Round 10 Vs Newcastle

[franklin2323]

Our pack won't fall over without him. That's not anything against him we've just developed a good core of props now.

Fish
Reg
Merrin
Leota
Hetherington
Ellis.

Then for me that is job done from him and Merrin.

 

[MrBlack]

Then for me that is job done from him and Merrin.

Agreed - 2 years ago that pack would have been fringe at best. Now we have probably the form pack in the NRL (with the Dragons)

 

[Pomoz]

These last bunch of comments are utter TOSH. I have heard the 'Forwards Leader', 'from a Winning culture' line trotted many times. Petero, Manu, Kite etc. Just like rebuild after rebuild after rebuild.

It is just flimsy rhetoric to justify (disguise) a poor value signing. There is no way on Gods earth that Tamou was worth $750K even based on the form he had when we signed him. His form has markedly dropped since then. Just because market value (mis-valuation) has inflated since then doesn't suddenly make the signing any better.

The fact is at the time we paid Elite Aussie Rep money, and got Above average first grade prop not even in consideration for Origin.

According to sources at the club (quoted in this forum. Help me out if you know who) he wasn't paid $750k, more like $500k and he got some TPAs.

Your point about mentoring and culture being 'Tosh' as you put it, isn't supported by all the evidence. There are numerous studies about the impact of a persons behaviour on the culture of a team and its performance. Change the behaviour, for example by having somebody like Tamou as a mentor, is a proven method for changing culture.

You maybe right that some players who were touted to have such a positive impact, didn't deliver. That is down to the individual not whether the methodology works. Civoniceva was such a signing. I saw no discernible difference in the culture at the Panthers when he was captain. Maybe Bennett knew what he was doing when he let him go.

 

[OldPanther]

According to sources at the club (quoted in this forum. Help me out if you know who) he wasn't paid $750k, more like $500k and he got some TPAs.

Your point about mentoring and culture being 'Tosh' as you put it, isn't supported by all the evidence. There are numerous studies about the impact of a persons behaviour on the culture of a team and its performance. Change the behaviour, for example by having somebody like Tamou as a mentor, is a proven method for changing culture.

You maybe right that some players who were touted to have such a positive impact, didn't deliver. That is down to the individual not whether the methodology works. Civoniceva was such a signing. I saw no discernible difference in the culture at the Panthers when he was captain. Maybe Bennett knew what he was doing when he let him go.

Ivan spoke on NRL 360 about this type of player being important so I'll take his word for it.

 

[mxlegend99]

According to sources at the club (quoted in this forum. Help me out if you know who) he wasn't paid $750k, more like $500k and he got some TPAs.

Your point about mentoring and culture being 'Tosh' as you put it, isn't supported by all the evidence. There are numerous studies about the impact of a persons behaviour on the culture of a team and its performance. Change the behaviour, for example by having somebody like Tamou as a mentor, is a proven method for changing culture.

You maybe right that some players who were touted to have such a positive impact, didn't deliver. That is down to the individual not whether the methodology works. Civoniceva was such a signing. I saw no discernible difference in the culture at the Panthers when he was captain. Maybe Bennett knew what he was doing when he let him go.

As opposed to the difference at Panthers between 2016 and 2017? Our culture last year was terrible.

We saw our captain dropped for breaking curfew along with Hiku and Blake. TMM forced out with all sorts of bullshit rumours. Cartwright had his off field drama. Blake and Hiku were dropped along with captain and so on. Last year was our least professional year since Gus first arrived and cleaned out the boys who couldn't handle the transition from Elliott to Cleary.

The real force behind our shift in culture was the club not taking shit from our players. Just like Ivan has done with Fonua. Griffin did last year by dropping guys who broke his rules. Hook/Gould pushed out or allowed alot of the guys who required extra attention to leave. Maloney and Tamou didnt change the culture. Moylan. Carty. Tmm. Hiku. Segeyaro. Etc. Leaving did. I aldo think the media attacking the team and our culture in the off season played its part in strengthening us.

Youre aldo being way yoo harsh on Petero. The culture while Petero was here was a result of a coach who was laid back and picked his favorite players and held no one accountable. While Petero was here he pumped out 20 hitups and 180m a game regularly. Mckendry and Grant were the best young front rowers in the game and our real issue was the trash halves we had at the time and a coach who picked his team for the season in Round 1. Only injuriesor susprnsion would change it.

Petero did struggle with the culture change when Gus and Ivan came on board. But he was the ultimate professional for us on and off the field while here. Not getting slong with Gus hardly makes him bad for our culture.

Like Tamou he probably wasnt worth what we paid at the time. Like 10% of our cap. But he was easily one of the top 3 front rowers while he was here. I dont think anyone could ever question his effort in any game he played.

 

[mxlegend99]

Ivan spoke on NRL 360 about this type of player being important so I'll take his word for it.

Ivan was referfing to guys brought in to fill a squad despite not being guys most teams would probably want in a top 17. Basically discards with experience.

Not star signings. His first years with us and Tigers he had a lot of signings who probably had literally no competition for their names. A few proved to be good vslue buys. Many are shit and hated by the fans. But the theory is these guys can cope with the losses while rebuilding and developing. Knights are rebuilding and developing eith the young guys... and thr process or rebuilding looks slightly better sith experienced discards.

Nothing matches the effectiveness and quickness of Roosters just cleaning out and buying new teams though.

 

[OldPanther]

Ivan was referfing to guys brought in to fill a squad despite not being guys most teams would probably want in a top 17. Basically discards with experience.

Not star signings. His first years with us and Tigers he had a lot of signings who probably had literally no competition for their names. A few proved to be good vslue buys. Many are shit and hated by the fans. But the theory is these guys can cope with the losses while rebuilding and developing. Knights are rebuilding and developing eith the young guys... and thr process or rebuilding looks slightly better sith experienced discards.

Nothing matches the effectiveness and quickness of Roosters just cleaning out and buying new teams though.

He did speak about culture. Particularly when talking about Packer.

 

[franklin2323]

He did speak about culture. Particularly when talking about Packer.

Yep. This is why Lillyman and Heighington got starts at Knights

 

[mxlegend99]

He did speak about culture. Particularly when talking about Packer.

Yesh not sure thsts the culture I would want at our club.

He's tough but grubby. Havent paid much attention to Packer this year. Maybe hes not a grub like he was last year. But Packer at Dragons was a dirty merkin out to hurt people and unlike JFH he was not sticking to doing it one on one in a legal tackle.

 

[OldPanther]

Yesh not sure thsts the culture I would want at our club.

He's tough but grubby. Havent paid much attention to Packer this year. Maybe hes not a grub like he was last year. But Packer at Dragons was a dirty merkin out to hurt people and unlike JFH he was not sticking to doing it one on one in a legal tackle.

I haven't paid much attention to him this year.

 

[Luke Bowden]

All the young forwards coming through (RCG, Fish, Kikau etc) have all heaped praise on Tamou, for his professionalism at training and his advice to them on the field.

It’s pretty clear that that he is having a positive impact on the team, even though you might not see it in the Stats section of NRL.com

 

[umina panther]

All the young forwards coming through (RCG, Fish, Kikau etc) have all heaped praise on Tamou, for his professionalism at training and his advice to them on the field.

It’s pretty clear that that he is having a positive impact on the team, even though you might not see it in the Stats section of NRL.com

Which could also be very easily taught by a forwards coach

 

[mxlegend99]

Which could also be very easily taught by a forwards coach

Or Trent Merrin. Tamou doesn't bring anything he doesn't bring.

Its not like we had no experienced forwards. Or like our forwards were shit before he got here.

 

[Abacus]

Which could also be very easily taught by a forwards coach

Of course! Why didn't we think of the forwards coach! You know, that 1 that is out in the trenches with them, making the tackles, getting beat up every week. Yes I'm sure these young up and coming forwards would really aspire to be like their forwards coach!

 

[OldPanther]

Of course! Why didn't we think of the forwards coach! You know, that 1 that is out in the trenches with them, making the tackles, getting beat up every week. Yes I'm sure these young up and coming forwards would really aspire to be like their forwards coach!

That's why you get aomeone who they'd respect. There has to be a retired forward we could use. Lang looks fitter now than when he played. He'd get them going.

 

[mxlegend99]

Of course! Why didn't we think of the forwards coach! You know, that 1 that is out in the trenches with them, making the tackles, getting beat up every week. Yes I'm sure these young up and coming forwards would really aspire to be like their forwards coach!

Trent Merrin is a premiership winning former International and Origin representative who is out there with the team.

He has done everything Tamou has done. And he has done our jersey proud tsmou hasnt brought anything to the team we either didn't already have or could have gotten for far less.

 

[Abacus]

Or Trent Merrin. Tamou doesn't bring anything he doesn't bring.

Its not like we had no experienced forwards. Or like our forwards were shit before he got here.

Tamou has achieved more than Merrin.

Who exactly are these experienced forwards and where are they now?

 

[umina panther]

Of course! Why didn't we think of the forwards coach! You know, that 1 that is out in the trenches with them, making the tackles, getting beat up every week. Yes I'm sure these young up and coming forwards would really aspire to be like their forwards coach!

Well no one is listening because they all run harder than him

 

[Luke Bowden]

Or Trent Merrin. Tamou doesn't bring anything he doesn't bring.

Its not like we had no experienced forwards. Or like our forwards were shit before he got here.

How would you know what any of them bring? Are you down at training? Do you spend time with team?

I’ll take RCGs word over yours.

 

[umina panther]

Tamou has achieved more than Merrin.

Who exactly are these experienced forwards and where are they now?

Well unless you rate playing for another nation other than your own (like Jim does) this is bullshit