The Rumours Thread

[NRLMad]

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/subscribe/news/1/?sourceCode=DTWEB_WRE170_a_GGL&dest=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailytelegraph.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Fnrl-2023-the-six-years-of-blunders-that-set-st-george-illawarra-up-for-failure%2Fnews-story%2Fc8a7eb2cbae76d178cbcc168f8d76b29&memtype=anonymous&mode=premium&BT=sport

Can anyone help with this pay wall Telegraph report please?

It was once ranked up with the greatest brands in Australian sport.


Now it’s time for the St George Illawarra Dragons to put up or shut up and show long suffering fans they have finally turned the corner.


Because right now this is a club viewed as a graveyard for rugby league talent.


After another off-season marred by controversy, backed up by a shocking Charity Shield performance, Aaron Woods came out and declared it was time to “get our shit in order”.


Well, here’s their chance, starting with Sunday’s first up clash against Gold Coast Titans.

HOW THE RED V BECAME A LAUGHING STOCK


Let’s go back over the last six years and dissect the Dragons’ recruitment and retention strategy since Ben Hunt arrived in 2018.


That was also the last year the Dragons made the finals.


Where the Dragons are today is a sad reflection of what the mighty Red V once stood for.


When famous names like Raper, Langlands, Provan and Gasnier became Immortals.


Today it’s a recruitment and retention policy that has become the laughing stock of the game.


At least this year Wests Tigers have signed Api Koroisau, Isaiah Papali’i and John Bateman to give their fans new hope.


Meanwhile, the Dragons bank on lesser knowns like Jacob Liddle and Zane Musgrove from the Tigers, and Ben Murdoch-Masila from the Warriors, to make the difference to a squad that missed the finals last year.


While Liddle will add much needed dummy half spark, it hardly fills you with any great confidence as off-contract coach Anthony Griffin fights to save his job.


Will they prove us wrong? Here’s why history is against them.


SEASON 2018


GAINS: James Graham, Ben Hunt, Jeremy Latimore, Luciano Leilua, Zac Lomax, Darren Nicholls, Jordan Pereira, Reece Robson


LOSSES: Josh Dugan, Will Matthews, Russell Packer, Joel Thompson, Kalifa Faifai Loa, Josh McCrone, Jake Marketo, Taane Milne


FINISHED: 7th


ROSTER RATING: B


The Dragons paid overs for Hunt initially but he came as a grand final halfback and has well and truly earned his keep in the years since, it’s just a shame more around him don’t always play with as much passion.


Graham was another positive signing, a bit long in the tooth at that point, but you again can’t question the champion prop also did his absolute best to try and change the culture.


That year under Paul McGregor they were equal competition leaders up until round 20 but scored just four wins in their final 11 games with several key players struggling with injuries.


Despite that they made it to week two of the finals where they went down fighting 13-12 to the Rabbitohs. They’d kill for that result this year.

 

[NRLMad]

SEASON 2019


GAINS: Mitchell Allgood, Jackson Ford, Josh Kerr, Corey Norman, Lachlan Maranta, Patrick Kaufusi, Jonus Pearson, Mikaele Ravalawa, Korbin Sims, Tristan Sailor, Jason Saab


LOSSES: Leeson Ah Mau, Nene McDonald, Kurt Mann, Jason Nightingale, Hame Sele


FINISHED: 15th


ROSTER RATING: E


This was the year it really started to unravel. They bought Norman from Parramatta who went from an $850,000 marquee man to basically unemployable within three years.


As for the season, it was a train wreck from the moment de Belin was stood down in February. It didn’t help losing Widdop to a shoulder injury in round three.


But even though they still had five Origin players (Norman and Hunt for Queensland along with Frizell, Vaughan and Tariq Sims for the Blues) they could only manage to finish one place off the bottom of the ladder, their worst finish since the joint venture was formed.

 

[NRLMad]

SEASON 2020


GAINS: Eddie Blacker, Billy Brittain, Adam Clune, Kaide Ellis, Max Feigai, Tyrell Fuimaono, Issac Luke, Trent Merrin, Cody Ramsey, Jayden Sullivan, Brayden Wiliame


LOSSES: Jai Field, Luciano Leilua, Jonus Pearson, Reece Robson, Gareth Widdop, Mitchell Allgood,, Patrick Kaufusi, Jeremy Latimore, Lachlan Maranta, Darren Nicholls


FINISHED: 12th


ROSTER RATING: D


Another season marred by a string of suspensions and more off field drama that ultimately cost McGregor his job.

 

[NRLMad]

SEASON 2021


GAINS: Daniel Alvaro, Talatau Amone, Gerard Beale, Jack Bird, Billy Burns, Poasa Faamausili, Mathew Feagai, Jaiyden Hunt, Freddy Lussick, Andrew McCullough, Josh McGuire, Tyrell Sloan, Jamayne Taunoa-Brown


LOSSES: Euan Aitken, Eddie Blacker, Billy Brittain, Tyson Frizell, James Graham, Jacob Host, Tim Lafai, Issac Luke, Cameron McInnes, Jason Saab, Tristan Sailor, Korbin Sims


FINISHED: 11th


ROSTER RATING: E


Look at the list of gains above and you tell me if it was destined for success or failure?


Of the three former Broncos Griffin recruited only Bird remains.


But letting McInnes walk to bring in McCullough was the call that really infuriated many fans.


In his prime McCullough was one of the bravest in the game.


But to recruit him at the backend of his career when he’d lost any zip he ever had, especially at the expense of McInnes, was seriously flawed thinking _ even allowing for the fact the Broncos were paying a reported $200,000 of McCullough’s $600,000 salary).


McGuire was another signing always destined for trouble.

 

[NRLMad]

SEASON 2022


GAINS: George Burgess, Jack Gosiewski, Moses Mbye, Tautau Moga, Michael Molo, Francis Molo, Johnathon Reuben, Jaydn Su’a, Moses Suli, Aaron Woods


LOSSES: Gerard Beale, Adam Clune, Matt Dufty, Kaide Ellis, Poasa Faamausili, Freddy Lussick, Trent Merrin, Corey Norman, Jordan Pereira, Jamayne Taunoa-Brown, Paul Vaughan, Brayden Wiliame


FINISHED: 10th


ROSTER RATING: D


Griffin’s Moneyball strategy continued, bringing in the likes of Burgess, Mbye and Woods, all past their best in footy years but they came at a bargain price.


Still, it all chews up money on the cap.


But did it work?


Let’s be fair, the Dragons finished above where most tipped them last year, but still missed the play offs.

 

[NRLMad]

SEASON 2023


GAINS: Jacob Liddle, Nick Lui-Toso, Ben Murdoch-Masila, Zane Musgrove


LOSSES: George Burgess, Jackson Ford, Jack Gosiewski, Andrew McCullough, Josh McGuire, Johnathon Reuben, Tariq Sims


PREDICTION: Bottom 4


ROSTER RATING: D


No one is saying the Dragons don’t have a squad capable of fighting for a top eight finish.


It’s just that the system has continually failed to bring out the best in players either recruited or developed, so how can you have faith now?


Aside from Hunt, you’d struggle to argue that one other player on that entire list above has seen their careers really excel beyond the expectations of their talent while at the Dragons.

 

[NRLMad]

Best thing to do is get Apple for photos and you can upgrade to the highest plan for photos etc plus you get news - includes Tele, courier mail plus others

 

[Dragonssupporter]

NAS or Woods. Who would you prefer?

Well for me-Woods. Winning isnt everything. I'd rather have a good example of sportsmanship and how to behave, than to just have anybody as long as we win. I just think some of our recent players dont represent what i thought St George should be, and id rather be proud of a club that i think has a great tradition, than just be happy because theyre winning. I know many will disagree and thats fine but when i think about McGuire last season, i shake my head and think this isnt the St George i remember and grew up with. However we need to be winning as well so im just hoping this year is different

 

[Dragon David]

It was once ranked up with the greatest brands in Australian sport.


Now it’s time for the St George Illawarra Dragons to put up or shut up and show long suffering fans they have finally turned the corner.


Because right now this is a club viewed as a graveyard for rugby league talent.


After another off-season marred by controversy, backed up by a shocking Charity Shield performance, Aaron Woods came out and declared it was time to “get our shit in order”.


Well, here’s their chance, starting with Sunday’s first up clash against Gold Coast Titans.

HOW THE RED V BECAME A LAUGHING STOCK


Let’s go back over the last six years and dissect the Dragons’ recruitment and retention strategy since Ben Hunt arrived in 2018.


That was also the last year the Dragons made the finals.


Where the Dragons are today is a sad reflection of what the mighty Red V once stood for.


When famous names like Raper, Langlands, Provan and Gasnier became Immortals.


Today it’s a recruitment and retention policy that has become the laughing stock of the game.


At least this year Wests Tigers have signed Api Koroisau, Isaiah Papali’i and John Bateman to give their fans new hope.


Meanwhile, the Dragons bank on lesser knowns like Jacob Liddle and Zane Musgrove from the Tigers, and Ben Murdoch-Masila from the Warriors, to make the difference to a squad that missed the finals last year.


While Liddle will add much needed dummy half spark, it hardly fills you with any great confidence as off-contract coach Anthony Griffin fights to save his job.


Will they prove us wrong? Here’s why history is against them.


SEASON 2018


GAINS: James Graham, Ben Hunt, Jeremy Latimore, Luciano Leilua, Zac Lomax, Darren Nicholls, Jordan Pereira, Reece Robson


LOSSES: Josh Dugan, Will Matthews, Russell Packer, Joel Thompson, Kalifa Faifai Loa, Josh McCrone, Jake Marketo, Taane Milne


FINISHED: 7th


ROSTER RATING: B


The Dragons paid overs for Hunt initially but he came as a grand final halfback and has well and truly earned his keep in the years since, it’s just a shame more around him don’t always play with as much passion.


Graham was another positive signing, a bit long in the tooth at that point, but you again can’t question the champion prop also did his absolute best to try and change the culture.


That year under Paul McGregor they were equal competition leaders up until round 20 but scored just four wins in their final 11 games with several key players struggling with injuries.


Despite that they made it to week two of the finals where they went down fighting 13-12 to the Rabbitohs. They’d kill for that result this year.

Thanks NRLMad. Much appreciated.

 

[dragonreddy]

A very good summary NRLMad, a lot of work went into your posts ,it really sheets home the plight of the club.

I have to disagree with you that "No one is saying the Dragons don’t have a squad capable of fighting for a top eight finish."
I am one that says we definitely don't have a squad capable of top 8 finish, as i have said before a number of our players wouldn't get a look in at other clubs .

 

[Illusion]

Ha

They’re not all nice guys.
I mean, if you look at the past few years, we’ve had some really unlikeable humans.
My top 5 in no particular order
McGuire
JDB
Vaughan
Norman
Amone
Not nice guys….

Ha ha was being sarcastic old mate ......

 

[justadragon]

Thanks Trifili. Agree with what you say.

Here is something else and it is that Hunt doesn't think that we will be wooden spooners. Of course he would say that and he is backing Hook still.

‘Not getting the spoon’: Hunt calls for Dragons to back Griffin as Amone tipped to return

‘Not getting the spoon’: Hunt calls for Dragons to back Griffin as Amone tipped to return

www.foxsports.com.au

Hunt will always back Griffin, without Griffin there Hunt goes to 9 no questions asked. So they have given Griffin 2 months, approx 8 games, we shall see , that could be 7 too many.

 

[Dragon David]

Hunt will always back Griffin, without Griffin there Hunt goes to 9 no questions asked. So they have given Griffin 2 months, approx 8 games, we shall see , that could be 7 too many.

On the outside, Hook always appears to be cool as a cucumber before and after games but in truth, his inner sanctum is churning and straining and anxious for each game especially for this year. In the next 9 weeks, we will have a better indication as to the future of Hook and several players.

We finished on a positive at the end of last year, winning the final 3 games (though lucky to beat the Tigers), after losing 6 straight in the games before. So, whilst we had some positivity, the negativity far outweighed it overall in those 9 weeks.

So for the first 9 weeks of this year, if we have the same win/loss rate as per the end of last year, Hooks's tenure is curtains in my opinion because I think that we will win only 3 games in that period, maybe lucky to even win that many games if the truth be known.

 

[Mojo]

Hunt will always back Griffin, without Griffin there Hunt goes to 9 no questions asked. So they have given Griffin 2 months, approx 8 games, we shall see , that could be 7 too many.

Frankly, I dont give a rat's arse what Hunt reckons. It's so transparently self-interested it gives me the shits. He's a great player but IMO throughout his career he's never looked like part of a 'team'. That's a major part of the on-field problem I reckon.

Aging Qlders will never do it for the Dragons. I know many will call this a load of BS but, I believe, there is a strong Dragons spirit. This is why our young guys are sooooo important. They are far more valuable, in the long term, than import 'marquee' players - because of what they have grown from.

 

[thebigredv]

A very good summary NRLMad, a lot of work went into your posts ,it really sheets home the plight of the club.

I have to disagree with you that "No one is saying the Dragons don’t have a squad capable of fighting for a top eight finish."
I am one that says we definitely don't have a squad capable of top 8 finish, as i have said before a number of our players wouldn't get a look in at other clubs .

I agree 100%


There has been a false overinflated perception of our playing talent and depth for years.

We've got Ben Hunt who has, after some lean years, shown his among the most elite in the comp. Other than that we have some capable players who have the odd standout performance e.g. Zac Lomax, a few youngsters whose careers plateau or take them to other clubs and a lot of discards painted up as solid first graders

 

[Budpower]

I think Maxy is a better centre than Zac

 

[hewi]

The latest discard who admittedly after only one game is showing what he can do is Ford. Funny when you consider that backrowers is where we are thin and we let go a home grown one while recruiting fringe dwellers.

 

[possm]

When letting Sims go, we needed to recruit an SOO edge forward. This is an example of what is going wrong at the Dragons. It also shows me that Griffin is not a coach who can get the best out of his players.

Another example is letting Robson go in favor of Mcginnes and then letting Mcguinnes go in favor of who?

For such a very long time it seems as tour recruitment team has no idea of what is required. The long period we have suffered without addressing the problem leads me to believe that a couple of board members have been exerting their influence in this area. There is no doubt in my mind that Doust and Craig Young have been the problem and still remain involved by directing Haran on what to do.

 

[BLM01]

The latest discard who admittedly after only one game is showing what he can do is Ford. Funny when you consider that backrowers is where we are thin and we let go a home grown one while recruiting fringe dwellers.

We wont miss Ford. He goes OK, plays fast and tries hard but he only will ever be at best fringe 1st grader as does not have size similar to Host.
We are OK ATM in the back row department stocks both existing and up and coming

 

[saintly1996]

I think Maxy is a better centre than Zac

Based On?