thing.

If we had @possm and pals view we'd lose the red v and sell to someone who's never watched a game, like @Frank Facer

Which of them represents a connection to our history?

 

[Warabrook saint]

You boys just resigned your coach, why do you need another.

Because we need a coach

 

[Walpole]

What if Phil Gould came in and said Paul McGregor was the right man for the job? What if he agreed Euan Aitken was a better centre than Lomax? Why are you all so convinced he'd do exactly what you would do?

 

[RufusRex]

We said he was good .. not perfect ;-)

 

[Warabrook saint]

Years ago I would have said chase Gus hard.

Over the last couple of years I feel he his sacking of Cleary, appointment and sacking of Griffin and reappointment of Cleary has left me feeling Gus is past it.

Still better than our lot.

May be worth chasing him in the hope that he puts the epsom salts through our mob.

We need a clean out of the old boys club, but it must start at Board level.

He wanted Bennett not Cleary back, that's why he left

 

[giboz71]

What if Phil Gould came in and said Paul McGregor was the right man for the job? What if he agreed Euan Aitken was a better centre than Lomax? Why are you all so convinced he'd do exactly what you would do?

Said it in JA.

Penrith had a 52% win rate in the years that Gould was CEO. Exactly the same as the Dragons win rate under Mary.

Gould is not the messiah by any means. Plenty of other things need to go right in a footy team apart from a high profile CEO.

 

[possm]

What if Phil Gould came in and said Paul McGregor was the right man for the job? What if he agreed Euan Aitken was a better centre than Lomax? Why are you all so convinced he'd do exactly what you would do?

I believe I am on safe ground in saying I would accept his advice mainly because he is very astute and would never say that.

 

[BennyV]

Said it in JA.

Penrith had a 52% win rate in the years that Gould was CEO. Exactly the same as the Dragons win rate under Mary.

Gould is not the messiah by any means. Plenty of other things need to go right in a footy team apart from a high profile CEO.

Winning percentage alone is a ridiculous assessment of a GM.

You’re comparing apples with oranges based purely on their ability to make apple juice.

 

[Hard Yards]

I dont agree that he needs full control, he should not be trying to do the coach or the recruitment managers jobs for them. Having oversight and doing the job on a day to day basis are different things. The GM of Football should not be going down to the field when they are training and taking over from the coach.

Appreciate your thought and you are correct about not wanting someone in the role of GM to over ride the day to day autonomy of coach or recruitment staff etc. The job of GM as it was defined at Penrith was to provide a single level of individual expertise to asses and coordinate the worth and overall effectiveness of the individual heads of the football club without the intervention of the board. If in the opinion of the GM, lead roles or support structures should change then he must have a clear authority that allows him to do so. How he achieves this is ultimately about outcome and process. He can be consultative, inclusive or simply wield an axe. It comes down to individual style and professional manner of the individual, his actions should then in turn be solely accountable to the board. This allows boards the job of governance and overall guidance at a senior level. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[giboz71]

Winning percentage alone is a ridiculous assessment of a GM.

You’re comparing apples with oranges based purely on their ability to make apple juice.

Surely everything a CEO/GM does would eventually translate into wins and titles does it not?

What's the point of a sound financial position if you have no trophies to show for it?

If Politis was simply satisfied with simply running a well run footy club, he wouldn't have gone all out to get Cronk and Tedesco, as well as Trent Robinson.

End of the day.only premierships count in the grand scheme of things and Gould never managed to jag one at Penrith. In fact, he didn't even come close.

 

[Old Timer]

Getting yesterday’s man is not a solution for today’s issues.
Gould’s coaching methodology was successful in a bygone era and his “vision” is somewhat that of a man with cataracts.
The constant adoration for him is a bit sickening IMO.

 

[Walpole]

I believe I am on safe ground in saying I would accept his advice mainly because he is very astute and would never say that.

This is ridiculous. As far as I know Phil Gould has never given an in-depth analysis about what might be right or wrong with the Dragons. You would sack Mary. You would play Lomax over Aitken (I think most of us would). You would paint the gym a different colour. Who knows what Gould would do? It's the old, "he's from outside the club so he must be better than what we've got".

He hasn't coached in 15 years, he once lost a series against Paul Vautin, he's an annoying bloody commentator and since he's been in charge of Penrith they haven't won anything (which let's face it, is what everyone here judges the current hierarchy and coach against).

 

[Slippery Morris]

Gould to replace Greenburg makes perfect sense. The NRL is a shambles and I am sure Gus can fix it up.Probably why he became a GM at Panthers to get that experience.

As for him going to Sharks also makes sense, any high profile player goes there or Roosters and I assume Roosters are not on the lookout so yeah he will probably go there.

If he did go to Saints who would he be replacing? Who currently holds that role? Is there a vacancy?

 

[BennyV]

Surely everything a CEO/GM does would eventually translate into wins and titles does it not?

What's the point of a sound financial position if you have no trophies to show for it?

If Politis was simply satisfied with simply running a well run footy club, he wouldn't have gone all out to get Cronk and Tedesco, as well as Trent Robinson.

End of the day.only premierships count in the grand scheme of things and Gould never managed to jag one at Penrith. In fact, he didn't even come close.

For starters, CEO/GM are judged on far more than winning percentage. There is sustainability, financial stability, membership, sponsorship, facilities, fan engagement, game-day experience and a whole lot of other stuff I’ve not mentioned. It’s a whole-of-club role. Winning premierships is the goal of the club, but not the only responsibility of the CEO - would you say that Doust was a successful CEO because he won one in 2010?

Secondly, winning percentage alone is a narrow-minded view of coaching ability. Yes, it’s part of it and ultimately the end game, but since there are so many other aspects to running a team (and the fact that so many coaches stats congregate around the 50% mark) that it needs to be taken into context with many other factors, some of which aren’t black and white.

To cherry pick that one statistic in order to compare a coaches success to the work done by a general manager of football is just silliness. The closer comparison would be Millward, but even his role is far less than what Gould has responsibility over.

 

[RedVDave]

The board hiring Gould would be amazing but it won't happen because it hurt the egos of our board to much by saying we were wrong. Not to mention we probably don't have the money hence why McGregor was re-signed.

 

[giboz71]

For starters, CEO/GM are judged on far more than winning percentage. There is sustainability, financial stability, membership, sponsorship, facilities, fan engagement, game-day experience and a whole lot of other stuff I’ve not mentioned. It’s a whole-of-club role. Winning premierships is the goal of the club, but not the only responsibility of the CEO - would you say that Doust was a successful CEO because he won one in 2010?

Secondly, winning percentage alone is a narrow-minded view of coaching ability. Yes, it’s part of it and ultimately the end game, but since there are so many other aspects to running a team (and the fact that so many coaches stats congregate around the 50% mark) that it needs to be taken into context with many other factors, some of which aren’t black and white.

To cherry pick that one statistic in order to compare a coaches success to the work done by a general manager of football is just silliness. The closer comparison would be Millward, but even his role is far less than what Gould has responsibility over.

Agree with most of what you are saying.

And I wasn’t directly comparing Mary and Gould, I realise their roles are different.

But given the dissatisfaction of fans with regards to the Mary era (and yes this extends to Doust as well), and the number of Sack Mary threads on this forum, I don’t understand why everyone thinks Gould walks on water when in reality the Panthers results during his reign aren’t that much better then ours?

And he was accountable for hiring and firing coaches, players, staff etc. He even had a had in coaching the team from all accounts.

So ultimately, the bulk of the Panthers results have to fall on him.

 

[FlameThrower]

Ch9 reported he got a $10M loan within 24 hours due to his relationship with Janes Packer. That got them the Centre of Excellence. He also turned the LeagoClub from loss making to profit.
Look at St George Leagurs it’s a joke - it needs massive revamp to attract fans, customers and families not just on game day but all year round.

 

[Crush]

Ch9 reported he got a $10M loan within 24 hours due to his relationship with Janes Packer. That got them the Centre of Excellence. He also turned the LeagoClub from loss making to profit.
Look at St George Leagurs it’s a joke - it needs massive revamp to attract fans, customers and families not just on game day but all year round.

Yum Cha at St George leagues club is great. I take my family there from time to time. Its always pumping too. At least on weekends, not sure how it goes during the week.