Top 20 Kangaroos of the Past 30 Years...

[The 18th Man]

I don't base my opinions on highlights or stats. I've actually watched the odd series or two and neither player stood out. Sailor from 98-01 and Renouf in 94 and 98. Would hardly call them greats and would say they disappointed at that level. As Laggy pointed out Renouf had a good game against England hence why I put him into the Brent Kite/Brett Kimmorley league of players who were good for Australia but disappointing for their respective states.

18th Man, using Rothfield as a source is like me using Gaba...

Not sure what that means (Gaba - member?) though I assume it's meant not to be good for Rothfield. I wasn't highlighting Rothfield's opinion as that to be the be all end all, though as an alleged leading rugby league analyst (well he is), Renouf had earnt a place in his top 30. We will take that for it's worth. Like or loathe him, Rothfield as seen a lot more rugby league than I am assuming you and I.

Nice reply either way. Cheers.

 

[Big Pete]

Rothfield's lists are notoriously short sighted and biast.

I'd take his opinion with a grain of salt.

Simply put, Renouf and Sailor weren't cut out to be Origin players. Where they excelled as players didn't translate well in Origin and they were regularly beaten by their opposites (at least in terms of performance). Disregard my incredibly poor comment, which even I feel is a tad harsh but I stand by my assertion that they were cod ordinary Origin players.

 

[The 18th Man]

Rothfield's lists are notoriously short sighted and biast.

I'd take his opinion with a grain of salt.

Simply put, Renouf and Sailor weren't cut out to be Origin players. Where they excelled as players didn't translate well in Origin and they were regularly beaten by their opposites (at least in terms of performance). Disregard my incredibly poor comment, which even I feel is a tad harsh but I stand by my assertion that they were cod ordinary Origin players.

No problem Pete. Opinions vary, it would be boring if we all agreed.

As for Rothfield, yeah, I can't say I subscribe to his blog or opinion though like the majority of the commentators in the media, his opinion can be a bit hit and miss (with the latter being more prevelant). Again, his list was only to suggest others saw Renouf in a different light to which you have painted him at Origin level.

Anyway, back to the Kanagaroos then...:lol:

 

[ANTiLAG]

I wish we (NSW) has two "incredibly poor" players like Sailor and Renouf back in the day.

Renouf was pitts at origin.

What you mean you would want Renouf... NSW had O'Connor, McGregor, Hill, Ettinghausen, C Johns, Daley, Fittler..... > And I would have swapped him for any of those! Are you senile old man?

If Renouf was in a top 50 Origin players list it was based on club rep and not a maroon jumper.

And how he made the Australian test team, well - his club side was always in the finals and generally won the grand final - in those days - most the GF players made the team.

Renouf test debut'd in 92 - certainly not from his one game off the bench in game 1 origin before being dropped.

And as for Sailor - Mad Dog and Rod Wishart completely outshine him at origin level.

 

[ANTiLAG]

No problem Pete. Opinions vary, it would be boring if we all agreed.

As for Rothfield, yeah, I can't say I subscribe to his blog or opinion though like the majority of the commentators in the media, his opinion can be a bit hit and miss (with the latter being more prevelant). Again, his list was only to suggest others saw Renouf in a different light to which you have painted him at Origin level.

Anyway, back to the Kanagaroos then...:lol:

Well he shoudl talk to the Qld selectors who dropped him - then selected him out of desperation, then dropped him....

 

[The 18th Man]

Renouf was pitts at origin.

What you mean you would want Renouf... NSW had O'Connor, McGregor, Hill, Ettinghausen, C Johns, Daley, Fittler..... > And I would have swapped him for any of those! Are you senile old man?

If Renouf was in a top 50 Origin players list it was based on club rep and not a maroon jumper.

And how he made the Australian test team, well - his club side was always in the finals and generally won the grand final - in those days - most the GF players made the team.

Renouf test debut'd in 92 - certainly not from his one game off the bench in game 1 origin before being dropped.

And as for Sailor - Mad Dog and Rod Wishart completely outshine him at origin level.

All in your opinion ;-)

Kinda weak response to Renouf making Australian teams basing it soley on his successful team, that's inaccurate. Just my opinion though. Renouf more than justified his selections though in his efforts for Australia.

My "beef" (is that the word on an online forum? lol) with Pete was that of only the labelling of both players as "ordinary" and then "incredibly poor". In my opinion, both comments were off the mark.

Take a valium, no need for "are you senile old man?"

I am sure you can do a lot better than that pal ;-)

 

[The 18th Man]

Well he shoudl talk to the Qld selectors who dropped him - then selected him out of desperation, then dropped him....

Send you resume to www.thedailytelegraph.com.au and petition for Phil's job. You're obviously a rugby league expert. Good luck!

 

[ANTiLAG]

All in your opinion ;-)

Err no those are facts. I was around and reading papers and watching sports shows with selectors interviewed for dropping him. I was also reading and watching the same interviews when he was selected for post season tests for the Australian team after having had a good final series.

Against NSW - Renouf was pitts.

The only reason he mustered 11 games is because Qld were so short of talent.

Meninga, Peter Jackson - even the average Mark Coyne - were far better origin players than Renouf. As were Mick O'Connor, Ettinghausen, Daley, Fittler, McGregor and T Hill. International players who were selected on the back of origin.

 

[Big Pete]

My "beef" (is that the word on an online forum? lol) with Pete was that of only the labelling of both players as "ordinary" and then "incredibly poor". In my opinion, both comments were off the mark.

I retract the incredibly poor remark, surprised I made it, would say they were incredibly disappointing though.

Stand by my 'cod ordinary' statement. Queensland selected them for a particular reason, and they barely saw any return for their good faith.

And hey you brought age into this.

 

[The 18th Man]

Err no those are facts. I was around and reading papers and watching sports shows with selectors interviewed for dropping him. I was also reading and watching the same interviews when he was selected for post season tests for the Australian team after having had a good final series.

Against NSW - Renouf was pitts.

The only reason he mustered 11 games is because Qld were so short of talent.

Meninga, Peter Jackson - even the average Mark Coyne - were far better origin players than Renouf. As were Mick O'Connor, Ettinghausen, Daley, Fittler, McGregor and T Hill. International players who were selected on the back of origin.

Maybe I am senile, I can't remember reading papers or watching tv from the 90's let alone last week.

Again, Renouf was the "pitts" in your opinion. Renouf only mustered 11 games for QLD "because QLD were so short of talent" in your opinion.

As Pete and I have successfully achieved in this same thread, we will agree to disagree. Unfortunately you won't get whatever it is you're wanting to see my type backing your opinion here ANTiLAG ;-)

 

[The 18th Man]

I retract the incredibly poor remark, surprised I made it, would say they were incredibly disappointing though.

Stand by my 'cod ordinary' statement. Queensland selected them for a particular reason, and they barely saw any return for their good faith.

And hey you brought age into this.

True you honor, that was a card I played albeit a card misplayed ;-)

 

[ANTiLAG]

Maybe I am senile, I can't remember reading papers or watching tv from the 90's let alone last week.

Just because you have conveniently forgotten the facts does not mean something is mere speculation and conjecture. When a player is dropped from Origin and is selected for end of year tests - you could surely induce its from club form. If you cannot, then deduce from the interviews- there are libraries which store old newspapers. Its all there in the almanacks on microfiche.

Again, Renouf was the "pitts" in your opinion.

An opinion shared by the selectors who numerously dropped him from origin.

Renouf must have been doing something right, as too Sailor, to be gaining Australian selection after Origin.

Another fact for you Mr 18 - two bench games in origin - dropped - then makes the test team.... Yes 18th Man - Renouf made the Australian test team from finals form in '92, that is club level performances - not origin ones.

Renouf only mustered 11 games for QLD "because QLD were so short of talent" in your opinion.

True - however Queenslands shortage of talent is well famed and documented throughout the entirity of 80's and 90's. Players being selected for origin from reserve grade etc.... Only recently have the numbers of Queenslanders in the NRL getting to healthy depth levels field competetive selections throughout the team that withstand injuries, suspensions and retirements etc.

As Pete and I have successfully achieved in this same thread, we will agree to disagree.

True - however at the same time I wish to make your opinion look naive, foolish and illogical.

Unfortunately you won't get whatever it is you're wanting to see my type backing your opinion here ANTiLAG ;-)

I could not care less whether you agree with me... You're too dim witted to know the facts.

 

[The 18th Man]

I am flattered at the time spent in replying - I politely decline to agree with your opinion that Steve Renouf deserves to be labelled "poor" and only made Australian teams because he was good at the end of the year when his side played finals footy ;-)

 

[ANTiLAG]

No great time spent - Im quick

 

[The 18th Man]

No great time spent - Im quick

I hope only when typing ;-)

"Oh no he didn't!..."

Enjoy the your arvo.

 

[ANTiLAG]

It was actually a reference to thinking....

You really are quite dim and stubbornly ignorant aren't you?

"Oh yes I did...."

 

[The 18th Man]

It was actually a reference to thinking....

You really are quite dim and stubbornly ignorant aren't you?

"Oh yes I did...."

Duuuude. Chill the f#@# out. It was a tongue in cheek post only intended to be ever so slightly humerous to end the alleged "debate" ... ](*,)

Nice reply I guess. Touche. Let's move on.

 

[ANTiLAG]

Duuuude. Chill the f#@# out.

1 How much older than Pete can you be? Pete doesn't say "duuuude" in a typed Keanau Reeves manner.

2 I am chilled. I write on the forums to blow off steam.

3 I am astonished you wrote "duuuude". Makes we wonder if you are either (non exhaustively) a grey haired surfer trying to be hip or a 30+ year old hippy?

 

[The 18th Man]

1 How much older than Pete can you be? Pete doesn't say "duuuude" in a typed Keanau Reeves manner.

2 I am chilled. I come on the forums to blow off steam.

3 I am astonished you wrote "duuuude". Makes we wonder if you are either (non exhaustively) a grey haired surfer trying to be hip or a 30+ year old hippy?

Really? :lol: I have to spell out wh...nope...not going to bother ](*,)

Enjoy.

 

[kiwii]

I think when it comes to top Roo's Andrew Ettingshausen has to be high on the list. His try scoring record on the Kangaroo tours of 90 & 94 stand alone, he also made some amazing plays in tests to help win a number of games and series over his career.