The Origin Black Mail - Is it even legal?

[Springs]

It has to be black and white in some aspects or you continue to end up with ridiculous selections of players that didn't belong there.

If you're English, your Origin isn't Queenslander, it's England.

How is Jack Reed not a Queenslander? Are you serious? He has spent his entire life there. He is a Queenslander. Being born in England and his heritage being from England also means he is English.

Anthony Milford is Samoan, does that mean his 'origin' isn't Queensland? :crazy:

I know exactly how the rules work, thanks. Still doesn't make the Keary situation any less of a farce.

 

[WellsNZ]

How is Jack Reed not a Queenslander? Are you serious? He has spent his entire life there. He is a Queenslander. Being born in England and his heritage being from England also means he is English.

Anthony Milford is Samoan, does that mean his 'origin' isn't Queensland? :crazy:

I know exactly how the rules work, thanks. Still doesn't make the Keary situation any less of a farce.

He's not a Queenslander because he was born in England and elects to represent England.

Pretty simple.

Evidently you didn't or you would have understood the Keary situation properly instead of thinking it just came down to one thing.

 

[WellsNZ]

Do you understand what Origin is, why it exists and how it became what it is today? It's an absolutely outdated concept from a time before a national RL competition existed in Australia, based on the idea that players from Queensland would be signed up by the richer clubs in the NSWRL Premiership. Realistically it hasn't been relevant since the late 80's, but considering the nature of the sport and demographics in 2014 it's just absolutely absurd.

As it stands, it's a game between people from NSW and people from Queensland. Pretty simple concept and far from an outdated one.

Two areas playing sport to determine which is better, outdated indeed :lol:

f**k me the bleeding hearts around here.

 

[The Great Dane]

Origin is where you played your first football - so that is what qualified them. It is feasible now that a player born in Melbourne coming through the Storm junior ranks would not qualify etc.

I understand your frustration, but being born and raised in the ACT and playing their first 1st grade footy in the ACT never stopped Clyde, Dugan, Monaghan, etc from playing SOO.

NSW and Queensland will push the rules as far as they can to get players, the only way to stop that is to have rules that are completely black and white, that the players and coaches have absolutely no say in.

How is Jack Reed not a Queenslander? Are you serious? He has spent his entire life there. He is a Queenslander. Being born in England and his heritage being from England also means he is English.

It's pretty simple, you can't be a Queenslander if you're not an Australian and you can't be an Australian if you're an Englishman, so Jack Reed had to choose if he was a Pom or an Australian.

Turning SOO into an (even more) farcical event where people claiming to be Kiwi's or Poms can run around playing for NSW or Queensland isn't the answer, as that would kill SOO and killing SOO would cut the amount that the NRL's TV rights are worth almost in half, which be a massive hit to RL as a whole.

The answer is to have a stricter set of eligibility rules for both internationals and SOO, that literally decide what teams a player is eligible to represent for him/her.

 

[deal.with.it]

If minnow nations would simply choose players who are either 100% committed to them over origin/Australia
OR
Pick players who don't qualify for origin i.e. players who player their first game of RL in NSW/QLD after the age of 13(?), then such a mess wouldn't happen.

Yes our world is more multicultural then ever, but we need some black and white in international sport, or you'll end up having an international sport that resembles International Rules Football (AFL) rather than Rugby Union.

 

[ek999]

Do you understand what Origin is, why it exists and how it became what it is today? It's an absolutely outdated concept from a time before a national RL competition existed in Australia, based on the idea that players from Queensland would be signed up by the richer clubs in the NSWRL Premiership. Realistically it hasn't been relevant since the late 80's, but considering the nature of the sport and demographics in 2014 it's just absolutely absurd.

From Origin last year Queensland used 9 players from Queensland teams and NSW used 2. To say it is outdated is completely wrong. A NSW Residents team would thrash a Qld residents team this year.

 

[Evil Homer]

As it stands, it's a game between people from NSW and people from Queensland. Pretty simple concept and far from an outdated one.

Two areas playing sport to determine which is better, outdated indeed :lol:

f**k me the bleeding hearts around here.

It's clearly not just a contest between 'people from NSW and people from Queensland', that is not what the eligibility for Origin is. If the rules were the same as international rules (birth, parents' birth or residency) then there would be less confusion. As it is, there's no reason a player committed to another country cannot also qualify to play Origin, apart from the farcical demand for Australian declaration that the ARL impose.

The contest is State of Origin, not Queenslanders vs NSWelshman. Overseas players can qualify regardless of whether they are born-and-bred statesmen or not, and when you've got the likes of Stuart and Meninga actively trying to rope Kiwi ringers into their sides then you can't really claim any integrity for the competition at all.

 

[Evil Homer]

From Origin last year Queensland used 9 players from Queensland teams and NSW used 2. To say it is outdated is completely wrong. A NSW Residents team would thrash a Qld residents team this year.

Understandable considering that there are far more NRL clubs in NSW than Queensland. But the integration of Qld clubs into the NSWRL competition and later the establishment of a national competition pretty much undermined the need for Origin.

 

[ek999]

It's clearly not just a contest between 'people from NSW and people from Queensland', that is not what the eligibility for Origin is. If the rules were the same as international rules (birth, parents' birth or residency) then there would be less confusion. As it is, there's no reason a player committed to another country cannot also qualify to play Origin, apart from the farcical demand for Australian declaration that the ARL impose.

The contest is State of Origin, not Queenslanders vs NSWelshman. Overseas players can qualify regardless of whether they are born-and-bred statesmen or not, and when you've got the likes of Stuart and Meninga actively trying to rope Kiwi ringers into their sides then you can't really claim any integrity for the competition at all.

Absolutely, remove that and International Rugby League would be a hell of a lot stronger

 

[roughyedspud]

Unlike Mead, Milford was born and raised here. Nice try.

milford also chose to play for samoa...

milford is now likely to be in the international wilderness for years just so he can play origin....

fiji have lost the services of uate (again) just so he can play origin...

tonga lost the services of feleti meteo for not even playing origin but just f**king thinking about it !!!!...


correct me if im wrong but theres not one player in the kangaroo test team for fridays test that has followed the "islander international,origin,kangaroo player" path..

and theres only been Uate the the last 5 years..

so why not remove australian eligibility from origin?? it clearly has zero effect on the test team..

 

[WellsNZ]

It's clearly not just a contest between 'people from NSW and people from Queensland', that is not what the eligibility for Origin is. If the rules were the same as international rules (birth, parents' birth or residency) then there would be less confusion. As it is, there's no reason a player committed to another country cannot also qualify to play Origin, apart from the farcical demand for Australian declaration that the ARL impose.

The contest is State of Origin, not Queenslanders vs NSWelshman. Overseas players can qualify regardless of whether they are born-and-bred statesmen or not, and when you've got the likes of Stuart and Meninga actively trying to rope Kiwi ringers into their sides then you can't really claim any integrity for the competition at all.

Umm, yes, that is what it is, and that is what the criteria set out to enforce, that either you were born there, OR, lived there during your formative years. If you meet that criteria, then you can "choose" that as your "origin", or you can choose to represent your other "origin" instead. But you don't get to pick both. It's that simple. You don't just get to pick each origin whenever it suits you. If you are a Queenslander, you are Australian, makes sense given that Queensland is in Australia.

Yes, because International rules really clear everything up when you've got guys playing for multiple countries throughout their careers :crazy:

How can you say "the contest is State of Origin "not Queenslanders vs NSWelshman" lol, it's the same bloody thing.

They changed the criteria to address the issues you mentioned with Kiwis getting lured in etc. You're arguing about things that have already been addressed, and they were addressed in large part because people were crying out about it damaging the integrity of the contest and it's degradation into "State of Option". They already actioned on that so there's not much point in you complaining about it now.

 

[roughyedspud]

they changed the rules yes...


but now a kid born and bred in the act,vic,SA,WA & NT isn't eligible for origin but a kid born anywhere in the world that moves to NSW or QLD before hes 13-14 years old can play origin...

 

[ek999]

A kid born and bred in the ACT, Vic, SA, WA & NT has no connection to NSW though (well except maybe ACT, I think they may be able to play for NSW as they are part of CRL). A kid that moves to NSW or Qld before he is 13 does

 

[roughyedspud]

but how can the ARLC demand players be eligible for australia to play origin when even australians aren't eligible for origin!


that alone should preclude origin from being relevent to international RL

 

[WellsNZ]

but how can the ARLC demand players be eligible for australia to play origin when even australians aren't eligible for origin!


that alone should preclude origin from being relevent to international RL

Ummmm because those Australians aren't from Queensland or NSW?

 

[roughyedspud]

so why can players play for australia but not origin....and not allowed to play origin but not australia




can't have it both ways

 

[madunit]

Origin is where you played your first football - so that is what qualified them. It is feasible now that a player born in Melbourne coming through the Storm junior ranks would not qualify etc.

Good to see you learning.

 

[WellsNZ]

so why can players play for australia but not origin....and not allowed to play origin but not australia




can't have it both ways

because not all Australian's are Queenslanders or New South Welshmen? some are from Victoria, ACT etc, not that hard to figure out that one mate.

 

[roughyedspud]

it is when its impacting international RL

 

[roughyedspud]

if origin was a genuine kangaroo trial and out of state players where able to elect a state to play for then the ARLC has every right to demand players be eligible for australia...


but them are'nt the rules are they....the rule actively discriminates against AUSTRALIANS


seriously if they got taken to court the ARLC would lose hands down