Who gets out of each pool and in which order?

[Pedge1971]

Anybody buy the possibility the Kiwis will be p!ssed off and dangerous?
I still see them topping their pool..

Well they do have master tactician Kidwell as their secret weapon lol...

 

[adamkungl]

Wait to see what happens when the RLIF have a little cash to spend

I'm interested as to what they would spend it on/what people think they should. And bear with me this might go off on some tangents.

The RLIFs main roles as I see it:
1) Providing assistance and funding for new nations to start up or developing nations to expand their pathways
2) Providing funding and training for coaches and officials and developing nations
3) Staging international events
4) Providing funding for regional federations to do the above at a closer level.

That's all well and good, but I think a lot of nations already at WC level need to do more themselves rather than waiting for the RLIF.

Take Samoa and Tonga as an example.
Tonga have had a bunch of players 'defect' for the love of the jersey, without any financial incentive.
Samoan coach Parish has had another sook about financial incentives for the big 3 preventing his team from competing. Interesting comparison.

In the past I might have been in favour of standardised test match payments, but I've gone off the idea. Wtf have Samoa done to deserve the same payment as the Kangaroos?
The Kangaroos are at the top of the most successful Rugby competition in the world, and stage (and win) enough matches to engage fans and pay their players healthy sums.

Samoa develop no players, and basically only play games at the invite of the Kangaroos or NRL. Will Samoa improve in any way by the NRL or RLIF giving them match payment handouts? These are already professional players. It would cost $400,000 per nation to fund them on a similar level to the Roos. Surely there are better things to spend $400,000 per nation on, if someone was willing to invest this.
$400,000 would run a team out of Samoa competing in a NZ or Australian based semi-pro competition.
$400,000 would take the Samoan test squad on an annual tour of the pacific islands.
$400,000 would fund equipment, referees and coaching courses for multiple nations.

So back to what the RLIF should be doing, and what individual nations should be doing.
The RLIF (or its regional underlings) should be staging a once every 2 years regional cup for Pacific, Europe, Americas, MEA.
The RLIF should be engaging with individual nations to improve their domestic competitions and development pathways.

Samoa (and others) should be ensuring they play multiple test matches every year, especially home matches in front of their own fans. This is the only way to get fans, young players, and sponsors engaged, which in turn results in money and influence. It's no one else's responsibility to do this. Sooking about eligibility or match payments should come well after this.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

I'm interested as to what they would spend it on/what people think they should. And bear with me this might go off on some tangents.

The RLIFs main roles as I see it:
1) Providing assistance and funding for new nations to start up or developing nations to expand their pathways
2) Providing funding and training for coaches and officials and developing nations
3) Staging international events
4) Providing funding for regional federations to do the above at a closer level.

That's all well and good, but I think a lot of nations already at WC level need to do more themselves rather than waiting for the RLIF.

Take Samoa and Tonga as an example.
Tonga have had a bunch of players 'defect' for the love of the jersey, without any financial incentive.
Samoan coach Parish has had another sook about financial incentives for the big 3 preventing his team from competing. Interesting comparison.

In the past I might have been in favour of standardised test match payments, but I've gone off the idea. Wtf have Samoa done to deserve the same payment as the Kangaroos?
The Kangaroos are at the top of the most successful Rugby competition in the world, and stage (and win) enough matches to engage fans and pay their players healthy sums.

Samoa develop no players, and basically only play games at the invite of the Kangaroos or NRL. Will Samoa improve in any way by the NRL or RLIF giving them match payment handouts? These are already professional players. It would cost $400,000 per nation to fund them on a similar level to the Roos. Surely there are better things to spend $400,000 per nation on, if someone was willing to invest this.
$400,000 would run a team out of Samoa competing in a NZ or Australian based semi-pro competition.
$400,000 would take the Samoan test squad on an annual tour of the pacific islands.
$400,000 would fund equipment, referees and coaching courses for multiple nations.

So back to what the RLIF should be doing, and what individual nations should be doing.
The RLIF (or its regional underlings) should be staging a once every 2 years regional cup for Pacific, Europe, Americas, MEA.
The RLIF should be engaging with individual nations to improve their domestic competitions and development pathways.

Samoa (and others) should be ensuring they play multiple test matches every year, especially home matches in front of their own fans. This is the only way to get fans, young players, and sponsors engaged, which in turn results in money and influence. It's no one else's responsibility to do this. Sooking about eligibility or match payments should come well after this.

Good points! I think the money should be spent on structuring meaningful tournaments that every member nation can either play in or qualify to play in. Euro, Pac, Atlantic cups each year and a 9's circuit.

Money for individual nations should be on an incentive basis. As you hit x target you get x dollars, when you hit y target you get more dollars. This ensures that there is support for member nations but makes them do the work themselves.

 

[Valheru]

There is a fair bit of hope and wishful thinking in some of these predictions. England won't beat Australia in the first game, I expect something like a 32-14 score line, I do think England will get better from there though.

Despite the injuries and other withdrawals, NZ is still the 2nd or 3rd best team in the tournament and will top their group. They might get run fairly close in one game though.

Highlights of the group stage will be some of the lower ranked nations playing each other and the battle for 3rd in group A and B.

Quarter finals look predictable with the exception of a possible Samoa/Tonga V Fiji match up which should be good.

Australia will crush their semi opponent and then we will get the usual NZ/ENG semi which is a toss of the coin IMO. I will go with England due to the Bennett factor and then Australia to beat them in a much closer game than the opener, 20-12 or something similar.

 

[Burns]

^ the importance of an English victory in the first game is so that we can hopefully avoid the very predictable outcome of the above scenario.

 

[adamkungl]

^ the importance of an English victory in the first game is so that we can hopefully avoid the very predictable outcome of the above scenario.

An NZ loss in the pools would avoid it and looks about as likely at this point.

If Tonga finish above NZ and all other results fall as expected, we'd see semi finals of
Aus v NZ
Eng v Tonga

But on the other hand if England > Aus AND Tonga > NZ we're right back to
Eng v NZ
Aus v Tonga

 

[Burns]

Didn’t think that one through! Good luck selling Eng V Tonga in the Caketin however.

 

[adamkungl]

Didn’t think that one through! Good luck selling Eng V Tonga in the Caketin however.

It helps that half the Kiwi side plays for Tonga I guess?

And the Auckland Semi Final is at Mt Smart instead of Eden Park for reasons????????????????????
Lol the stadium selection for this tournament really is poor

 

[Valheru]

^ the importance of an English victory in the first game is so that we can hopefully avoid the very predictable outcome of the above scenario.

Yes, I know.

A prediction is what you think will happen, not what you want to happen. I can't see anything other than a comfortable Australian victory in that first fixture.

 

[Force]

For me it's:

Pool A:
Australia
England
Lebanon

France missing out by being upset by a talented Lebanon side - I would love England to light up the World Cup with a win over Australia first up but I think Australia will get through the pool undefeated.

Pool B (Pool of Death):
New Zealand
Samoa
Tonga

Scotland miss out but I can see NZ, Samoa and Tonga each losing a match to each other (paper,scissors,rock style).

Pool C:
PNG

Wales & Ireland to miss out. PNG too strong at home.This should be an entertaining pool though. I'll bet the Welsh and Irish players have never had and never will have again a RL experience like this.

Pool D:
Fiji

Italy missing out but going agonisingly close. USA to be very much outclassed in this group.

This would give us the following quarter finals:
Australia v Tonga
Samoa v Fiji (Wow)
NZ v Lebanon
England v PNG

Pretty much agree with this but I'd have Tonga beating Samoa for 2nd place in Pool B. All 3 NZ, Tonga and Samoa will have to target the Scotland game to go through.

Australia to beat Samoa, Fiji to edge Tonga, NZ to beat Lebanon and Eng to outclass PNG.
Aus v Eng final with Aus winning.

 

[Irish-bulldog]

Pretty much agree with this but I'd have Tonga beating Samoa for 2nd place in Pool B. All 3 NZ, Tonga and Samoa will have to target the Scotland game to go through.

Australia to beat Samoa, Fiji to edge Tonga, NZ to beat Lebanon and Eng to outclass PNG.
Aus v Eng final with Aus winning.

Umm don't count out Italy ! They have a gun side.

 

[Force]

Umm don't count out Italy ! They have a gun side.

They have some good players but Fiji have a better balanced side. I reckon they'll edge Italy.

 

[Clarkent]

I'm interested as to what they would spend it on/what people think they should. And bear with me this might go off on some tangents.

The RLIFs main roles as I see it:
1) Providing assistance and funding for new nations to start up or developing nations to expand their pathways
2) Providing funding and training for coaches and officials and developing nations
3) Staging international events
4) Providing funding for regional federations to do the above at a closer level.

That's all well and good, but I think a lot of nations already at WC level need to do more themselves rather than waiting for the RLIF.

Take Samoa and Tonga as an example.
Tonga have had a bunch of players 'defect' for the love of the jersey, without any financial incentive.
Samoan coach Parish has had another sook about financial incentives for the big 3 preventing his team from competing. Interesting comparison.

In the past I might have been in favour of standardised test match payments, but I've gone off the idea. Wtf have Samoa done to deserve the same payment as the Kangaroos?
The Kangaroos are at the top of the most successful Rugby competition in the world, and stage (and win) enough matches to engage fans and pay their players healthy sums.

Samoa develop no players, and basically only play games at the invite of the Kangaroos or NRL. Will Samoa improve in any way by the NRL or RLIF giving them match payment handouts? These are already professional players. It would cost $400,000 per nation to fund them on a similar level to the Roos. Surely there are better things to spend $400,000 per nation on, if someone was willing to invest this.
$400,000 would run a team out of Samoa competing in a NZ or Australian based semi-pro competition.
$400,000 would take the Samoan test squad on an annual tour of the pacific islands.
$400,000 would fund equipment, referees and coaching courses for multiple nations.

So back to what the RLIF should be doing, and what individual nations should be doing.
The RLIF (or its regional underlings) should be staging a once every 2 years regional cup for Pacific, Europe, Americas, MEA.
The RLIF should be engaging with individual nations to improve their domestic competitions and development pathways.

Samoa (and others) should be ensuring they play multiple test matches every year, especially home matches in front of their own fans. This is the only way to get fans, young players, and sponsors engaged, which in turn results in money and influence. It's no one else's responsibility to do this. Sooking about eligibility or match payments should come well after this.

And that is why the game will never grow... You've got to take a risk on the island teams... Lets be honest they're the only teams at full strength can threaten to beat the big 3... Saying Samoa don't develop their own players is joke! They're a small nation who send most of there people to Australia and new Zealand for better living that's why you see so many Pacific island kids growing up in nz and Australia playing the game! That's the closest they'll get to developing players! There is no way they can do that in there homeland! You just sound like a pityful hater! Get your head out of your ass! Rugby league can only do so much at domestic level for other nation but they'll never be as good as the players in the NRL what they need to do is grow the international game! If the big 3 and the island nation were paid the same it'll be an even playing field and well see 6 teams competing every year not this boring bullshit of a 3 nation yawn fest we have every year! International game is the future!

 

[adamkungl]

I hate the islands because I want to see them play more matches ever year, and invest in domestic competition and professional pathways before asking someone else to throw money at professional players who already play for them.
Ok then.

 

[flamin]

This would give us the following quarter finals:
Australia v Tonga
Samoa v Fiji (Wow)
NZ v Lebanon
England v PNG

All interesting matchups.

 

[Clarkent]

I hate the islands because I want to see them play more matches ever year, and invest in domestic competition and professional pathways before asking someone else to throw money at professional players who already play for them.
Ok then.

If you don't pay the players the same payments the island teams will always play second fiddle to Australia and NZ... Lets be honest island teams right now are basically a trial for these players to go up to nz and Australia.... Once all these teams get paid the same watch all the island heritage players pick island teams over these nations... Taumalolo is a big proof of that... At this rate island teams will always lose there players when they're at there peak cause the Australia and NZ will rightfully so pick them up and I don't blame them

 

[adamkungl]

If you don't pay the players the same payments the island teams will always play second fiddle to Australia and NZ... Lets be honest island teams right now are basically a trial for these players to go up to nz and Australia.... Once all these teams get paid the same watch all the island heritage players pick island teams over these nations... Taumalolo is a big proof of that... At this rate island teams will always lose there players when they're at there peak cause the Australia and NZ will rightfully so pick them up and I don't blame them

Taumololo is proof of the opposite, if anything.
5 players jumped from NZ to Tonga WITHOUT added financial incentive.
And even with equal payments, most eligible players would stick with Aus and NZ anyway.
Why?
1 - They were mostly born in and played all their junior footy in Aus and NZ.
2- Aus and NZ play 4-5 test matches against top tier opposition most years while the islands play 0-1 against each other.
These 2 issues are bigger than paying already wealthy players, which was the point of my original post.
AND if these 2 issues were solved, the money issue would be solved in turn by increased ticket sales, merch, and sponsorship opportunities.

The RLIF or NRL throwing more money at match payments is a short sighted solution to the wrong problem. The NRL claims to have a cash shortfall and it's not the RLIF's job to pay match payments for individual nations.

 

[Dakink]

Can anyone tell me the positions of who will play in Darwin? E.g. 3rd pool a v 2nd pool b or whatever it is?

 

[some11]

Saved....

I hope Samoa turns us over,Bennett gets sack and Daryl Powell takes over..

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Can anyone tell me the positions of who will play in Darwin? E.g. 3rd pool a v 2nd pool b or whatever it is?

Australia will play in Darwin. Assuming they win pool A it will be against 3rd in pool B.