Should it be 5/6 nations in future?

[bazza]

With the logistics of having this many teams in a comp and the associated costs it may be hard to do it every year. So we could do it every say, 4 years?


Give it a snappy name like the World Cup.


Sounds good. ;-)



Give the lower teams there own 4 nations comp, played at the same time. They could form part of double headers for promotional purposes and be given the opportunity to train with the bigger teams. Helping development.

A mid year Europe 4 nations would not work, but a SOO time Pacific comp could work. That way the NRL can take a break for a week or two.

Agree with this
I would like to keep the current 4N for a few more years at least and have an 8 team world cup
The emerging nations get to improve by playing in qualifiers for the 4N or the World Cup

 

[RedVee]

Agree with this
I would like to keep the current 4N for a few more years at least and have an 8 team world cup
The emerging nations get to improve by playing in qualifiers for the 4N or the World Cup

If there are only 8 WC spots what incentive is there for the emerging nations to play in these qualifiers?

 

[BrisbaneRhino]

RL needs to start promoting games more as events than just sporting contests - particularly where smaller teams are involved. When a small team gets smashed by Australia in the world cup, in RU its all about 'gallant underdogs' and 'what a great occasion'. In RL for some reason its 'not another dreadful mismatch'.

Much as you dislike RU, and can argue that the above isn't fair, its the way the games are reported.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Is there moves to promote Toulouse to Super League? The last I heard was that they have dropped out of the Championship back to the French domestic league. If they are being prepared for Super League post world cup then that is great news and France should definately be the 4th in a 5 Nations tournament permanently.

I don't think we should shut the door on Wales & PNG at the top table. They should qualify as 5th Nation through the Euro Cup / Pacific Cup as has been done in recent years.

If France are ready to expand their professional base then we should support them and within a decade we will start to see the makings of a genuine 4th threat in world rugby league.

Under this system Wales & PNG will continue to improve as well.

 

[Panfas]

As mentioned earlier, France should be the 4th team full time. They are the best country to rival the big 3. IF Toulouse get into the SL (or another city in France) it will help with additional development etc.

You could also hold a 2nd division Four Nations with PNG, Wales etc.

 

[WireMan]

If there are only 8 WC spots what incentive is there for the emerging nations to play in these qualifiers?

To qualify for the world cup?


Some of these games could be around the time of 4 nations. So for example Lebanon could of played Italy as the first game of a double header with NZ vs Aus from the other week. The players get exposure to a larger crowd, get to see how the best play, and it may make more of an impact in the RL world.

You would of got 13k people thinking 'wow, i didn't know they played league in that country, maybe our international game is actually growing'.

 

[WAPAU]

The current 4 nations is very similar to the original world cups.

I quite enjoy it but playing it every year takes away from the prestige somewhat and defiantly takes away from the prestige of the the world cup.

I'd actually like to see world cups played every 2 or 3 years. But scrap this current system where their are artificial teams in favour of just 5 or 6 top teams. Have them play round robin then 1 v 4, 2 v 3, then a grand final and 3rd playoff.

The first 4 would be the top 4 from the last world cup and the other 2 the highest qualifier from the euro and pacific cups. That way you have 2 competitively tiered international competitions leading into a grand world championship.

There seems to be this mind set that league has to have huge world cup like soccer or rugby, but there is not the international depth or interest to make such a tournament a meaningful exercise. But a smaller more regular and more elite world championship could work.

 

[siv]

Adding to this debate

All teams played one or two warm up games before they play the 4 Nations

Australia played PNG and NZ
England played France
Wales played France and Ireland
New Zealand were suposed to play Cook Islands and Australia

So it would not be hard for a 5th and 6th toeam to take part and act as 2 weeks of warm up matches

Round 1 could be

Australia v PNG
New Zealand v Wales
England v France

Round 2

Australia v France
New Zealand v PNG
England v Wales

Round 3

Australia v New Zealand
England v PNG
Wales v France

Round 4

Australia v England
New Zealand v France
PNG v Wales

Round 5

Australia v Wales
Enaglnd v New Zealand
PNG v France

 

[1 Eyed TEZZA]

Adding to this debate

All teams played one or two warm up games before they play the 4 Nations

Australia played PNG and NZ
England played France
Wales played France and Ireland
New Zealand were suposed to play Cook Islands and Australia

So it would not be hard for a 5th and 6th toeam to take part and act as 2 weeks of warm up matches

Round 1 could be

Australia v PNG
New Zealand v Wales
England v France

Round 2

Australia v France
New Zealand v PNG
England v Wales

Round 3

Australia v New Zealand
England v PNG
Wales v France

Round 4

Australia v England
New Zealand v France
PNG v Wales

Round 5

Australia v Wales
Enaglnd v New Zealand
PNG v France

This format would add an extra 2 weeks to the international competition which the players just do not want. The final would be played 2 weeks out from Christmas, its not feasible.

Another issue is the amount of dead rubber games. By the time round 5 starts, PNG v Wales (in your scenario) and probably one of the other matches in that round would be pointless. Let alone it would be too hard to sell those matches to networks and crowds in order to turn a profit, which (as much as people dont like it) is the most important thing for our international game right now.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Maybe long term it should remain 4 nations. But as mentioned by others in this forum in the past we should develop and increase the prestige of the qualifying tournaments:

ie:

MID YEAR

Euro Cup including England, France, Wales, Scotland & Ireland (top 2 to end of year 4 nations and rest to end of year RLEF Shield with Serbia, Italy & Lebanon)

and

Pacific Cup including Australia, New Zealand, PNG, Fiji, Tonga Samoa, Cook Islands (top 2 to end of year 4 nations and rest to end of year APRLF Shield).

END OF YEAR

4 Nations: England, France, New Zealand, Australia (for example)

RLEF Shield: Wales, Ireland, Scotland, Lebanon, Serbia, Italy (top 3 to contest mid year Euro Cup the following year bottom side to be demoted to RLEF Bowl)

APRLF Shield: PNG, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa, Cook Islands

Atlatic Cup: USA, Jamaica, Canada

RLEF Bowl: Germany, Ukraine, Russia (for example & winner to be promoted to following year RLEF Shield)

When I say ‘Long Term’ I mean this can happen on the back of the following and a lot of development work by the RLIF and associated continental Federations:

· RLIF has an international calendar in place (year in year out) and enforced international dates meaning that all clubs must release any player if selected to play for any RLIF member national team. This allows mid year and end of international windows.
· Eligibility laws to be sorted: you can play for a nation by birth, residency or parentage only – no exceptions
· The addition of at least one French team to Super League, addition of at least one New Zealand team to NRL, pathways in place for pro development for PNG, Scotland, Ireland similar to the Welsh pathway through Wigan (also any other nation of course that can achieve such an agreement)

 

[siv]

This format would add an extra 2 weeks to the international competition which the players just do not want. The final would be played 2 weeks out from Christmas, its not feasible.

Another issue is the amount of dead rubber games. By the time round 5 starts, PNG v Wales (in your scenario) and probably one of the other matches in that round would be pointless. Let alone it would be too hard to sell those matches to networks and crowds in order to turn a profit, which (as much as people dont like it) is the most important thing for our international game right now.

2 extra weeks would not be a issue as I saide nations were already scheduling these two extra games

In respect to the dead rubbers - we already have teams like France / Ireland / Scotland playing in parrallel to the 4 nations

So would PNG v Wales v France be dead rubbers when they play amoungst themselves - I would say not - as it would be a mini Tier 2 tri-nations

I reckon you would get pretty good crowds in France or PNG for these games