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Rick Ponting is a disgrace

JJ

Immortal
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32,339
mickdo said:
Because they attempt to hold Australia to a higher standard, and ignore indescretions by other teams, trying to paint Australia as the only sledgers, excessive appealers, close catch 'takers', and non-walkers in the game, when to anyone with two eyes they are clearly not.

I don't know that anyone has said Aust is the only team that does this...

twizzle, do you have an answer yet?
 
Messages
712
mickdo said:
Because they attempt to hold Australia to a higher standard, and ignore indescretions by other teams, trying to paint Australia as the only sledgers, excessive appealers, close catch 'takers', and non-walkers in the game, when to anyone with two eyes they are clearly not.

i dont' think anyone is saying that australia are the only sledgers out there
 

Twizzle

Administrator
Staff member
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152,659
JJ said:
I don't know that anyone has said Aust is the only team that does this...

twizzle, do you have an answer yet?

OK, I'll play your little game

NO to the first one

and

NO to the second one
 

JJ

Immortal
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32,339
Opinion


Tim de Lisle >>

Let's ban sledging
Cricket shouldn't just be trying to ban racism, it should ban sledging

January 8, 2008



Ponting is a sledger too, and he and Harbhajan have been needling each other on and off for nearly seven years © Getty Images





It's a drama unfolding on the other side of the world, and I wasn't watching the match. But something about the Harbhajan Singh affair doesn't feel right.

In fact, three things don't. First, it takes two to tangle. Andrew Symonds is a well-known sledger, as is Harbhajan. Mike Procter is asking us to believe that one party was severely at fault while the other was not at fault at all, and that doesn't ring true.

The second problem is that Procter listened to eight hours of evidence and then swallowed Ricky Ponting's view of things whole. Ponting is a sledger too, and he and Harbhajan have been needling each other on and off for nearly seven years. Ponting has often got out cheaply to Harbhajan: if anyone were to call him Bhajji's bunny, it would be harsh, and cheap, but fair.

The third problem is the amount that is being asked of Procter. The guy's an ex-cricketer, not a high-court judge. His job as a match referee requires him to decide whether Harbhajan called Symonds a monkey, and if so, what he meant by it. Procter had to look at the remark through the lens of racism, but he might equally well have peered through the lens of speciesism. Bringing monkeys into a sportsmen's spat is demeaning to monkeys.

It does seem likely that the remark was intended as a racial insult, if it was ever made: the India fans who chanted it at Symonds a few months ago clearly meant it that way. But that was recorded on video, whereas this time, there is doubt over whether the offending remark was made. The eight hours of evidence are a vivid demonstration of that doubt - this is a vastly magnified version of those moments when an umpire takes so long to decide about a thin edge or an lbw that you just know he should keep his finger down. And if there was doubt, then Harbhajan should have been given the benefit of it.

Cricketers say a lot of stupid things to each other. It has been known for one to address another as a Pommie bastard, or Pommie wanker. Is that racism? There isn't (usually) a skin-colour dimension to it, but it's still racial. And pathetic. If the pot calls the kettle black, is it being racist too?

You can argue endlessly over whether one remark or another has a racist element. What is needed is a big, simple, magnanimous response. Beneath it all lies a deeper malaise: sledging itself. Cricket shouldn't just be trying to ban racism. It should ban sledging.

This is a front on which every team is guilty. Australia have often led the way, but Sri Lanka have had their moments, as did India especially under Sourav Ganguly, and so have South Africa and even those nice, educated boys from New Zealand. England are certainly not innocent bystanders: one reason it was a relief to see Matt Prior dropped this week is that he was particularly potty-mouthed - and when he was criticised for it, the England coach, Peter Moores, was dumb enough to argue that the answer was to switch off the stump mike. Not that Duncan Fletcher was any better: he makes it clear in his recent book that Chris Read was ditched as keeper because he didn't join in Paul Collingwood's doomed attempt to out-sledge Shane Warne in his final Test.

Sledging has been rife for years, and it stinks. It's a sad, feeble way to try and take a wicket. Bowlers should use the ball, and their talent: that's what they're for. Batsmen who answer in kind, like Kevin Pietersen, who allegedly yelled "Fetch it!" at Symonds last year to give the impression that he was a specialist fielder, are little better.

It's sometimes said that fans wouldn't enjoy watching a game conducted largely in silence. But the outpouring of emotion on all sides this week - including an impressive number of two-eyed Australia fans - shows that the cricket-loving public are deeply disgruntled as it is. And silence is no problem at all. Curtly Ambrose didn't sledge, and people loved watching him.




Sledging has been rife for years, and it stinks. It's a sad, feeble way to try and take a wicket. Bowlers should use the ball, and their talent: that's what they're for. Batsmen who answer in kind, like Kevin Pietersen, who allegedly yelled "Fetch it!" at Symonds last year to give the impression that he was a specialist fielder, are little better.










Talking is the commentators' job. And the fans'. And the captains' - as long as they are addressing their own side, or the umpires, or the media, and not saying anything as crass as Ponting's claim that this row was "one little incident". If it was so little, why did he report it to the umpires, and set the ball rolling towards turning the incident into a diplomatic one?

Twelve years ago, a great Australian cricketer was asked for his views on sledging. "If a fellow attempted it under me," the old fellow replied, "I would have given him one warning and, if he repeated it, I would have made sure he was not selected again." That was Sir Don Bradman, speaking at the age of 87. Bradman wasn't always right, but he certainly was on that occasion. Sledging demeans everyone who practises it. It sours the game.

After five years as England captain, and more Test victories than any of his predecessors, Michael Vaughan has the authority to take that sort of stand. After five years as Australia's captain, and 16 victories in a row, Ponting has it even more so. So if the ICC won't ban sledging, Ponting and Vaughan should agree a pledge and ask the other national captains, Test and one-day, to sign up to it. It should be short and simple enough to be expressed in the modern sportsman's preferred form of off-field verbal communication: a text message.

Their fellow players might give them a few funny looks, or even a verbal onslaught. But cricketers know, deep down, that sledging is wrong. You can tell by the fact that they use euphemisms to denote it, like factory workers making sure they put on rubber gloves to handle the toxins they include in everyday products. Steve Waugh called it "mental disintegration"; others prefer "a bit of banter" or "a bit of chirp". Rare is the player who will call a sledge a sledge while he is still playing. But they know it's not cricket. If somebody seizes this moment and takes a stand, the whole cricket world, sooner or later, will thank them.



http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/current/story/329711.html

another opinion piece ladies - I've made my views on sledging known many times, so I agree

BTW- Richard Hadlee - a non-sledger. Glenn Turner - manged to stand at first slip without abusing anyone
 

JJ

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Open your eyes, Ricky
Australia's captain needs greater awareness of his team's actions

January 8, 2008



Ricky Ponting is not a popular man in India © AFP




Somebody, probably a preschool teacher, needs to explain simply to Ricky Ponting about the damage that has been caused by his team during the Sydney Test. While India burns and fumes over issues ranging from race to umpiring and sportsmanship, Ponting continues to believe his team has done nothing wrong.

It is extraordinary that he doesn't understand the significance of India's threat to boycott the tour or Australia's direct and indirect roles in the lead-up to it. He is as temporarily blind as some of the officials were at the SCG.

On a day when there was a call for Ponting, Australia's most successful captain, to be sacked, his only concession was that he would sit down with Anil Kumble and talk about the situation "if Anil thinks that is necessary". "But I'd be really surprised if he thought it was."

If it's necessary? At the time Ponting was speaking to the Australian the entire tour was in doubt. A day earlier Kumble had accused Australia of not playing in the spirit of the game, an insult that should be even more damaging than "monkey" or "bastard" to any self-respecting cricketer. Obviously it's not to Ponting, who remains convinced the match was played hard, fairly and properly.

He still does not realise how bad the situation has become, which is where the expert at dealing with children comes in. "Yes, Ricky, I know you won the Test, and it was very, very exciting. Yes, you were a very good boy for giving Michael Clarke a bowl right at the end. But, and this is the hard part, sometimes cricket is not all about winning. Your team was very naughty and now India are very, very upset."

Ponting does not believe it. "I don't think there is much, if any, animosity between the players on both teams," he said, showing his lack of grasp on the issue. "Sure, there was a lot of emotion flying around from our side and the Indian side at the end of the match. I'm more than willing to sit down and talk to Anil."




"Yes, Ricky, I know you won the Test, and it was very, very exciting. Yes, you were a very good boy for giving Michael Clarke a bowl right at the end. But, and this is the hard part, sometimes cricket is not all about winning. Your team was very naughty and now India are very, very upset"









In his column in the same paper titled "I did the right thing by the game", Ponting said everyone in the Australian team knows how important the spirit of cricket is to the way they play. Not on the evidence of the Sydney Test, with the contentious catching rulings, sledging, poor sportsmanship, persistent appeals on flagging umpires, and ungracious celebrations.

The Indian players would laugh at Ponting's suggestion over his team's attitude and his view on "running to the umpires". Ponting passed on the information about Harbhajan Singh's racist comment to Mark Benson and Steve Bucknor, which eventually led to Harbhajan getting a three-Test ban and the tourists considering going home.

"Anyone who knows me and the way I play will be aware I do not make a point of running to umpires and making complaints," Ponting wrote. After his aggressive exchange with an Indian journalist at the end of the Test, where he said anyone who doubted his integrity over catches should not be in the room, Ponting is losing credibility by the day. The only problem is it's only those outside the team who can see it.

Peter English is the Australasia editor of Cricinfo


http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/current/story/329708.html

good one too - apparently it's those in the team, and half those that post here
 

JJ

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Twizzle said:
lets not ban sledging

well, there's not really a need to - sledging is allowed in baseball - but they generally don't becuase they have respect for themselves, the game, and their opposition. When people do jaw, generally they are sorted out with a fastball high and tight, or simply get the sh*t kicked out of them -
 

JJ

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mickdo said:
Pfft. Plenty of sledging went on under Steve Waugh but you seem quite happy to use his opinion...

eh?? I don't value Waugh's opinion any more than anyone else's - just thought you might -- he's merely entertaining the possibility.

To his credit, when things got out of hand, he recognised there was an issue and fixed it - Ponting seems unwilling to accept that there is an issue
 

fish eel

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42,876
JJ said:
To his credit, when things got out of hand, he recognised there was an issue and fixed it - Ponting seems unwilling to accept that there is an issue

To Pontings credit, it had actually been a long time since the bahaviour of the Australian side was questioned.

Most people said they'd toned it down.

There were no issues at all in any test match this summer.

It only became such a big issue after Sydney because it was used to divert attention away from racism on the field.
 

JJ

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fish eel said:
It only became such a big issue after Sydney because it was used to divert attention away from racism on the field.

you keep telling yourself that
 

mickdo

Coach
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17,355
JJ said:
eh?? I don't value Waugh's opinion any more than anyone else's - just thought you might -- he's merely entertaining the possibility.

To his credit, when things got out of hand, he recognised there was an issue and fixed it - Ponting seems unwilling to accept that there is an issue
Perhaps because it's not his team that has been racially abusing an opposing player two tours in a row, or can only white people be racists now?
 

JJ

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fish eel said:
Brett Lee has matured and his on field behaviour has improved ten fold imo.

it has, and as stated elsewhere Stu Clark, Mike Hussey, Mitchell Johnson and Phil Jaques have done nothing wrong too

but on that, Lee has undergone a huge change, not only has his on field behaviour imporved, but his bowling is quite frankly like a different bowler - he used to be like Danny Morrison, now he more closely resembles Dennis Lillee (as a bowler)
 

Moffo

Referee
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23,986
fish eel said:
To Pontings credit, it had actually been a long time since the bahaviour of the Australian side was questioned.

Most people said they'd toned it down.

There were no issues at all in any test match this summer.

It only became such a big issue after Sydney because it was used to divert attention away from racism on the field.

i don't agree with that. symonds is a case in point, he was winding the indians up in india earlier this year
 

Twizzle

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Timmah said:


windupkong.jpg
 

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