The De-Merge Thread

[Morotti]

Pre-merger St George had a winning percentage of 60% (Illawarra 40%)

Funnily enough St George Illawarra have a winning percentage of 50.8% and it would appear that this season we will fall on to the negative side of win-loss for the first time since pretty much the initial days of the merger's conception. Thanks Paul and Steve for that one!

These stats don't lie for mine - we are better off as St George. Call me a dreamer or call me what you will but there was a special something about the Red V of St George which the players of today don't or can't seem to appreciate.

There has been some disunity between Steelers and Dragons people causing a not-so-hidden turmoil at the board level manifesting greatly in woeful on field performance, abhorrent recruitment and some of the most inexplicable coach retention decisions the rugby league world has ever seen. To a lesser extent there seems to be a question mark over talented players wanting to live, train and commute between Sydney and Wollongong - be it justified or not.

It is 2021,100 years since the greatest club of all's birth and the only 100 I see coming up is the one on the scoreboard when we face the Roosters.

The NRL are looking to expand, and yes I realise that is in Brisbane. Call me crazy, but maybe we can get in V'Landy's ear about this one. Illawarra can reclaim their heartland and we can fight it out with the Sharks for survival. That battle alone would sure beat the soulless performances we have seen over the last 10 years. I would take the road that Souths went down even if it meant pain/relegation for long term success. Look at the result today, look at the way the Bunnies have lived on. Even if we lost and were kicked out, they could never have a real comp without us. We'd be back.

Sorry Steelers but our identity has been clouded, and quite frankly something big needs to change.

Using the winning percentage for the whole time of St. George Dragons' history may not be looking at the issue correctly. When we won 11 in a row, I would expect our winning percentage was extremely high.

Better to break it down into eras or decades. Because for all you know, the winning percentage may have been 85% when we won the last of our 11 only to slowly go down to 60%. And if you take say from 1980 onwards, what was it then until 1999?

 

[Walpole]

So, if there's a "de-merge" which area gets the NRL franchise? The suburb in Sydney that's in close proximity to two other NRL teams or the region on the South Coast of NSW with a 300,000+ population?

 

[Old Timer]

So, if there's a "de-merge" which area gets the NRL franchise? The suburb in Sydney that's in close proximity to two other NRL teams or the region on the South Coast of NSW with a 300,000+ population?

Interesting question however if I remember correctly the area on the south coast with the 300,000 actually folded like a cheap suit and were the catalyst for all of this.

It has its golden opportunity to be the “promised land” but somehow managed to remain in the wilderness so why would you give it another shot especially in the knowledge that it’s benefactor continually sits on his hands?

 

[SBD82]

Interesting question however if I remember correctly the area on the south coast with the 300,000 actually folded like a cheap suit and were the catalyst for all of this.

It has its golden opportunity to be the “promised land” but somehow managed to remain in the wilderness so why would you give it another shot especially in the knowledge that it’s benefactor continually sits on his hands?

I’m against dissolving the JV.

But if it meant ending my association with some of the old school Dragons supporters that dribble shit like this?

It might just be worth it.

 

[thebigredv]

Using the winning percentage for the whole time of St. George Dragons' history may not be looking at the issue correctly. When we won 11 in a row, I would expect our winning percentage was extremely high.

Better to break it down into eras or decades. Because for all you know, the winning percentage may have been 85% when we won the last of our 11 only to slowly go down to 60%. And if you take say from 1980 onwards, what was it then until 1999?

I'm not picking stats to suit myself. Those are the overall plain hard facts.

They would have been a lot prettier prior to McGregor (and Price), someone who I personally called to be sacked for 5 long years. Instead the St George Illawarra board did what was easiest rather than necessary and we wound up here.

The win/loss stats are less important than the stench of our club, the sad board who couldn't organise a chook raffle and the meagre defeated way our players go around, without fail. The same inept efforts, the same errors, no accountability, 'time will fix all'.

 

[muzby]

I'm not picking stats to suit myself. Those are the overall plain hard facts.

Speaking of plain hard facts, here are some more:


De-merge the teams. Give the licence to Illawarra as clearly Kogarah is a wasteland.

 

[thebigredv]

So, if there's a "de-merge" which area gets the NRL franchise? The suburb in Sydney that's in close proximity to two other NRL teams or the region on the South Coast of NSW with a 300,000+ population?

I suggest any club ie St George, Cronulla or Illawarra state their case and see what v'landys and co think. At least he has a bit of imagination and has rugby league interests at heart.

Somehow, when all is said and done, St George will live on. Maybe that is just a romantic thought I have but dragons fans are spread far and wide and there would be enough support ultimately to bring them back - then again maybe not, it's a risk. I don't pretend to know all the specifics of what it means to keep a club afloat but I think I'd rather be like a Bears fan now than watching this putrid establishment ruin what was the best thing about sporting life once upon a time. I bet South's are happy they went it alone. Aren't the St George Dragons as integral to this game than the Bunnies?? Oh that's right it's our 100th season and you would barely even know it.

 

[Morotti]

Speaking of plain hard facts, here are some more:
View attachment 46260 View attachment 46261

De-merge the teams. Give the licence to Illawarra as clearly Kogarah is a wasteland.

what is the total games played at each location? That would give a percentage for wins and be better than overall wins.

 

[Morotti]

I'm not picking stats to suit myself. Those are the overall plain hard facts.

They would have been a lot prettier prior to McGregor (and Price), someone who I personally called to be sacked for 5 long years. Instead the St George Illawarra board did what was easiest rather than necessary and we wound up here.

The win/loss stats are less important than the stench of our club, the sad board who couldn't organise a chook raffle and the meagre defeated way our players go around, without fail. The same inept efforts, the same errors, no accountability, 'time will fix all'.

What I meant is that St George Dragons were extremely successful during our 11 year run. So be interested to know the stats from 1980.

 

[Old Timer]

I’m against dissolving the JV.

But if it meant ending my association with some of the old school Dragons supporters that dribble shit like this?

It might just be worth it.

I made no reference to the JV's value I merely offered some insight in response to a question in a post by Walpole?

So exactly what part of my post is "dribble shit" as you put it?

The Illawarra region via the Steelers were in the NRL, went broke and folded and for them to survive in any form the NRL said they had to look for a partner.

They folded once, what is to say that it wouldn't repeat itself as they have form in not surviving as a stand alone entity?

By all means inform me of what exactly the Illawarra benefactor namely the Gordon family have done to enhance the club?

 

[Morotti]

So, if there's a "de-merge" which area gets the NRL franchise? The suburb in Sydney that's in close proximity to two other NRL teams or the region on the South Coast of NSW with a 300,000+ population?

Again, more than one metric to judge what will produce success. For example, Sydney has a population of 5.3M vs 8 Sydney teams. Split it between 8 then we have 662,500 per team, double what the Illawarra is per your note. And you can chop it per area of Sydney etc etc. But then also you get more cross over supporters from others Sydney teams attending games if you are based in Kogarah. But also this can be useless. I don't see this as a metric for success but it is something that should be part of the conversation.

The main issue we have is board of directors and senior management.

 

[Old Timer]

I suggest any club ie St George, Cronulla or Illawarra state their case and see what v'landys and co think. At least he has a bit of imagination and has rugby league interests at heart.

Somehow, when all is said and done, St George will live on. Maybe that is just a romantic thought I have but dragons fans are spread far and wide and there would be enough support ultimately to bring them back - then again maybe not, it's a risk. I don't pretend to know all the specifics of what it means to keep a club afloat but I think I'd rather be like a Bears fan now than watching this putrid establishment ruin what was the best thing about sporting life once upon a time. I bet South's are happy they went it alone. Aren't the St George Dragons as integral to this game than the Bunnies?? Oh that's right it's our 100th season and you would barely even know it.

When our club voted Souths out of the comp we showed no empathy for those that formed the very roots and foundations of the code.

They toughed it out and whilst certainly not back to the level of their former greatness they certainly have a clear and viable future.

We capitulated to the threats of the NRL and now have only uncertainty and cloudy skies.

In fact we are treated with contempt by the NRL and our opposition so far have we fallen.

 

[SBD82]

I made no reference to the JV's value I merely offered some insight in response to a question in a post by Walpole?

So exactly what part of my post is "dribble shit" as you put it?

The Illawarra region via the Steelers were in the NRL, went broke and folded and for them to survive in any form the NRL said they had to look for a partner.

They folded once, what is to say that it wouldn't repeat itself as they have form in not surviving as a stand alone entity?

By all means inform me of what exactly the Illawarra benefactor namely the Gordon family have done to enhance the club?

Utter. f**king. Dribble.

 

[Morotti]

I suggest any club ie St George, Cronulla or Illawarra state their case and see what v'landys and co think. At least he has a bit of imagination and has rugby league interests at heart.

Somehow, when all is said and done, St George will live on. Maybe that is just a romantic thought I have but dragons fans are spread far and wide and there would be enough support ultimately to bring them back - then again maybe not, it's a risk. I don't pretend to know all the specifics of what it means to keep a club afloat but I think I'd rather be like a Bears fan now than watching this putrid establishment ruin what was the best thing about sporting life once upon a time. I bet South's are happy they went it alone. Aren't the St George Dragons as integral to this game than the Bunnies?? Oh that's right it's our 100th season and you would barely even know it.

Similar to the bears, if the Dragons were to go then I think they would live on but you would eventually lose the main group of supporters as they would die. The Bears will suffer this soon. So I would think the Dragons would continue to have strong support if they were to leave the NRL but ultimately it will wane eventually.

 

[2012....Sharks Year]

Speaking of plain hard facts, here are some more:
View attachment 46260 View attachment 46261

De-merge the teams. Give the licence to Illawarra as clearly Kogarah is a wasteland.

Think some of the Dragons fans have their heads on the sand as to what they provide to the venture. Gordon paid up 6 million in debts to the NRL last year and the Illawarra provides a healthy junior nursery. The Dragons provide a long term disfunctional board... an antiquated leagues club and virtually no juniors. It would be insane for the Dragons supporters to suggest a demerger.... they would be dead on the water without the Illawarra input. While I respect that the Dragons provide a long and proud history to the merger.... unfortunately that doesn’t pay the bills or provide juniors.

 

[BestHookerRein]

Yeah I agree with this thread completely.

The sooner that the entities are separated, the quicker Illawarra can go to reclaiming its spot as an NRL Heavyweight.

St George can be our NSW Cup team, much like Newtown to Cronulla

 

[Old Timer]

Utter. f**king. Dribble.

LOL by all means refute it.

Face the true reality the Illawarra region were nothing more than feeder of good quality players to many other clubs.

When given the opportunity to keep its local high quality players and turn them into a highly competitive NRL team it failed miserably and there was a continued exodus of the best players of their region to other clubs.

You were considered unattractive then and we remain unattractive now as a result of that.

For all the riches of your own area and all the boasting of the likes of you, muzby and others you achieved SFA when given a golden opportunity to do so.

Would of, should of, could of is the catch cry of the Illawarra but the reality is "didn't".

 

[muzby]

what is the total games played at each location? That would give a percentage for wins and be better than overall wins.

I’ll track that chart down..

% wins were better at WIN too IIRC..

 

[The Axe of Druss]

Oh that's right it's our 100th season and you would barely even know it.

Probably because its not. St George ended as a top grade team in 1998

 

[thebigredv]

Speaking of plain hard facts, here are some more:
View attachment 46260 View attachment 46261

De-merge the teams. Give the licence to Illawarra as clearly Kogarah is a wasteland.

St George are a more successful entity than Illawarra. Maybe just face the facts.

Probably because its not. St George ended as a top grade team in 1998

And it marks the day that the club's soul died.