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Tim f**king Paine

undertaker

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10,817
Smith hopefully back at captain. The tactics of the last two tests, only one spinner in Sydney and Brisbane, and the slip courden screw ups have to be addressed. Zampa should have been brought in at least for the Sydney test. Give credit to India with Kholi and most of their first strike bowlers.

Zampa wouldn't have been able to play, as he wasn't in the test squad to begin with. Under COVID-19 protocol, players cannot just go in and out of the squad like they did in the past. They have to remain in the bubble/hub once they join the squad. Swepson was the only other specialist spinner selected in the 18 man test squad from the start of the series.

In addition, Zampa can barely turn the ball at all and doesn't have the variation to trouble batsmen at test match level. His style of bowling is more suited to white ball cricket, where there's a heavier emphasis on line/length and dot-ball bowling, where he's enjoyed a lot of success in.

Mitchell Swepson would be the next test spinner in line should Lyon retire, get dropped, suffer a serious injury, or Australia are playing in the subcontinent or any turning pitch that justifies 2 specialist spin bowlers. He took an impressive 10-fer vs NSW in Shield cricket this season, and currently leads the leading wicket takers by a distance, 23 wickets @ 21.
 
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Twizzle

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Generally whom ever plays in our ODI team is being groomed for the test spot so I would think Carey is next in line.
 

TheParraboy

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https://wwos.nine.com.au/cricket/au...-captain/4c003ecb-d45c-4a24-963c-52b20c27a906

Tim Paine has 'never, ever been up to it' according to Kevin Pietersen

Former England captain Kevin Pietersen says Tim Paine's reign as Australian skipper is over, following the 2-1 series defeat to India.

Paine has now lost two home series as captain, both to India, and at the age of 36 questions are being asked about his future.

The wicketkeeper declared after the Brisbane Test
that he wanted to lead the side to South Africa next month, should that tour go ahead.

But Pietersen, whose own stint as England captain was brief and tumultuous, believes Australia should have a new leader for the next Test.

"Australians don't like to lose and the knives will be out for a few members of that team after this defeat," Pietersen wrote in his blog for Betway.

"We heard Tim Paine tell Ravichandran Ashwin that he 'can't wait to get you to the Gabba' – well they've been whacked at the Gabba, so where are they going to go now?

"I believe that Cricket Australia will soon be looking for a new captain – Paine has never, ever been up to it."

https%3A%2F%2Fprod.static9.net.au%2Ffs%2F437dfdde-edfd-48fa-8fcc-a2b1c745d0e2


Pietersen said Paine was only ever a stopgap solution following the ill-fated South African tour in 2018.

"He got chucked into that position when Steve Smith, David Warner and Cameron Bancroft got caught up in the sandpaper controversy, but from my perspective, having played against him and watched him, he's not an Australia captain," he said.

"He's just not a good enough player, apart from anything else.

"I would never have made him captain in the first place, and he's probably never going to lead them into another Test match."

Pietersen, who didn't name a replacement for Paine, is at odds with former Australian skipper Ian Chappell, who told Wide World of Sports that Paine is currently the only realistic option to lead the team.

A host of former England players have lined up to stick the boot into Australia following India's series win.

With the Ashes just 10 months away, former captain Michael Vaughan noted the Australian batting "has a soft centre," the fast bowlers "lacked penetration," and Nathan Lyon "had no impact at all."

https%3A%2F%2Fprod.static9.net.au%2Ffs%2F3f8f5b98-e0fc-4d65-9d63-d0dbff4b2cbc




Pietersen argued that India's victory, in the face of huge adversity, was one of the greatest wins of all time.

"I wrote last week that the only way to shut Australia up was to beat them. That India had to concentrate on their game, remain united and use all of the off-field shenanigans as inspiration," he said.

"They've done that brilliantly. To come from behind and win this series when everything was against them is a phenomenal performance, it really is.

"Full credit to Ravi Shastri and Ajinkya Rahane. They've really come to the party and put on a show that will be remembered for a very long time."

 
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Generally whom ever plays in our ODI team is being groomed for the test spot so I would think Carey is next in line.


Carey is likely next, but he’s not clearly the best option. Inglis is a very good keeper and averages the same with the bat as Carey, plus he has the advantage of being 4 years younger.

Unfortunately with these things the selectors can become a bit tunnel visioned.
 

Fangs

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I think the next choice is Cummins. If not then Smith. They are our best two players who can command respect from the players based on their personal performances.

Labuschagne is a fair way off I think. I'm not sure he has the total respect of the playing group right now (If his on-field antics are anything to go by). If anything you'd let him captain some throw t20 matches to see if he actual has any tactical nous.

However I agree with Ponting. At this stage Paine is captain until the Ashes. But he has to learn from his mistakes if we are going to win against SA or England. Judging on his record he doesn't learn much at all.
 

Twizzle

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Carey is likely next, but he’s not clearly the best option. Inglis is a very good keeper and averages the same with the bat as Carey, plus he has the advantage of being 4 years younger.

Unfortunately with these things the selectors can become a bit tunnel visioned.

yeh I agree, they'll see being younger as a disadvantage

and f**k KP, like Warnie he always seems to have an agenda
 
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However I agree with Ponting. At this stage Paine is captain until the Ashes. But he has to learn from his mistakes if we are going to win against SA or England. Judging on his record he doesn't learn much at all.


Continuing with Paine until the Ashes is asking for trouble, the writing is on the wall now. Mostly the ex players are very reluctant to call for sackings, it’s a brotherhood to them. Paine is a poor tactician, his keeping is on the decline and he turns 37 this year.
 
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yeh I agree, they'll see being younger as a disadvantage

and f**k KP, like Warnie he always seems to have an agenda


The most telling comments for me were from Mark Taylor. It’s very unusual for him to criticise captaincy, but he was totally puzzled at Paine’s bowling tactics.
 

Fangs

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Continuing with Paine until the Ashes is asking for trouble, the writing is on the wall now. Mostly the ex players are very reluctant to call for sackings, it’s a brotherhood to them. Paine is a poor tactician, his keeping is on the decline and he turns 37 this year.

You're being too reasonable. The selectors won't do it.
 

undertaker

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I think the next choice is Cummins. If not then Smith. They are our best two players who can command respect from the players based on their personal performances.

Labuschagne is a fair way off I think. I'm not sure he has the total respect of the playing group right now (If his on-field antics are anything to go by). If anything you'd let him captain some throw t20 matches to see if he actual has any tactical nous.

However I agree with Ponting. At this stage Paine is captain until the Ashes. But he has to learn from his mistakes if we are going to win against SA or England. Judging on his record he doesn't learn much at all.

This upcoming 3 test match tour of South Africa is Paine's last chance as test captain, and by the end of the tour, the selectors will have had more than enough time to figure out who they have penciled as Paine's successor.

As much as I'd like to see Paine dropped right now, based on the responses in the media on the subject of the test captaincy from ex-players, the uncertainty and confusion over who should succeed him as test captain is the only reason why Paine will still continue in the team for the South African tour.

If Australia fails to qualify for the World Test Championship final (which should be the first and most important priority between now and the final in June), Paine's captaincy role should be immediately stripped from him after the South African tour, and big changes need to be made in the overall squad before the Ashes next summer so we start the 2021-23 WTC cycle on a strong note.

From now until the end of the Shield season, selectors need to also focus on who they have in mind for the Ashes squad (assuming COVID bubbles/hubs still remain by end of year, meaning there will at least be an 18 man squad in the hub like there was for this recent test series vs India), and not wait until the last minute just before the first test match to see if a bolter will emerge in the 3-4 Sheffield Shield matches that are played before the Ashes (like they did this summer with Cameron Green).

This season's Sheffield Shield season will finish in mid-April. After the Shield final, selectors should have a list of 25 players who they realistically could see playing in the Ashes. Play three Australia vs Australia A 4/5 day matches around August-October (consisting of those 25 players), with the top 18 making the final Ashes squad in November.
 
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saint.nick

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Pietersen with a typical UK gutter press take on things. He briefly farted his way through a captaincy that he wanted.
 

Fangs

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11,544
This upcoming 3 test match tour of South Africa is Paine's last chance as test captain, and by the end of the tour, the selectors will have had more than enough time to figure out who they have penciled in as Paine's successor.

If that is how they are thinking then Steve Smith is the next captain. Its the Ashes we are talking about now and giving that as a new captain's first assignment is a big risk.

I think they'll stick with Paine and he will retire end of 21-22 home test series.

While we are at it, new ODI captain. I can't see Finch making the 2023 WC. So another tick for Smith as captain.
 

JJ

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This series was pretty hilarious, but atm is there a better captain available? And seriously stop saying Smith, he was terrible.

As I’ve said elsewhere I’d be looking at the coaches first
 

undertaker

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While we are at it, new ODI captain. I can't see Finch making the 2023 WC. So another tick for Smith as captain.

Very good point you raise regarding ODI captain.

Like you, I don't see Finch being there in the 2023 WC. I'd be very surprised if the selectors choose a 37 year old (by then) opening batsman.

When Bevan was dropped in 2004, Trevor Hohns at the time said: "....we thought it was the right time to move forward as we start to form a core of players to take us to the next World Cup in 2007."

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2004/apr/07/cricket.australiacricketteam
 

JJ

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31,801
Very good point you raise regarding ODI captain.

Like you, I don't see Finch being there in the 2023 WC. I'd be very surprised if the selectors choose a 37 year old (by then) opening batsman.

When Bevan was dropped in 2004, Trevor Hohns at the time said: "....we thought it was the right time to move forward as we start to form a core of players to take us to the next World Cup in 2007."

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2004/apr/07/cricket.australiacricketteam
Hohns has been doing this since then? FMD he must be the greatest selector ever...
 

gUt

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Apart from the sandpaper cheating thing why is it accepted wisdom that Smith was a terrible captain? I'm no expert but I don't recall him being worse than Paine
 

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