The world's gayest nation

[ozcrusader]

however throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in homosexuality - if you add to that the fact that it tends to be common across all species (and interestingly a rather constant percentage) one would have to assume that whatever you think of homosexuality 'unnatural' is not a complaint that will hold water

Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in pedophilia.

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'unnatural' is not a complaint that will hold water.

Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in incest

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'incest' is not a complaint that will hold water.


Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in murder

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'murder' is not a complaint that will hold water.

its very natural - you can still say you think its immoral, I'll never agree with that view but I can respect it, but I don't think the 'natural law' cry holds all that much water

Uh huh.
By your logic then, pedophilia, incest and murder are all 'natural' and should not be considered immoral if people dont want to.

 

[Anonymous]

however throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in homosexuality - if you add to that the fact that it tends to be common across all species (and interestingly a rather constant percentage) one would have to assume that whatever you think of homosexuality 'unnatural' is not a complaint that will hold water

Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in pedophilia.

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'unnatural' is not a complaint that will hold water.

Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in incest

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'incest' is not a complaint that will hold water.


Throughout history, in every society and culture known a certain percentage of humans have engaged in murder

Therefore, the fact that pedophilia is 'murder' is not a complaint that will hold water.

its very natural - you can still say you think its immoral, I'll never agree with that view but I can respect it, but I don't think the 'natural law' cry holds all that much water

Uh huh.
By your logic then, pedophilia, incest and murder are all 'natural' and should not be considered immoral if people dont want to.

All the above 'evil' examples hurt people.
A person's sexuality by definition, hurts no one.

 

[ozcrusader]

Well as I've proven to you heterosexual sex is just as unhealthy and dangerous as lesbian sex

My God, is there any help for this poor soul?

Are you blind or just being intentionally obtuse?

This is what I quoted before:

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control (CDC) found that male homosexuals contract the following diseases more frequently than heterosexuals by the following multiples:
Syphilis - 14 times
Gonorrhea - 3 times
Genital warts - 3 times
Hepatitis B - 8 times
Scabies - 5 times
Penile infection - 30 times
Anal Infection - 100 times
AIDS - 5000 times

Executive Summary, "Health Implications Associated with Homosexuality," 1999, by Medical Institute of Sexual Health;

"Homosexual men are at significantly increased risk of HIV/AIDS, hepatitis, anal cancer, gonorrhea and gastrointestinal infections as a result of their sexual practices. ...Women who have sex with women are at significantly increased risk of bacterial vaginosis, breast cancer and ovarian cancer than are heterosexual women."

Now, where's your proof mate?

 

[ozcrusader]

Yes your right. Lets just ban all sexuality. Once we start allowing heterosexuality we open the door for homosexuality, incest, paedophilia, the viewing of child pornography and polygamy.

Now you're getting really really desparate.

See, if you read my post, I said 'Once we dispense with the moral injunctions against homosexuality, we must also accept incest, pedophilia, the viewing of child pornogpraphy and polygamy.'

And you have proven this - your only objections to the viewing of child porn and bestiality are moral ones.

Please explain to me, why your 'moral viewpoints' that the viewing of child pornography and bestiality are immoral shouldnt be shoved you know where?

 

[Anonymous]

Well as I've proven to you heterosexual sex is just as unhealthy and dangerous as lesbian sex

My God, is there any help for this poor soul?

Careful Hermy, he's praying for you now.... :lol:

 

[salivor]

You have not answered the question goangod. If heterosexual couples practice exactly the same things during sex as lesbian couples how could either be deemed unhealthier than the other? The fact that we have no accurate stat on the amount of homosexuals means your stats are absolutely useless. We can only go on those who are openly homosexual and for all you know there are 2-3 times that amount who are secretly homosexual who have none of these problems at all. By the way I'm also going to disregard any statistics you don't source. You've repeatedly ignored me saying this, afraid to name which website you got these stats from?

 

[salivor]

Well as I've proven to you heterosexual sex is just as unhealthy and dangerous as lesbian sex

My God, is there any help for this poor soul?

Careful Hermy, he's praying for you now.... :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:
God save my homosexual apologist arse.

 

[salivor]

Yes your right. Lets just ban all sexuality. Once we start allowing heterosexuality we open the door for homosexuality, incest, paedophilia, the viewing of child pornography and polygamy.

Now you're getting really really desparate.

See, if you read my post, I said 'Once we dispense with the moral injunctions against homosexuality, we must also accept incest, pedophilia, the viewing of child pornogpraphy and polygamy.'

And you have proven this - your only objections to the viewing of child porn and bestiality are moral ones.

Please explain to me, why your 'moral viewpoints' that the viewing of child pornography and bestiality are immoral shouldnt be shoved you know where?

I'm getting really desperate now? As apposed to yourself who's only real argument against homosexuality is that some of them will become paedophiles?

I've given you my reasons against child pornography and while they carry moral reasons they go beyond that. Child pornography is child abuse and beastiality is animal abuse and those reasons have nothing to do with morals.

 

[Moffo]

Moffo on the paedophilia thing. You are using the exact same logic as goangod and that’s why you don't want to go there. Sorry but using that logic you either think both links (feminine and homosexuality and paedophilia and homosexuality) are correct or the both links are wrong and the logic is rubbish. Which is it moffo? I can see why you don't want to go there because you face being made a fool of.

This is going nowhere fast though because you've chosen to ignore parts of my posts which makes me wonder why I bothered writing them in the first place. I'm not going to bother picking parts out for you to reply to, if you didn't answer them in the first place I can only assume it would damage your argument to try and answer them now. I'll let you sleep soundly in your delusional world thinking homosexuality is a choice.

On Ian Roberts. I've given you a quote from the horse’s mouth that he finds heterosexual sex repulsive. I'm also the one who brought up the fake girlfriends and the whole issue part. Now if you connect the dots your more likely to assume he hasn't slept with a female or has once and found the whole experience repulsive as I'd assume most heterosexuals would find if they tried homosexual sex. This is probably directed more at terminator by the way.

What I'm really interested in is the absence of goangod as I've seen him posting in other threads so he’s around. Fighting a losing battle goangod?

Also termy, I hope Ian Roberts stops by your church sometime. Seeing him kicking your arse would be quite a sight :lol: .

A few points:

1) Pigs shit bronco. I did not mention a link between paedophilia and homosexuality

2.) Your going around in circles. Your farcical attempts to suggest that there is no link between being feminine and being gay is LAUGHABLE. I suggest you invest some time in an environment with gay people in it. How many gay people do you actually know?

3.) I individually replied to each question that you made in an earlier post. If you write each post with 58 questions, then there may be a slight chance that i miss a question. I do sincerely apologise

4.) You can't give me ANY proof that people are born homosexual. Yet you think im delusional because i think being gay is a choice. That argument is flawed and to be frank with you mate, is laughable. Logic like that will get you know where fast

5.) You specifically ask a quesiton and ill answer, im not in the practice of avoiding questions

6.) He finds hetrosexual sex repulsive. Does that mean he always did? ](*,)

7.) Please stop repeating the some points. Makes for a dull argument

Cheers,
Moffo

 

[salivor]

Moffo on the paedophilia thing. You are using the exact same logic as goangod and that’s why you don't want to go there. Sorry but using that logic you either think both links (feminine and homosexuality and paedophilia and homosexuality) are correct or the both links are wrong and the logic is rubbish. Which is it moffo? I can see why you don't want to go there because you face being made a fool of.

This is going nowhere fast though because you've chosen to ignore parts of my posts which makes me wonder why I bothered writing them in the first place. I'm not going to bother picking parts out for you to reply to, if you didn't answer them in the first place I can only assume it would damage your argument to try and answer them now. I'll let you sleep soundly in your delusional world thinking homosexuality is a choice.

On Ian Roberts. I've given you a quote from the horse’s mouth that he finds heterosexual sex repulsive. I'm also the one who brought up the fake girlfriends and the whole issue part. Now if you connect the dots your more likely to assume he hasn't slept with a female or has once and found the whole experience repulsive as I'd assume most heterosexuals would find if they tried homosexual sex. This is probably directed more at terminator by the way.

What I'm really interested in is the absence of goangod as I've seen him posting in other threads so he’s around. Fighting a losing battle goangod?

Also termy, I hope Ian Roberts stops by your church sometime. Seeing him kicking your arse would be quite a sight :lol: .

A few points:

1) Pigs sh*t bronco. I did not mention a link between paedophilia and homosexuality

2.) Your going around in circles. Your farcical attempts to suggest that there is no link between being feminine and being gay is LAUGHABLE. I suggest you invest some time in an environment with gay people in it. How many gay people do you actually know?

3.) I individually replied to each question that you made in an earlier post. If you write each post with 58 questions, then there may be a slight chance that i miss a question. I do sincerely apologise

4.) You can't give me ANY proof that people are born homosexual. Yet you think im delusional because i think being gay is a choice. That argument is flawed and to be frank with you mate, is laughable. Logic like that will get you know where fast

5.) You specifically ask a quesiton and ill answer, im not in the practice of avoiding questions

6.) He finds hetrosexual sex repulsive. Does that mean he always did? ](*,)

7.) Please stop repeating the some points. Makes for a dull argument

Cheers,
Moffo

Your a waste of mine and your own time moffo. The simple fact that you fail to understand the feminine and paedophilia link argument shows your quite happy to be ignorant. You may not like my repetition of points but maybe you could avoid this by addressing them first time around instead of playing the blind fool time and time again. I'll put it very simply. If you use the logic to prove one thing how can you deny what else that exact same logic proves? I'll answer it for you, you can't. So you either believe in both links or neither of them. Which one is it moffo? You can't just chose to believe in one, you don't get that choice, its your warped logic here, you backed yourself into this corner. Let me guess? You've gone for option C: Fingers in ears while singing "la la la la, I can't hear you".

 

[Moffo]

Dear Sailvor,

Please read point 1 and point 7 again. Whilst at it, trying answering point 6

Kind Regards,
Moffo

 

[salivor]

](*,) ](*,) ](*,) ](*,) ](*,)
Moffo, you didn't even read a word of my post and don't tell me to answer a question when you've failed to answer about 20 that I've put to you. Go away because your wasting my time. Geez I never thought I'd say this but goangod has got more legs to stand on than you.

 

[ozcrusader]

You have not answered the question goangod. If heterosexual couples practice exactly the same things during sex as lesbian couples how could either be deemed unhealthier than the other? The fact that we have no accurate stat on the amount of homosexuals means your stats are absolutely useless. We can only go on those who are openly homosexual and for all you know there are 2-3 times that amount who are secretly homosexual who have none of these problems at all. By the way I'm also going to disregard any statistics you don't source. You've repeatedly ignored me saying this, afraid to name which website you got these stats from?

Sure Salivor.

Whatever you say mate - homosexual sex is healthier than heterosexual sex. Henceforth - we should stop procreating at once.

Oh, btw - please refute these statistics.

1. Homosexual AIDs epidemic
AIDS cases by age group, exposure category, and sex,
reported through December 2001, United States

Homosexual males continue to account for the largest number of people reported with AIDS each year.
gay males = 368,971
heterosexual males = 32,735
http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/stats/hasr1302/table5.htm

The World Health Organization in its Global HIV/AIDS and STD Surveillance reports on the epidemiology of AIDS in different countries. Giving the Netherlands as a first example due to its large acceptance of gay practices comparative to other countries worldwide, homosexuals form 68.6% of AIDS cases, whereas heterosexuals form only 15.2%. Intra-venous drug users (IDU) form 11.6% and blood donations 2.3%. In the UK, MSM form 65.8% of AIDS cases followed by 18.1% heterosexuals. IDU form 8.1% of the cases (http://www.who.int/emc-hiv/fact_sheets/)

2. Homosexual men life expectancy 8 -20 years less than heterosexuals
http://ije.oupjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/26/3/657?maxt-show=&HITS=10

3. Homosexuals 860% more likely to contract a sexually transmitted disease (STD), increasing up to 500% their risk of contracting HIV/AIDShttp://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm4835a1.htm

4. Homosexuals 320% more likely than heterosexuals to have unprotected sex without telling their partners they're HIV-positive.
http://www.gayhealth.com/templates/0/news?record=136

5. Bisexual women more at risk of STDs and AIDshttp://abcnews.go.com/sections/living/DailyNews/lesbianstds001023.html
http://www.aegis.com/news/wb/2001/WB010204.html

5. Suicide more common among homosexuals than heterosexuals
http://archpsyc.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/56/10/867

6. Psychiatric disorders were more prevalent among homosexuals than heterosexuals(http://archpsyc.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/short/58/1/85)



Shall I continue?

The Medical Institute of Sexual Health [ http://www.medinstitute.org/ ] reports [ Executive Summary, "Health Implications Associated with Homosexuality," 1999]: - "Homosexual men are at significantly increased risk of HIV/AIDS, hepatitis, anal cancer, gonorrhea and gastrointestinal infections as a result of their sexual practices." - "Women who have sex with women are at significantly increased risk of bacterial vaginosis, breast cancer and ovarian cancer than are heterosexual women." - "Domestic violence is...probably more common among homosexuals than among heterosexuals." - "Significantly higher percentages of homosexual men and women abuse drugs, alcohol and tobacco than do heterosexuals."

 

[salivor]

For a start goangod, you only have used American statistics through this whole thread. The United States makes up a very small percentage of the worlds population. With aids for example, if you took a global stat, I'd bet my life on the fact that heterosexuals outnumber homosexuals by a significant number.

Secondly, you refuse to answer how it could be possible for homosexual women to be more at risk to these problems than heterosexual people when both sexualities practice the same things. Don't want to answer that do you? You only want to throw stats at me. I know its pained you to actually answer anything in this debate in your own words but just try it. Surely you can humor me and tell me how its possible in YOUR OWN WORDS.

Thirdly. Its your logic so don't throw around stupid comments around like "Whatever you say mate - homosexual sex is healthier than heterosexual sex. Henceforth - we should stop procreating at once.". Your quite happy to suggest homosexual sex is wrong because of the health risks but there are risks involved in all forms of sex but its only ok if we have heterosexual sex? I hate to tell you but if its health your worried about then why not stop heterosexual sex? It is possible to create human life without sexual intercourse thanks to modern science and I'm not talking about cloning or test tube babies because I know your prone to clutching at straws.

Lastly as I have said to moffo, at the end of the day all these statistics are irrelevant because we don't have an accurate number on homosexuals in society. We can only go on those that are openly homosexual and for all we know theres actually 3 times that amount or more that are secretly homosexual. We have no idea that actual portion that we are sampling which makes these stats flawed.

 

[ozcrusader]

For a start goangod, you only have used American statistics through this whole thread. The United States makes up a very small percentage of the worlds population.

Fool.

Why do you continue to embarrass yourself and reveal your stupidity?

In point one, can you see the words the Netherlands and the UK in there? Where are they Salivor?

(Hint: they arent in the US)


Point 2 - taken from a Canadian sample population - not the US
Point 6 & 7 - both samples taken from the Netherlands.

How does it feel to be wrong again?

With aids for example, if you took a global stat, I'd bet my life on the fact that heterosexuals outnumber homosexuals by a significant number.

You stupid, ignorant, unintelligent blatant dimwit.

Did you actually read anything? Or do you understand what you read?

Obviously heterosexual cases will outnumber homosexual cases - since homosexuals only make up a tiny minority of the population. The problem is their ovverepresentation.

Do you understand this, idiot? I cannot make this any simpler.

US cases of AIDs
gay males = 368,971
heterosexual males = 32,735

Gay males there have 10 times the cases of AIDs. And what percentage of the population are they? 2%? 5%? Even at 10% they are still grossly overrepresented.

Ditto for pedophile statistics. This tiny minority commits one third of all sex offenses against children.

Secondly, you refuse to answer how it could be possible for homosexual women to be more at risk to these problems than heterosexual people when both sexualities practice the same things. Don't want to answer that do you?

Did you see my first post to Brook? Did you read the evidence above in the post on lesbians and STDs? Obviously not.

Firstly, you will soon find that the vast majority of research around STDs and AIDs so far has concentrated on gay males - not gay females. However, read my post to Brook - gay females are more likely than heterosexual females to develop STDs etc etc.

Keep your head in the sand fool.

You only want to throw stats at me.

LOL

Read your last post - these are sourced statistics from independent agencies - The CDC, the WHO, The PA - you have nothing fool- nothing to back up the infantile assertions you consider arguments.

Refute these stats if you can.

Thirdly. Its your logic so don't throw around stupid comments around like "Whatever you say mate - homosexual sex is healthier than heterosexual sex. Henceforth - we should stop procreating at once.". Your quite happy to suggest homosexual sex is wrong because of the health risks but there are risks involved in all forms of sex but its only ok if we have heterosexual sex?

Your complete and utter stupidity defies all logic.

Exercise for Salivor - write out 100 times the meaning of the word overrepresentation.

Of course there are risks in sex with multiple partners for heterosexuals - but that risk is magnified by massive degress for homosexuals. Read the stats above.

Do you get it Salivor? Do you understand now? We cannot promote homosexuality as healthy alterntive lifestyle to heterosexuality because it isnt.

Lastly as I have said to moffo, at the end of the day all these statistics are irrelevant because we don't have an accurate number on homosexuals in society.

Dolt.
This is the debate with Salivor.

Part 1
Salivor: Your can go shove your moral injunctions against homosexuality
Goangod: Why dont u support the viewing of child porn and bestiality?
Salivor: Based on my moral injunctions

Part 2
Salivor: I refuse to credit any stats which arent sourced
Goangod: Provides independent stats from CDC, WHO, PA which are sourced
Salivor: These stats are irrelevant.

You are a complete and utter joke.

The evidence is there in the links above - read it and weep.

We can only go on those that are openly homosexual and for all we know theres actually 3 times that amount or more that are secretly homosexual. We have no idea that actual portion that we are sampling which makes these stats flawed.

Yes Salivor thats 100% right.
I will now write to WHO, the CDC and PA and inform that all their research and all their studies are fatally flawed.

Idiot.

 

[Anonymous]

Fool.... Canadian... stupid... ignorant... unintelligent blatant dimwit.

Do you understand this, idiot? I cannot make this any simpler.

US cases of AIDs
gay males = 368,971
heterosexual males = 32,735


Idiot.

Idiot, fool, stupid, ignorant, dimwit...
...and what have you got against Canadians? :lol:
Oh sorry... For some reason I thought these were now the accepted passwords in this thread.

Basically, you're just engaging in a bit of old-fashioned twinkie bashing and thats as old as the hills.

A few simple questions...

Do you consider homosexuals to be inferior?
Do you think homosexuality is a social disease?
If you met a homosexual and the subject of sexuality came up, how would you advise this person?

And one more thing... how about you show us the African demographics for AIDS....?
I'd do it but you seem more skilled at using search engines.

 

[Proletariat]

Fool.... Canadian... stupid... ignorant... unintelligent blatant dimwit.

Do you understand this, idiot? I cannot make this any simpler.

US cases of AIDs
gay males = 368,971
heterosexual males = 32,735


Idiot.

Idiot, fool, stupid, ignorant, dimwit...
...and what have you got against Canadians? :lol:
Oh sorry... For some reason I thought these were now the accepted passwords in this thread.

Basically, you're just engaging in a bit of old-fashioned twinkie bashing and thats as old as the hills.

A few simple questions...

Do you consider homosexuals to be inferior?
Do you think homosexuality is a social disease?
If you met a homosexual and the subject of sexuality came up, how would you advise this person?

And one more thing... how about you show us the African demographics for AIDS....?
I'd do it but you seem more skilled at using search engines.

Willow, Homosexusuals aren't evil. Its the things that they do that are evil. :roll:

BTW, Willow, I recently found out that my girlfriend and yourself share the same Uncle, Jim Kremmer. You and I are near enough to being identical twins!

 

[JoeD]

Every religion has injunctions against stealing, every religion has injunctions against murder, every religion has injunctions against lying, suicide, incest, bestiality, adultery and homosexuality.

I think you are wrong on this Goangod. Firstly, the word religion is loaded and huge parts of humanity over the ages have not lived as part of an organised religion.

Stealing - firstly requires the concept of ownership which in many cultures does not exist. (see land rights thread)
Incest - many cultures actively promote incest
Suicide - think japanese, the word kamekaze springs to mind.
Homosexuality - in the society of ancient Rome homosexuality was the norm.
Murder - well, I guess it all depends on your definition. The state of Texas doesn't believe that killing some by lethal injection as murder. What is the church's view on this anyway?
Adultery? lol how do you define that? sex between people not married in a church? What if you live in a society without chuches?

 

[Anonymous]

BTW, Willow, I recently found out that my girlfriend and yourself share the same Uncle, Jim Kremmer. You and I are near enough to being identical twins!

My fathers nephew actually.. but he's like an uncle. Damn... thats blows my cover. :lol:
Its a small world.

 

[millersnose]

BTW, Willow, I recently found out that my girlfriend and yourself share the same Uncle, Jim Kremmer. You and I are near enough to being identical twins!

My fathers nephew actually.. but he's like an uncle. Damn... thats blows my cover. :lol:
Its a small world.

(millersnose senses the conspiracy - immediately contacts israeli embassy to inform them of dangerous new developments)