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The annual finals system debate thread

Which System ARL 95/96 or McIntyre

  • ARL 95/96 which the AFL use now

    Votes: 93 59.6%
  • McIntyre System

    Votes: 63 40.4%

  • Total voters
    156

yobbo84

Coach
Messages
10,881
Razor said:
And that's the case now. 2nd place win their first match. Lose their 2nd match. And they're out.

Exactly. 2nd place win week 1, go to week 2. Lose and you're out.
5th place lose week 1, go to week 2. Lose and you're out.

The fact people are even considering this system is a joke.
 

Raiders Plight

Juniors
Messages
962
yobbo84 said:
That system should NEVER be adopted unless it is tweaked.

No matter what the result is for teams coming 4th and 5th in week one, they go through to the Week 2.

If, say this season that was in place, and Brisbane come 4th.. tell me they wouldn't rest some key players in Week 1 of the finals?

but thats the major problem with the mcintyre system, if the 1st and 2nd place teams win the first week then the other 2 games are pointless as they will just switch opponents in week 2, win or lose.
 

yobbo84

Coach
Messages
10,881
Raiders Plight said:
but thats the major problem with the mcintyre system, if the 1st and 2nd place teams win the first week then the other 2 games are pointless as they will just switch opponents in week 2, win or lose.

Yeah, IF.. that's why the order of the games is important. 4 v 5 is first... 1 v 8 is last.. you don't know who plays who until the final match is over.

In the Ryan system, 4 v 5 know before their game, the result doesn't matter.
 

aussies1st

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
28,154
The main problem with the mcintyre system is that it doesn't really matter if you come 3rd on wards as you could still be eliminated. Ryan's idea gives more incentive for teams to finish in the top 4.
 

Surandy

Bench
Messages
3,190
mickdo said:
I still think the current AFL system is good. Not too complicated either...

Isn't the present AFL finals system the old ARL finals system?

Go to bigfooty and see how many AFL supporters like their system!
 

Meanie

Juniors
Messages
1,303
aussies1st said:
The main problem with the mcintyre system is that it doesn't really matter if you come 3rd on wards as you could still be eliminated.

Yeah but the likelyhood of it happening is very low, and it hasn't happened yet.
 

Stranger

Coach
Messages
18,682
aussies1st said:
The main problem with the mcintyre system is that it doesn't really matter if you come 3rd on wards as you could still be eliminated. Ryan's idea gives more incentive for teams to finish in the top 4.

Yeah because teams arnt currently trying to finish top 4:roll:
 

Meanie

Juniors
Messages
1,303
Surandy said:
Isn't the present AFL finals system the old ARL finals system?

Go to bigfooty and see how many AFL supporters like their system!

The AFL system's flaw is that 4th and 1st have exactly the same advantage.
 

Razor

Coach
Messages
10,077
yobbo84 said:
Yeah, IF.. that's why the order of the games is important. 4 v 5 is first... 1 v 8 is last.. you don't know who plays who until the final match is over.

Has the 8th placed team ever won?

No they haven't

In the Ryan system, 4 v 5 know before their game, the result doesn't matter.

There's no 4v5 match in Ryans finals

1 play 4. If 1 wins they get a week off
5 plays 8. If 8 loses they're out

So the matches mean something. Not like the current 4v5 match.
 

Misty Bee

First Grade
Messages
7,082
I think the current system is very good. It allows for a grading in week 1 of the top 8 sides - with games getting 'easier' the higher you get. The 2nd side gets a 2nd bite of the cherry. 3rd and 4th are relaitvely safe, but on a diminishing scale. 4th v 5th is a tussle. 6th, 7th and 8th have to prove their worth v top sides, with only 6th with a chance to lose, and not be eliminated.

Week 2 is where the Mac system gets it's critics, with the crossover. This is where a still alive 7th can play, say, the 5th placed team, while 4th cops the 2nd placed team. (this happens when 7 beats 2, and 4 beats 5 in week 1). BUt if 2 loses in week 1, they deserve to have a harder run. However, 4, as a reward for winning, plays 2, while loser 5 gets to play 7. That's the problem.

In comparison, Ryans system robs any advantage of coming second, as opposed to the top 4. In a top 8, I thinks it's fairer that 2 teams have a week off, rather than 1. Under Ryan's system, the team with the week off sits and recovers while another 6 teams battle it out. This give's it a big advantage to make the GF. Team 2, therefore, is little better of than the rest.

I like the fact that teams 1 and 2 have the double dip advantage, and by mathematics, 3 and 4 also have the chance. 5 and 6 can guarantee success by winning, with a slight chance of reprieve if 7 abnd 8 lose. And 7 and 8 need to prove themselves by winning against a gun side to enter the rest of the finals.
 

Meanie

Juniors
Messages
1,303
Razor said:
Has the 8th placed team ever won?

No they haven't



There's no 4v5 match in Ryans finals

1 play 4. If 1 wins they get a week off
5 plays 8. If 8 loses they're out

So the matches mean something. Not like the current 4v5 match.

Last years 4 vs 5 match meant nothing??
 

yobbo84

Coach
Messages
10,881
Razor said:
There's no 4v5 match in Ryans finals

1 play 4. If 1 wins they get a week off
5 plays 8. If 8 loses they're out

So the matches mean something. Not like the current 4v5 match.

Sorry not 4 v 5... i mean the matches involving 4th and 5th.. both these two teams can either win or lose their respective matches and will go to knock out round 2 regardless. It is stupid.
 

Misty Bee

First Grade
Messages
7,082
Ryan's idea gives more incentive for teams to finish in the top 4.

Teams are already trying to finish in the top 4. It's a primary objective of every club, because you have a chance of getting week 2 off if you win, and avoiding elimination if you lose.
 

Misty Bee

First Grade
Messages
7,082
Remember the eyar when Easts won everything and had to travel to Melbourne and Brisbane and play losers in the finals? FF sake we don't want that again!
 

Jono078

Referee
Messages
21,186
sullyfan said:
The McIntyre system is probably not perfect, but it does work pretty well I think.

I wont argue that. If not for the McIntyre system I would just want the good old knock out of:

1 v 8 - winner moves on
2 v 7 - winner moves on
3 v 6 - winner moves on
4 v 5 - winner moves on

winner of 1 v 8 vs winner of 2 v 7
winner of 3 v 6 vs winner of 4 v 5
Winner of 1, 8, 2, 7 vs winner of 3, 6, 4, 5 in Grand Final
 

Razor

Coach
Messages
10,077
Misty Bee said:
Teams are already trying to finish in the top 4. It's a primary objective of every club, because you have a chance of getting week 2 off if you win, and avoiding elimination if you lose.

It doesn't matter if you finish 3rd, 4th, 5th, or 6th

If you win, you can possibly get the week off.

If 1 and 2 both lose, then whoever wins the 3v6 and 4v5 matches will get the week off.

There's an incetive to get into the top 2, but no incentive to get into the top 4.
 

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