The Comic Book Film Thread *** SPOILERS ***

[shiznit]

What do movie roles have to do with privilege or oppression?

Just pointing out the hypocrisy that its apparently racist to complain about white characters being race-changed but the same people who cry 'racist' to the complainers have huge meltdowns themselves when a non-white character is cast as white. Where's the 'colour-blind casting' there? There's even a term for it - whitewashing, yet the opposite is apparently equality. Its double standards.

are you seriously too thick to understand the reasoning...

I’ll spell it out for you...

those ‘white roles’ your talking about are only white roles because when they were created the industry was racist and discriminated against people of colour or women.

Character’s like Blade and Black Panther were seen as B level characters created almost to appease those minorities.

When you consider how racist and sexist the industry was to seriously get your nose out of joint because a marquee role which was formally played by a white person is now being played by a black person is f**king hilarious.

then the same f**kwits try and justify it by using the example of the outrage over white washing makes it even funnier.

dipshits like you see it as discrimination because in your privileged life you’ve never truly seen discrimination before...

so to put it bluntly... basically you have no f**king idea what you’re talking about when you throw a tantrum about Idris Elba possibly playing James Bond or whoever...

 

[bileduct]

None of what you two have suggested compared to the meltdown over just Captain Marvel existing let alone having an actress who didn't know her place. But keep trying.

Captain Marvel? Was that the angry white male movie that was made for extreme far right incels who shoot up movie theaters?

 

[Valheru]

are you seriously too thick to understand the reasoning...

I’ll spell it out for you...

those ‘white roles’ your talking about are only white roles because when they were created the industry was racist and discriminated against people of colour or women.

Character’s like Blade and Black Panther were seen as B level characters created almost to appease those minorities.

When you consider how racist and sexist the industry was to seriously get your nose out of joint because a marquee role which was formally played by a white person is now being played by a black person is f**king hilarious.

then the same f**kwits try and justify it by using the example of the outrage over white washing makes it even funnier.

dipshits like you see it as discrimination because in your privileged life you’ve never truly seen discrimination before...

so to put it bluntly... basically you have no f**king idea what you’re talking about when you throw a tantrum about Idris Elba possibly playing James Bond or whoever...

Which characters were written as white out of racism?

James bond is white because Ian Fleming was white and also because the character is from f**king Scotland where 98% of people are white. I imagine that was even closer to 100% in the 50s.

 

[axl rose]

Best of luck to all you people seeing The Joker over the next few days. I hope you don't get shot or stabbed by incels!

I did notice children wearing face masks outside the cinema today. They could be for the new Angry Birds movie or would-be serial killers inspired by the Joker. Be careful out there.

 

[Generalzod]

https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...-the-snyder-cut-efforts-at-new-york-comic-con


https://screenrant.com/justice-league-movie-snyder-cut-dceu-critics/

I'll be eager to watch it.

 

[shiznit]

Which characters were written as white out of racism?

James bond is white because Ian Fleming was white and also because the character is from f**king Scotland where 98% of people are white. I imagine that was even closer to 100% in the 50s.

Are you serious??

if Ian Fleming originally made James Bond black I’m almost certain the books would not have been successful as they were.

and why do you think that would be??

If James Bond or Batman we’re written today there would be a much higher chance that they would be a person of colour or asian.

 

[Timbo]

Are you serious??

if Ian Fleming originally made James Bond black I’m almost certain the books would not have been successful as they were.

and why do you think that would be??

If James Bond or Batman we’re written today there would be a much higher chance that they would be a person of colour or asian.

What’s interesting is that when they made Felix Leiter into a person of colour - Felix Leiter also created by Ian Fleming in 1952 when the CIA was white as a ghost - no one complained.

I guess it’s cool when the character is on the periphery.

 

[Valheru]

Are you serious??

if Ian Fleming originally made James Bond black I’m almost certain the books would not have been successful as they were.

and why do you think that would be??

If James Bond or Batman we’re written today there would be a much higher chance that they would be a person of colour or asian.

There is a 0% chance that James bond would be black if Ian Fleming created him today.

Ian Fleming (a white man) created him after his own image. It has nothing to do with whether the books would sell and everything to do with the creator and where the character is from.

 

[bileduct]

There is a 0% chance that James bond would be black if Ian Fleming created him today.

Ian Fleming (a white man) created him after his own image. It has nothing to do with whether the books would sell and everything to do with the creator and where the character is from.

If Ian Fleming were alive today and wrote James Bond as a black guy he'd be roasted for racial appropriation and for not hiring a black author who understands the "person of colour" experience to write it for him instead.

 

[Matua]

To be fair to Bileduct... and I’m not one to defend him normally....

he actually pointed out a lot of the absurdity around it as it happened.

Yeah, I thought I remembered discussing it with bileduct so was surprised he went to the defensive well so quickly as I assumed he'd know I was discussing those same sort of whiners.

Springs09 I expected push back from as I just read his hissy fit about white supremacists on TV shows.

I'm not even in favour of changing Batman to a black man, I'd just like to see the meltdown, and despite what Springs and bile suggest the meltdown from that side on social media would far exceed anything going the other way.

Anyway, some whitewashing complaints are just silly. The absolute worst was people complaining that Emma Stone's character in Aloha wasn't played by an Asian actress. The character was written to be half white, 1/4 Asian and 1/4 Polynesian. I'm closer to that breakdown than an Asian actress.

 

[bileduct]

Yeah, I thought I remembered discussing it with bileduct so was surprised he went to the defensive well so quickly as I assumed he'd know I was discussing those same sort of whiners.

Sorry mate, there's so many people whining about the race and gender of characters in just about every single film released, so it's hard to know exactly which whiners you were talking about.

What I have noticed, though, is that the people whining about the wooden Brie Larson in the dreadful Captain Marvel seem to have formed their own little communities where they discuss this amongst themselves, have zero influence and are ridiculed by the mainstream media, whereas those who write about The Joker being an uber right wing white male incel mass shooter fantasy film are the mainstream media.

 

[Matua]

Sorry mate, there's so many people whining about the race and gender of characters in just about every single film released, so it's hard to know exactly which whiners you were talking about.

What I have noticed, though, is that the people whining about the wooden Brie Larson in the dreadful Captain Marvel seem to have formed their own little communities where they discuss this amongst themselves, have zero influence and are ridiculed by the mainstream media, whereas those who write about The Joker being an uber right wing white male incel mass shooter fantasy film are the mainstream media.

Honestly, there is also so many people whining about people whining about race and gender that it's just a big endless loop now.

TBF, with Captain Marvel and Joker neither side has had any influence really, they've both done strong box office.

 

[bileduct]

Honestly, there is also so many people whining about people whining about race and gender that it's just a big endless loop now.

Well yeah, I kinda hinted at that when mentioning that the people in their own little communities whining about Brie Larson and Captain Marvel are ridiculed by the mainstream media. It's almost as if.... they've figured out that writing articles about people whining about gender and racial bullshit and presenting their arguments in the worst possible way generates outrage and clicks. Considering how a lot of these articles often focus on some random idiot on twitter with only a few tweets to their name it wouldn't surprise me if some clever marketing people contracted by studios are generating this nonsense themselves and then alert the culture journalism shills (who suck massive studio cock) to generate free advertising.

I don't really care about gender/race flipping characters, unless it's done for "wokeness" points. The more studios and culture media shills talk about the "diversity" of an "all women" film, the less likely I am to see it on that basis alone. Battlestar Galactica by Ronald D. Moore was a pretty good example of how gender/race flipping can be done without "wokeness" bullshit.

I'd have no problem with a black or even a female of any colour 007. Black James Bond on the other hand? Pass. Then again, I don't really give a shit about Bond films, so they get a pass anyway.

 

[shiznit]

There is a 0% chance that James bond would be black if Ian Fleming created him today.

Ian Fleming (a white man) created him after his own image. It has nothing to do with whether the books would sell and everything to do with the creator and where the character is from.

Maybe you’re right... maybe he would have written him as white anyway.

but I don't think theres any doubt that he would be far, far more likely to write him as a black character in this day and age compared to in the 1950’s.

Putting Fleming aside...

If you were re-writing Batman today... the son of billionaire industrialists who’s expert in stealth and martial arts with amazing tech at his disposal...

kinda sounds more likely to be asian than white IMO...

 

[Springs09]

Maybe you’re right... maybe he would have written him as white anyway.

but I don't think theres any doubt that he would be far, far more likely to write him as a black character in this day and age compared to in the 1950’s.

Putting Fleming aside...

If you were re-writing Batman today... the son of billionaire industrialists who’s expert in stealth and martial arts with amazing tech at his disposal...

kinda sounds more likely to be asian than white IMO...

Creators of any race are more likely to create leading characters that match up with their own experiences, i.e. so many of Stephen King's characters are middle-aged white writers. It comes from one of writing's oldest sayings 'write what you know'. One of the main problems I have with race-swapping or gender-swapping is there is a lot of talk about the challenges and disadvantages certain races in certain countries go through every day, how much harder it is to grow up a certain race, the challenges women still face etc. which I believe of course - but isn't it then hypocritical to say race isn't important to this and that character? A black James Bond would have had a lot of different life experiences especially if this is 50s or 60s James Bond.

If anyone was creating Batman today I'd dare say Batman would be the same race as the creator. Also how is that last sentence not using racial stereotypes?

 

[Valheru]

Maybe you’re right... maybe he would have written him as white anyway.

but I don't think theres any doubt that he would be far, far more likely to write him as a black character in this day and age compared to in the 1950’s.

Putting Fleming aside...

If you were re-writing Batman today... the son of billionaire industrialists who’s expert in stealth and martial arts with amazing tech at his disposal...

kinda sounds more likely to be asian than white IMO...

It depends where the character is from and who created him.

Gotham being a fictional city based on NYC I would think white would be most likely. Granted, less likely than 80 years ago.

 

[shiznit]

Creators of any race are more likely to create leading characters that match up with their own experiences, i.e. so many of Stephen King's characters are middle-aged white writers. It comes from one of writing's oldest sayings 'write what you know'. One of the main problems I have with race-swapping or gender-swapping is there is a lot of talk about the challenges and disadvantages certain races in certain countries go through every day, how much harder it is to grow up a certain race, the challenges women still face etc. which I believe of course - but isn't it then hypocritical to say race isn't important to this and that character? A black James Bond would have had a lot of different life experiences especially if this is 50s or 60s James Bond.

If anyone was creating Batman today I'd dare say Batman would be the same race as the creator. Also how is that last sentence not using racial stereotypes?

i disagree... I think people in this day and age are less likely to write a character in their own image than in anytime in history.

And the asian batman example i used is certainly using racial stereotype’s... but i never hide that fact.

To me there’s nothing morally wrong using them in a positive way.

the problem with stereotyping is two fold...

1 - quite often it’s not factually correct.

2 - when it’s used in a negative fashion to put someone or a race of people down.

obviously that example was somewhat tongue in cheek to drive home a point but i wasn’t putting anyone down.

 

[T.S Quint]

If the color of a character’s skin has something to do with who they are and makes a difference to the story, then of course it should t be changed. You can’t make Black Panther a white man because his race is essential to his character.

There is nothing in Batman’s, James Bond’s or even Superman’s characters that makes it essential for them to be white. If they choose to change the race of those characters then I’m fine with it, as long as it’s a well written story within a good movie.

All that uproar over Michael B. Jordan getting cast as Johnny Storm was some of the most ridiculous stuff I’ve ever read.

 

[Mr Spock!]

Has anyone watched Doctor Who since he became a woman?

I haven't watched it since he became a hard to understand old scot.

 

[bileduct]

Has anyone watched Doctor Who since he became a woman?

I haven't watched it since he became a hard to understand old scot.

I haven't watched it since Peter Davison was the Doctor.