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Round 23 - Rabbitohs vs Sharks: Saturday 5th August 7:35pm @Optus Stadium

Steenson123

Juniors
Messages
645
S
Don’t give up boys.The talent is there in the modern game going on a run of winning games can happen then suddenly winning falls into place
I still feel you guys will be there back end of the year and a real threat
STOP THE NONSENSE!! STOP BEING CONDESCENDING. This squad needs a New Coach Demetriou is dumb and he continually makes dumb decisions, erratic decisions. Further Penrith has Zero threat and YOU know it. So STOP THE NONSENSE.
What I would like to know is who is Penrith's Sports Scientist? I recall what Greg Lemond said during his arguments and legal fights with Lance. Lemond said..."these cocktails they make donkeys into Racehorses". Over to you Penrith taking rejects [Peachy & ??] and Reserve Grade players [Salmon??] and making them into stellar starters... let us all in on the secrets to doing this. And those that leave Penrith seem to be nowhere near as effective elsewhere.
 

Eric the great

Juniors
Messages
621
Just watching St George they’ll probably do the same as this time last year put 30 on us before halftime mose we’ll book holidays in September cause the footy not gunna be worth watching
 

Eric the great

Juniors
Messages
621
You don’t have to look at Penrith Cronulla had a couple of cup players last night that were made to look like seasoned first graders against our mob one scored a double
 

Steenson123

Juniors
Messages
645
Its time to gamble.
I would put Mitchell at Centre and make him Captain. Force Mitchell to earn his plaudits and get him constantly involved without running all over the place. Murray just has no presence, no force on others. He is No Captain material. Munro could be anything so play him at FB.
Season is virtually cooked anyway so there is little left to lose. Trouble is Demetriou is too rigid and not smart enough to make such changes. He plays too many slugs and hardly-has beens.
 

callmack1

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
12,155
I can't believe I put myself through it, but I watched the replay just before. Sometimes I watch the replay after a loss, take a step back and just analyse it and feel a bit better. However, that is certainly not the case for this game. I just feel worse. A lot worse. Absolutely crushed right now.

But I watched it, so here's my report,

Attack

Do I even bother talking about our attack? Because seriously, it was putrid for much of the game. Calling it putrid is putting it lightly.

Firstly, I'll talk about the game plan. It was really bad. Poor game plan, poor strategy, and poor execution. We played how we always do, with a very conservative style coming out of our own end. A lot of one-out hit ups and pretty boring Footy. This played right into the Sharks' hands, and they monstered us as a result. There was no plan B, no thinking on your feet to try things, not many shifts to try and generate momentum, we just had nothing. Much of the game was spent relying on errors from the Sharks and penalties to get us out of our half. Very poor.

Sometimes, this strategy works. We've seen it work for us many times. But the thing is, to make it work, you have to do all the one percenters right. Energy, attitude, aggressiveness, focus, effort in all areas. Our game plan relied on that. it was so disappointing to see there was none of that last night at all. The energy and effort was so friggin poor, I couldn't believe what I was watching. No punch at all. it seriously didn't look like the guys wanted to be there at all. They were simply going through the motions. Attitude was terrible. Absolutely appalling. Players should hang their heads in shame.

I don't know why we didn't try to actually play Footy earlier because look what happened in the last 16 minutes when we did! 16 points in 16 minutes. Cronulla struggled to handle us in this period to be honest. It looked pretty good at times. Unfortunately, despite the surge, we kept making errors which killed any chance of a comeback. but what gets me is why not do this earlier? Why wait until we're 26-0 down and the game is basically gone? It's so dumb. Absolutely infuriating.

The errors last night really hurt. Like the Broncos game, we were back to spilling our bundle a lot of the time. A massive 16 errors throughout the game to have a completion rate of 66% compared to Cronulla's 80%. bitterly disappointing and it reeks of a poor attitude as well. Destroyed any chances we had of winning in that comeback because as I said earlier, we were looking on but couldn't hold the bloody ball. It's becoming a trend in our losses, and I've had enough. Simply not good enough.

All this really poor stuff and that's before I've even talked about attacking their line. I really don't know what's happened to our attack. I thought Round 17 would be as bad as it gets but last night was even worse. just so out of sync which is very unlike us. Looked like the team had never played together. So friggin clunky, slow and not smooth. I don't know how else you can describe it. Diabolical is probably the right word. I don't know how many sets we wasted in this game. So poor. Yea, we turned it on a few times and scored some good tries, but for the most part it was just bog average.

Defence

Our efforts without the ball were equally as bad as the efforts with the ball.

I remember watching our first defensive set of the game and thinking, "we're on here, the boys are up for this," because it was great! Lots of intent shown, drove them back on a few tackles. We were right up in their faces and there was a lot of intensity. Good signs. However, that was literally THE ONLY set in defence during the whole game where we did that. From then on it just went downhill.

It was the same old shit that's been happening for the last ten weeks to be honest. Biggest thing for me was the line speed, or lack thereof. Where was it?? Non-existent. I kept an eye on it watching the replay and literally, for most of that game, the boys would come off their line a few steps, then just stop and wait for the ball carrier. Pretty obvious what's going to happen there. There was no intensity to get up in their faces, no effort. Far too passive. I can count a number of times two where a Sharks player would be dawdling sideways, yet our boys didn't come up and take him, they just sat back and let him carry on. So shit.

Our inability to stop the offload was another big killer. it has been for a while now, but it was really bad last night. 17 offloads the Sharks got. Yes, 17. Ridiculous stat. That killed us through the middle. Surely it can't be that hard to wrap up a ball in a conventional tackle? This is an attitude thing too.

Then there was our discipline in defence which was absolute dogshit. Constantly gave the Sharks a leg up, constantly gave them chances. God, it was dumb.

On top of all this, our first contact was poor and the edge defence, especially down the right side, was simply awful.

I'm embarrassed by the way we defended. Just like the attack, there's no heart and desire.
 

callmack1

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
12,155
Player by Player

This part of my review will probably be a lot shorter than usual. Not really much to go through and the boys have wasted enough of my time already this weekend.

Mitchell: I love Trell as much as anyone but jeez I'm so off him after last night. Really off him. If tried his best, but he had a bad game, I'd forgive him, but there is no excusing his performance last night. Lazy, inept performance. he did do some good stuff. A couple of good kick returns, the early try saver, had a good hand in AJ's first try and provided Munro with a couple of chances but that's it. Those are the only positive contributions he made all game. The rest of his time on the field was spent stinking it up and being lazy. He was so off in attack with some really poor passes. Only gets one official error on the stats but a few of the errors we made were because of him. Two of Munro's errors were because of shit passes from Latrell. He threw a terrible pass straight over the sideline with the game in the balance, and generally, he just failed to inject himself and look interested. His failed short dropout cost us two points. But for mine, there is three parts of the game from last night that really stand out and sum up Latrell's lazy, shithouse game. The first is his tackle attempt on Hiroti when they scored their first, pathetic. The next, and probably worse, is the effort he put into trying to stop Katoa when he scored. Trell was way too passive, didn't go to Katoa, he just sat back and waited, gave Katoa time and space. Then, once he's stepped, Trell doesn't even attempt to turn and chase, he just gives up. I'm aware he probably wouldn't have got there, but at least show some effort. The final bit that ticked me off was when Duncan and Murray made that break off the kickoff, Trell is in a position to provide some support but is seen jogging. Just jogging. Do you think someone like Tedesco would be doing that? No. So lazy and just summed up his night. I know I'm being hard on Trell here, but he deserves it. he deserves every bit of constructive criticism he cops. As I say, love him but I'm just so pissed off with him right now. You're our marque player and a superstar. We needed you to stand up, but you couldn't be bothered. Not good enough and I expect better.

Johnston: AJ went alright. His kick returns and hit ups were okay, made 91 meters, and his individual defence was pretty solid. Didn't get many opportunities until the last 16 minutes because of the way those inside him were playing but he did make some big plays in that period. Obviously, nice finish for his try. Then moments later he comes up with the highlight of the game. Streaking away down the sideline, showing some pace to burn Hynes, he then puts in a beautiful kick ahead for Lachie to score! That was a pretty amazing bit of play.

Tass: Tassy had a pretty good game, probably one of our best. He was one of the only guys out there where I'd really say he was trying and giving his all. Continually put his hand up and had a solid running game with 135 meters from 15 carries, put AJ away with some quick hands on Lachie's try and scored one himself to keep us alive. His defence was pretty good too, not a lot got past him, and he came up with some big tackles. Ramien and Katoa did score that long range try down their edge, but I do think Tassy did everything he could there, he covered and got to Ramien well to almost stop it, but it was just the brilliance of the opposition player that got the offload away. Tassy would have been one of our better players, he certainly put in.

Graham: Campbell put in and tried hard, but he didn't have a great game. I appreciated his carries out of the backfield, and he did still end up with a decent 117 meters, but he did get smashed on a lot of his runs. No real attacking opportunities although he was unlucky not to score that try from the kick. I'm not overly happy with his defence, I think he made it hard for Ty Ty as he came up with a few bad reads. Trindall's first try is Stretch's fault in my opinion. He fails to slide which is why Munro rushes in.

Munro: Definetly a rocks and diamonds game from the young fulla, a tough learning lesson for him. We can talk about what he did wrong and discuss it, but I'm not going to bag him. He's young and in his third game, errors are going to happen. But I'm convinced he's that good that he can be a superstar in a year or two. Firstly, he made five errors. That's pretty bad and not really up to first grade standard when you just look at the starts, but we do need to look at the context of these errors. Two of them, in my opinion, were Latrell's fault as they were bad passes that were tough to take, and one of them was when he was going for an intercept so you can't be too harsh on him there. However, I will say that errors such as just dropping the ball cold when you're in possession and streaking away are inexcusable. Disappointed with him in that one. However, it was great to see him get in the clear a few times and man, he looks like a prospect when he does. Very deadly. Defensively, he certainly struggled, some bad reads in there. This is a worry as he will get targeted now.

Walker: Another guy I'm really pissed off with after his performance. Bitterly disappointing. Another senior, superstar player you'd expect to stand up and lead in games like this, but it was the opposite for Cody. He was a passenger for much of the game. Did nothing! Nothing at all for about 54 minutes. He did come alive in our comeback and played a big part in that though. Firstly, great ball playing for AJ's try as he holds the ball up just long enough to commit three defenders which created that three on two for Latrell, he then had a great pass to create the overlap which led to Lachie's try. Great pass selection again to put Tass over with a ball straight across the face of Katoa. However, these efforts all came in the last 16 minutes when the game was gone. His contribution in the 54 minutes before that was simply not good enough. Very disappointing and I expect so much better.

Ilias: Certainly not great but certainly not bad, I'm not going to bag him for that game. I was mainly impressed with his attitude as he was one of the only players out there genuinely putting in. This is mainly emphasised on the Katoa try as Lachy comes from the other side of the field in an effort to stop it when no one else does. You can't fault his effort. However, he was largely ineffective for the large part of that game. Had a hand by starting movements for a few half chances but they ultimately came to nothing. His kicking game was okay. Just okay. Defence pretty solid though, apart from the effort on Hiroiti's try.
 

callmack1

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
12,155
Arrow: Went okay, he was pretty solid but probably not a standout game like he has had in the last couple weeks. Still 91 meters from 10 carries and was busy in the middle with 20 tackles. Gutted to see him get injured.

Cook: Poor game. I appreciate his work in defence through the middle, he was massive there once again with a huge 59 tackles but his work out of dummy half was pretty bad last night. No running game which is his main strength, and just way too indecisive attacking the line. He's mucking around too much and overplaying his hand. This killed a lot of our attacking plays. It's been the case with Cook for many weeks now. I'm over it.

Burgess: No real complaints with his performance from me. He wasn't outstanding but had a pretty solid game. Did his best. 120 meters gained. Found wanting a bit in defence for mine though, he missed a number of tackles. The charge from his 'high tackle' is BS.

Koloamatangi: Very poor game from Keaon. Got to say. I'm shocked when looking at his stats as he churned through a pretty massive 189 meters. However, just making meters isn't everything. I thought he was pretty awful in a lot of other areas of his game. Really lazy and showed a big lack of interest. His two errors were crap, especially the one after the Duncan/Murray break as that basically killed our chances of a comeback.

Chee Kam: Limited minutes, largely ineffective.

Murray: Not bad at all but struggled to really have an impact on the game. He gave 100% effort as always. 172 meters with his carries which is great, and he cleaned up so much for us in defence. I shudder to think what else could have happened in that game if he wasn't playing. I do have to say though, his discipline was pretty poor and I'm pretty shocked he's the most penalised player in the comp this year. Not really good enough from your skipper.

Moale: Far out he's gone backwards this year. Another game where he was barely noticeable.

Havili: Liva had a good knock, tried his best. Provided a bit of energy from the bench and maintained that energy throughout his stint. It's a shame more of the guys didn't have his energy.

Cartwright: Another guy off the bench who was barely noticed apart from the penalties he gave away.

Duncan: Great game Tallis! He's the only player, literally the only player in our side last night who really stood out and had a good game. Continues to show us that he's made for first grade. really strong carries, solid defence and he didn't put a foot wrong. The break he made off the kick off (once again) was amazing and breathed life into our comeback chances. I can't believe he didn't have more support though. 137 meters, no errors, 16 tackles with only two missed. Great knock. This kid needs to be in the side more often.

To be honest with you guys, I've been optimistic throughout this whole period. Even throughout all these losses, I always felt like we'd get our shit together when it mattered, and I always felt like we'd be okay. Well, I've gotta say, that feeling is now completely gone. All my optimism is gone and that is very unlike me who normally looks for positives.

This was a huge game. It was always going to be a telling game but I certainly didn't expect it to be telling in that way. It was probably always going to be Season defining and unfortunately, it turned to crap. I'm at a loss to explain how the boys turn up like that, or don't turn up should I say. We had everything to play for. A chance to take a big step forward towards the top four and play ourselves back into some form with a good win. Any team that is a Finals contender would turn up with some sort of intensity and will to win. Not us.

It's inexcusable and that's it as far as I'm concerned. I hate to say it, this hurts so much to even say but it's probably Season over. Even if we make the Finals, I can't see us going far in this current form. We're now looking like we might not even make it.

What the hell has happened? Seriously, this is probably the biggest capitulation I've ever seen from my team. Leading the comp after 11 Rounds, looking the best we have in years, looking nearly unstoppable, to this ten weeks later. How do you even explain that?

I'm crushed. I've haven't felt this way about a Regular Season loss in a long time. Shattered, devastated, gutted, angry, fuming, seething; none of these words even begin to explain it.

What the hell is happening?? Where do we go from here?? I don't know anymore.
 

Michael Matral

Juniors
Messages
492
S

STOP THE NONSENSE!! STOP BEING CONDESCENDING. This squad needs a New Coach Demetriou is dumb and he continually makes dumb decisions, erratic decisions. Further Penrith has Zero threat and YOU know it. So STOP THE NONSENSE.
What I would like to know is who is Penrith's Sports Scientist? I recall what Greg Lemond said during his arguments and legal fights with Lance. Lemond said..."these cocktails they make donkeys into Racehorses". Over to you Penrith taking rejects [Peachy & ??] and Reserve Grade players [Salmon??] and making them into stellar starters... let us all in on the secrets to doing this. And those that leave Penrith seem to be nowhere near as effective elsewhere.
Alright Steenson, I'll give it to you straight then (with the utmost of respect). You were right in your previous posts about your stars performing in Origin but not for JD. Cody, made 1 run for 4 metres..There it is...the magic ingredient...attitude. No, Penrith isnt getting magic cocktails to make them perform, it's their attitude to winning, playing for the coach, playing for the area, playing for each other, training harder and smarter, doing better than their upbringing suggested they would, all of those things. That's why, no names play like superstars when they come to Penrith, because they buy into the systems, the attitude, the effort required, are held accountable, and by proxy of these elements, they win more than they lose. James Fisher Harris and Moses Leota turn up to training early and do their own forward drills, then stay back after to work on 1%ers together, first to arrive, last to leave, that's why they are two of the best forwards in the comp. Souths have all the individual talent in the world, more than most teams in the comp, I just think JD might have lost the dressing room. If he (or someone elese) can get them back, you guys really will be a threat, and the rest of us teams know it.
 
Last edited:

Steenson123

Juniors
Messages
645
Alright Steenson, I'll give it to you straight then (with the utmost of respect). You were right in your previous posts about your stars performing in Origin but not for JD. Cody, made 1 run for 4 metres..There it is...the magic ingredient...attitude. No, Penrith isnt getting magic cocktails to make them perform, it's their attitude to winning, playing for the coach, playing for the area, playing for each other, training harder and smarter, doing better than their upbringing suggested they would, all of those things. That's why, no names play like superstars when they come to Penrith, because they buy into the systems, the attitude, the effort required, are held accountable, and by proxy of these elements, they win more than they lose. James Fisher Harris and Moses Leota turn up to training early and do their own forward drills, then stay back after to work on 1%ers together, first to arrive, last to leave, that's why they are two of the best forwards in the comp. Souths have all the individual talent in the world, more than most teams in the comp, I just think JD might have lost the dressing room. If he (or someone elese) can get them back, you guys really will be a threat, and the rest of us teams know it.
D'Accord that Demetriou should be sacked. He has failed with a good roster that most most NRL Coaches would lust for. A .500 Coach or a little better is never going to win anything. Demetriou has failed to set parameters during the season to get into the 1-2 spots where one needs to be to Win anything in NRL land.
Second, I cannot be fooled easily. I actually was one of the first to script letters to USADA in the early 2000s re Lance's incredible transformation from flat rider to mountain and contra-la-montre demon so please don't tell me stories about the extra training etc. Lance and his squad said exactly the same things "What am I on? I'm on my bike!" but Greg Lemond and David Walsh the Irish Investigative Journalist had other realistic theories. There were also US Journalists linking Brady's unbelieveable longevity to what Lance was doing, I mean playing up until almost 46??
What makes me ultra suspicious is how Coaches can insert a wide range of reject footballers, heck almost any calibre of player, including their Mother-In-Law and still stay at the top. Still dominate with players who would not help other clubs rise to the top. The question begs an answer: which players who departed Penrith [Api, Kikau, Staines, Burton, Naden, Laurie, O'Sullivan, Katoa, et al] have led their new club up toward the Summit? All these teams are struggling and have little to excite their depressed fans about. Gould even stated it will take the Bulldogs "years" to rise up, despite the influx of Ex-Penrith star players and Coaching staff. Yes the playing "system" helps improve them by making things simple and improving their individual on field cadence but realistically its the things we never hear of that likely dominate. All professional sports teams do it its a matter who has the most powerful gear.
Re Penrith. Do you really believe that a football club these days, under Salary Cap constraints, under roster duress, with many of its best departing continually, can stay at 19-20 regular season wins for 4-5 seasons or more as Penrith will do? Further, Penrith's F/A is astonishing, consistently keeping opponents to 12 points or less for 24 games LIKE ROBOTS its really beyond belief given the personnel they have lost. And no mass of critical injuries, save for 1-2 here and there. It takes a seriously committed believer to think that all this is simply the product of extra training or hard work.
 

Michael Matral

Juniors
Messages
492
D'Accord that Demetriou should be sacked. He has failed with a good roster that most most NRL Coaches would lust for. A .500 Coach or a little better is never going to win anything. Demetriou has failed to set parameters during the season to get into the 1-2 spots where one needs to be to Win anything in NRL land.
Second, I cannot be fooled easily. I actually was one of the first to script letters to USADA in the early 2000s re Lance's incredible transformation from flat rider to mountain and contra-la-montre demon so please don't tell me stories about the extra training etc. Lance and his squad said exactly the same things "What am I on? I'm on my bike!" but Greg Lemond and David Walsh the Irish Investigative Journalist had other realistic theories. There were also US Journalists linking Brady's unbelieveable longevity to what Lance was doing, I mean playing up until almost 46??
What makes me ultra suspicious is how Coaches can insert a wide range of reject footballers, heck almost any calibre of player, including their Mother-In-Law and still stay at the top. Still dominate with players who would not help other clubs rise to the top. The question begs an answer: which players who departed Penrith [Api, Kikau, Staines, Burton, Naden, Laurie, O'Sullivan, Katoa, et al] have led their new club up toward the Summit? All these teams are struggling and have little to excite their depressed fans about. Gould even stated it will take the Bulldogs "years" to rise up, despite the influx of Ex-Penrith star players and Coaching staff. Yes the playing "system" helps improve them by making things simple and improving their individual on field cadence but realistically its the things we never hear of that likely dominate. All professional sports teams do it its a matter who has the most powerful gear.
Re Penrith. Do you really believe that a football club these days, under Salary Cap constraints, under roster duress, with many of its best departing continually, can stay at 19-20 regular season wins for 4-5 seasons or more as Penrith will do? Further, Penrith's F/A is astonishing, consistently keeping opponents to 12 points or less for 24 games LIKE ROBOTS its really beyond belief given the personnel they have lost. And no mass of critical injuries, save for 1-2 here and there. It takes a seriously committed believer to think that all this is simply the product of extra training or hard work.
I'm a seriously committed believer I guess
 

assess5

Juniors
Messages
427
D'Accord that Demetriou should be sacked. He has failed with a good roster that most most NRL Coaches would lust for. A .500 Coach or a little better is never going to win anything. Demetriou has failed to set parameters during the season to get into the 1-2 spots where one needs to be to Win anything in NRL land.
Second, I cannot be fooled easily. I actually was one of the first to script letters to USADA in the early 2000s re Lance's incredible transformation from flat rider to mountain and contra-la-montre demon so please don't tell me stories about the extra training etc. Lance and his squad said exactly the same things "What am I on? I'm on my bike!" but Greg Lemond and David Walsh the Irish Investigative Journalist had other realistic theories. There were also US Journalists linking Brady's unbelieveable longevity to what Lance was doing, I mean playing up until almost 46??
What makes me ultra suspicious is how Coaches can insert a wide range of reject footballers, heck almost any calibre of player, including their Mother-In-Law and still stay at the top. Still dominate with players who would not help other clubs rise to the top. The question begs an answer: which players who departed Penrith [Api, Kikau, Staines, Burton, Naden, Laurie, O'Sullivan, Katoa, et al] have led their new club up toward the Summit? All these teams are struggling and have little to excite their depressed fans about. Gould even stated it will take the Bulldogs "years" to rise up, despite the influx of Ex-Penrith star players and Coaching staff. Yes the playing "system" helps improve them by making things simple and improving their individual on field cadence but realistically its the things we never hear of that likely dominate. All professional sports teams do it its a matter who has the most powerful gear.
Re Penrith. Do you really believe that a football club these days, under Salary Cap constraints, under roster duress, with many of its best departing continually, can stay at 19-20 regular season wins for 4-5 seasons or more as Penrith will do? Further, Penrith's F/A is astonishing, consistently keeping opponents to 12 points or less for 24 games LIKE ROBOTS its really beyond belief given the personnel they have lost. And no mass of critical injuries, save for 1-2 here and there. It takes a seriously committed believer to think that all this is simply the product of extra training or hard work.
Api helped Souths win a premiership in 2014, does that count?
 

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