Toronto Gone?

[Pommy]

Pretty overwhelming vote. TBF they were asked for a solid business plan and a guarantee revenue base and from sounds of it provided neither. Another sad day for expansion but its hardly the RFL or SLE fault, once again shonky owners with eyes bigger than their bellies creating unviable clubs in an unrealistic way. Toronto now consigned to the SL expansion bin along with Sheffield, Gateshead, Paris, Wales and London (though they may be back if SL wants 12 clubs).

yet the well run clubs did vote for it and the ones with something to lose did not. That speaks volumes to me.
I love how with your eyes bigger than their bellies lien you still won’t admit the current situation is totally different to any other situation we’ve been in. This isn’t anything like the other clubs you’ve mentioned.

 

[Perth Red]

Farcical. Never were going to achieve success with such staunch opposition from anti-expansion dinosaurs. If such reservations existed, you have to wonder why the RFL admitted them in the first place.

Toronto should spear-head a proper North American competition, aligning with the American league.

As for the SL, you also have to wonder for its long term sustainability - the upper clubs are a cut above the lower tier clubs and the gap is widening. Whomever takes over for the 12th club (or however they restructure the league), is going to face a huge uphill battle.

lol Im pretty sure it was the Toronto owner who ran out of money and had no real business plan for bringing in sustainable revenue at fault, not the "anti-expansion" dinosaurs!

RFL gave them a pathway to the top, when they got there they couldn't survive, his pockets werent deep enough and his business plan was shthouse! Lets not forget this is the organsiation that thought it a good idea to pay an over the hil union player millions of $'s but couldnt afford to pay their debts or other players!!

Only people I feel sorry for are the Wolfpack fans who got behind the club and have now lost that opportunity to watch RL.

 

[Perth Red]

yet the well run clubs did vote for it and the ones with something to lose did not. That speaks volumes to me.
I love how with your eyes bigger than their bellies lien you still won’t admit the current situation is totally different to any other situation we’ve been in. This isn’t anything like the other clubs you’ve mentioned.

It was built on a pack of cards and the covid gale that blew through could have been a whisp and it looked destined to fall. He could have shut the whole club down for a year, had no expenditure and started it back up when Covid goes, but no he had already run up significant debts he couldn't afford and the club didnt have a business plan that was even close to generating the sort of revenue a SL club needs, let alone one in a far flung place getting no TV revenue. Its a real shame as there was clearly an appetite from fans in the city and having a major international city in Sl would have raised credibility but at end of day the wolfpack failure is on the owners, past and prospective.

The fact only 3 clubs thought it a solid application (at the second attempt mind) is very telling, regardless of how run each one is.

 

[axl rose]

Perth Red is making sense, 2020 the strangest of years.

 

[RedVee]

So who comes in now?
Toulouse ? London ?

 

[LeagueXIII]

If RL wants to grow outside it's traditional areas anywhere it will need the administration to help support it otherwise we will never grow anywhere. Look at the history of the game it has never expanded anywhere without financial assistance eg. Melbourne.

Toronto is a huge loss and opportunity for the game. Hopefully they can be saved in the lower division.

 

[taste2taste]

This quote from the SL chairman pretty much sums it up

"operating a team in a fiercely competitive North American sports market was non-strategic and added no material incremental revenue to Super League in the short or medium term.”

Well, yeah, having success in the richest sporting market in the world couldn't possibly be a good thing could it ?? Short sighted and poorly run, as Lusick said, no wonder the SL are 25 years behind the NRL

My interest in SL just went from a 5 out of 10 to a -5/10

 

[Perth Red]

Wakefield view

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/spo...vzYJRJ2vMbnBO_9CDelkkbIXYzQ_db0pWAYy1afJj07uA

 

[Taking The Two]

Ultimately, the exclusion looks like being the correct decision at the time of the proposal. Without proof of funds and question marks over projection figures, I can’t see a way you could have reapproved them.

That said, the time in which they had to prepare a proposal, it was always going to be a battle to get one up to scratch in such a short space of time.

Ultimately though, Toronto were set up to fail, as pretty much all of our expansion attempts have been. They’re typically people with an interest in Rugby League sticking pins in a map and hoping the game takes off there. Without a proper plan and a buy in from International Rugby League, Super League and The RFL and an understanding of what we want from them, where they see themselves going and how the two can work with each other, they were always going to end up the way they’ve gone.

It’s the same with Toulouse Olympique, should they get in. Without a plan and some help, no relegation for 3-5 years and a bigger salary cap, how do we expect there to be a French Tv deal on the table going forwards? I hope it’s Toulouse though, I fancy a weekend there.

I hope it’s the start of a return to licensing. Let’s be honest, there’s six clubs in already; Saints, Wigan, Leeds, Hull FC, Warrington and Catalans Dragons. Add in Toulouse on a decent length licence so we get the best chance of a TV deal. That’s seven. You’ve got five spaces left and you can make cases for the rest of the current Super League teams and then Leigh, Featherstone, London, York, Newcastle, Halifax and probably a couple of others who can tick some boxes but not all.

 

[The_Frog]

Without a proper plan and a buy in from International Rugby League, Super League and The RFL and an understanding of what we want from them, where they see themselves going and how the two can work with each other, they were always going to end up the way they’ve gone.

The Coronavirus didn't help. Nor did splashing so much on SBW. They could have bought a team good enough to beat half the teams in SL with what he cost.

 

[taste2taste]

The Coronavirus didn't help. Nor did splashing so much on SBW. They could have bought a team good enough to beat half the teams in SL with what he cost.

SBW was signed as a marquee player meaning his contract didn't count against the salary cap. Each SL team gets 2 marquee players. SBW contract had no impact on Toronto's salary cap, they still had their full cap to add any player they wanted.

 

[taste2taste]

Wakefield view

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/spo...vzYJRJ2vMbnBO_9CDelkkbIXYzQ_db0pWAYy1afJj07uA

I think most would agree with Rovers chairman Mark Campbell describing clubs as acting in self interest.

This decision is a kick in the nuts for those of us that support and want our great game to grow. SL had a free kick with Toronto, a team fully paid for and the potential of making inroads in the richest sporting market in the world and they said "no thanks" face slapping emoji

It's been said often over the last few days but its so true. Rugby league never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

 

[The_Frog]

SBW was signed as a marquee player meaning his contract didn't count against the salary cap. Each SL team gets 2 marquee players. SBW contract had no impact on Toronto's salary cap, they still had their full cap to add any player they wanted.

But he can't have helped their balance sheet, as things turned out. The money involved was just preposterous. Half the cost of the entire Melbourne or Penrith 30 man squad per season and he was never fit. They might as well have paid Kim Kardashian to appear at their games.

 

[Pommy]

But he can't have helped their balance sheet, as things turned out. The money involved was just preposterous.

If an owner wants to blow his money that’s for him to do so though. It’s not like it was Toronto’s money SBW was getting.

 

[The_Frog]

If an owner wants to blow his money that’s for him to do so though. It’s not like it was Toronto’s money SBW was getting.

Well now they are out on their ear. An owner can blow his money but there are consequences.

 

[Pommy]

Well now they are out on their ear. An owner can blow his money but there are consequences.

The two probably aren’t linked though. It’s not like SBW got all that money, the owner still got in to trouble due to COVID and not having SBW doesn’t mean any other outcome was going to happen.

 

[Tigers1986]

I like the suggestion of a return to licensing. Move to 14 teams in the division while they're at it - 27 game season with magic weekend, top 5 playoffs.

The 3 clubs? Toulouse for the French rivalry, Featherstone make a case due to success at championship level. Cases can also be made for York, Bradford, London etc. Also would help the championship division as well, not having to worry about the rigours of an SL campaign that could set them back quite a while.

 

[Taking The Two]

I think most would agree with Rovers chairman Mark Campbell describing clubs as acting in self interest.

This decision is a kick in the nuts for those of us that support and want our great game to grow. SL had a free kick with Toronto, a team fully paid for and the potential of making inroads in the richest sporting market in the world and they said "no thanks" face slapping emoji

It's been said often over the last few days but its so true. Rugby league never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

Most people here think he’s an idiot and that statement is a parody. He’s accused Super League of self interest and made swiping insults against them, then finished it off with “...but please now let me in, so I can protect my own interests”.

 

[Taking The Two]

The Coronavirus didn't help. Nor did splashing so much on SBW. They could have bought a team good enough to beat half the teams in SL with what he cost.

The issues of not paying players and others owed money have been around since day one of Toronto, often with players not being paid on time rather than what’s ended up this year of them not being paid at all, which was one of the reasons Robert Elstone was wary of them joining Super League, before he eventually let them join. He was proven right, really.

As much as the whole thing was crazy from day one and they should have had things done differently (why did they start at the bottom playing part-time teams?), Toronto really didn’t help themselves and made some horrendous decisions and have treated the players contracted to them this year shockingly.

 

[Perth Red]

SBW was signed as a marquee player meaning his contract didn't count against the salary cap. Each SL team gets 2 marquee players. SBW contract had no impact on Toronto's salary cap, they still had their full cap to add any player they wanted.

whose talking about salary cap?they spent money they didn’t have thinking he would bring in sponsors and it didn’t happen. They rolled the dice and came up well short and it sent them bankrupt,