Player welfare and Kalyn Ponga

[Pierced Soul]

Not against it but surely they need to put a week between the prelim and GF going forward?

Obviously can't be changed this year, whether they introduce it next year who knows. It'll take a big name missing the gf for it to occur, or maybe several.

There was a SL player who missed the gf last year (?) Due to getting knocked out in the prelim as they had mandatory stand downs.

 

[Mr Angry]

Let's put in a ring with the young fox fighter, some kid who's father punched the head in of some other dudes.

 

[Valheru]

The rules around concussion aren't going to get any lighter so the NRL has to look at how teams can be compensated, especially for in game HIAs which seem constant these days. Some ideas

* Any HIA requested by the independent reviewer in the bunker automatically triggers the 18th man. The ones the independent reviewer picks up are generally low grade and have a high HIA pass rate.
* Increase the bench size - Let teams have 8 on the bench so they can replace positional players that normally play 80 minutes in the case of concussion. You don't necessarily need to increase the number of interchange.
* Automatic disqualification from the game for any foul play that causes a concussion. I say disqualification as opposed to a send off because there are many instances where the action isn't reckless and worthy of a team playing with 12 players. The Jackson Hastings one the other day would be a perfect example of this. He was just trying to save a try, no malice but he caught him high and the player failed HIA.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

The rules around concussion aren't going to get any lighter so the NRL has to look at how teams can be compensated, especially for in game HIAs which seem constant these days. Some ideas

* Any HIA requested by the independent reviewer in the bunker automatically triggers the 18th man. The ones the independent reviewer picks up are generally low grade and have a high HIA pass rate.
* Increase the bench size - Let teams have 8 on the bench so they can replace positional players that normally play 80 minutes in the case of concussion. You don't necessarily need to increase the number of interchange.
* Automatic disqualification from the game for any foul play that causes a concussion. I say disqualification as opposed to a send off because there are many instances where the action isn't reckless and worthy of a team playing with 12 players. The Jackson Hastings one the other day would be a perfect example of this. He was just trying to save a try, no malice but he caught him high and the player failed HIA.

I definitely think the substitution rules need to be modified. I’d try something like this:

increase the bench to 6, 4 interchange plus two injury reserves
If a player is injured and medically ruled out by the independent doctor in the first quarter a reserve player may be substituted. After the first quarter the reserve players can only be used after a second injury.

 

[myrrh ken]

Not surprising some rooster fans have a relaxed approach to concussions with Keary, Friend, Radley, Bordner

 

[Captain Apollo]

Not surprising some rooster fans have a relaxed approach to concussions with Keary, Friend, Radley, Bordner

Yeah, right, despite the fact our club takes far more precautions towards players with head knocks than most clubs, and also does not go to the press ranting about the intervention of the independent Doctor. You are barking up the wrong tree.

 

[NewySteel]

Yeah, right, despite the fact our club takes far more precautions towards players with head knocks than most clubs, and also does not go to the press ranting about the intervention of the independent Doctor. You are barking up the wrong tree.

Not trying to slight the roosters here, but didn’t they just recently name Radley to play 6 days after suffering a concussion that showed symptoms of being category 1?

For what it’s worth, their approach to the Luke Keary situation seemed very measured though.

 

[Captain Apollo]

Not trying to slight the roosters here, but didn’t they just recently name Radley to play 6 days after suffering a concussion that showed symptoms of being category 1?

For what it’s worth, their approach to the Luke Keary situation seemed very measured though.

Symptoms does not mean he was diagnosed with a category 1 concussion. Also if you think the Roosters would rush him into a game, then you are ignoring past history. They rely on medical advice for it, not what the "Brain doctors" of Fox Sports say.

 

[NewySteel]

Symptoms does not mean he was diagnosed with a category 1 concussion. Also if you think the Roosters would rush him into a game, then you are ignoring past history. They rely on medical advice for it, not what the "Brain doctors" of Fox Sports say.

Not doubting their approach, just a comment on the optics of it. Probably reflective of the lack of knowledge us fans have of these issues, as I commented early in the thread.

All clubs can do it stick to medical advice and drown out media/social media commentary - as Keary pointed out recently.

 

[Exsilium]

As others have said, the bench needs to be reviewed.

6 bench players consisting of 4 named on Tuesday as normal with 2 being HIA or Injury related, but only due to foul play. The two extra players should be from within the top 30 and should be players chosen in FG previously and not rookies.

IDK, just making shit up.

 

[Captain Apollo]

Not doubting their approach, just a comment on the optics of it. Probably reflective of the lack of knowledge us fans have of these issues, as I commented early in the thread.

All clubs can do it stick to medical advice and drown out media/social media commentary - as Keary pointed out recently.

The other thing to be aware of is that he also went off with an eye injury after taking a poke to the eye. The Roosters would have had him checked out by the doctors, which is what they would have been guided by. If he showed any concussion symptoms during the week they would cut him. The "optics" of it don't matter a tinkers cuss I'm afraid in relation to what the medical staff say.

 

[NewySteel]

The other thing to be aware of is that he also went off with an eye injury after taking a poke to the eye. The Roosters would have had him checked out by the doctors, which is what they would have been guided by. If he showed any concussion symptoms during the week they would cut him. The "optics" of it don't matter a tinkers cuss I'm afraid in relation to what the medical staff say.

Agree, optics shouldn’t matter - only medical advice.

For the record though, did he suffer a Catergory 2 concussion? If so, hopefully it’s his last. Believe his up to his 4th already.

 

[ayatollah_murdoch]

Well the raiders better hope they don’t get any cat 1 knocks in round 12, as they play 2 games in the ensuing 11 days from that one.

can only assume anyone guaranteed a top 4 or top 8 spot will rest the entire 17 for the last round too

The boys can't be hurtin in the sheds for two weeks.

 

[Floodwaters]

Load of shit, Geoff Toovey use to get knocked out every fuxking 2nd week and he's lived a decent life.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Load of shit, Geoff Toovey use to get knocked out every fuxking 2nd week and he's lived a decent life.

He does cameos for fletch n hindy, he’s cooked.

 

[firechild]

Ever since Cleary went the cheap shot and KO’d him in origin he has been very easy to be concussed. Not sure the NRL is for him anymore.

compensation is tricky one. Ponga is possibly in the top 7 or 8 fullbacks in our game and has the potential to be among the top 10 of 5/8’s. Big name player on a decent wage. If career over should compensation be based of potential earnings or just a standardised amount.

Arguably in the top 17 but not sure I'd go so high as 7 or 8.

No compensation required, players don't get compensation for other career ending injuries.

 

[Captain Apollo]

Agree, optics shouldn’t matter - only medical advice.

For the record though, did he suffer a Catergory 2 concussion? If so, hopefully it’s his last. Believe his up to his 4th already.

In all honesty I do not know. From what I can recall, he was taken off due to the eye injury and the headknock and failed the HIA.

However that was in Round 1 against the Dolphins. Radley didn't play in Round 2 against the Warriors, he was ruled out on the Friday before the game and Naufahu Whyte started at lock in his place with Radley out of the side altogether (source: https://www.roosters.com.au/news/2023/03/07/nrl-line-up-for-round-2-vs-warriors/).

One thing though in general, these issues do show up the poor tackling technique many players have. Way too many of then lead with their head when making a tackle, which is why many a tackler winds up getting concussed.

 

[footy75]

One thing though in general, these issues do show up the poor tackling technique many players have. Way too many of then lead with their head when making a tackle, which is why many a tackler winds up getting concussed.

agree.

 

[marshall stalin]

15% is a 2.5x increase on 6%, that’s actually pretty significant.

id imagine any retirement guarantees would be for a fixed amount, not based off income at the point to retirement. would be pretty bullshit if a journeyman forced to retire from concussion received a exponentially smaller amount than a star.

If ponga was forced to retire I would assume selling his house would be a forgone.

If the medical retirement was approved by the NRL Ponga would still receive his contract payment as if he was playing (monthly payments i think they receive) - paid by either the insurer or club but not included under the salary cap.

Similar to Boyd Cordner whose 5 year contract he signed at the end of 2018 expires this year in 2023 and is not included under the cap

 

[Danish]

If the medical retirement was approved by the NRL Ponga would still receive his contract payment as if he was playing (monthly payments i think they receive) - paid by either the insurer or club but not included under the salary cap.

Similar to Boyd Cordner whose 5 year contract he signed at the end of 2018 expires this year in 2023 and is not included under the cap

Is that payout guaranteed by the enterprise agreement, or is it something that can differ club to club?

the richer clubs would have the ability to keep paying out a contract that incurs a medical retirement but others would not. So you’d hope that this type of insurance would be mandatory on all contracts and not something clubs can choose to pay out of pocket