Your side for for the Sharks game

[Jono078]

Well if Feleti Mateo was a Knight, it's a fair chance it wouldn't be him :lol:

Mateo came out yesterday saying Brian Smith told him he wasn't good enough for first grade.

Oh good old SuperCoach. He is a true genius that man.

That's the way, just listen to half the story.

Maybe he said at the time he wasn't good enough, or if he didn't work on a certain area he wouldn't make it?

I'm pretty sure even Feleti himself and Parra fans said he probably wasn't right a few years ago when it came to defense and fitness..

 

[Karmawave]

That's the way, just listen to half the story.

Maybe he said at the time he wasn't good enough, or if he didn't work on a certain area he wouldn't make it?

I'm pretty sure even Feleti himself and Parra fans said he probably wasn't right a few years ago when it came to defense and fitness..

Um no, Brian Smith simply didn't rate Feleti Mateo as a footballer.

We aren't just talking about any of those sh*t fringe first graders either. Mateo is Top 10 NRL talent.

It is no secret that as soon as Smith was sacked from the Eels Jason Taylor turned Jarryd Hayne into an international in half a season after Smith also refused to play him in first grade.

Smith just loves trying to be different.

Ironically, Mateo credits Michael Hagan with his success.

"I owe (former Eels coach) Michael Hagan a lot of credit for what he has done for me and giving me the opportunity and it is great to give it to everyone who said I wouldn't make it or get this far. Hopefully I have only better things to come." - Feleti Mateo

I'm sure Knights fans appreciate that... :lol:

 

[TooheysNew]

Read further. If it wasn't for Brian Smith, who would he have to prove wrong?

Criticism can be a powerful motivator.

 

[Pika]

But that wont suit Karmas story.

Fact is, Mateo was well below his potential when Smith told him that. He was well on the way to proving Smith wrong after that kick in the pants.

Some kids need cuddles and confidence to reach potential, others just need a kick in the pants. Mateo got his and has never looked back.

Smith certainly rated Mateo, I have heard he say that numerous times.

 

[Karmawave]

Read further. If it wasn't for Brian Smith, who would he have to prove wrong?

Criticism can be a powerful motivator.

Criticism and telling someone they aren't good enough to play first grade are two different things :lol:


That's why blokes like Jarryd Hayne and Feleti Mateo are playing for the Eels, and Ben Rogers and Chris Houston are playing for the Knights.

 

[Karmawave]

Smith certainly rated Mateo, I have heard he say that numerous times.

Ah the benefit of hindsight.

 

[TooheysNew]

Criticism and telling someone they aren't good enough to play first grade are two different things :lol:

Really? So it's not criticism to tell someone they aren't good enough?

 

[voltron]

Um no, Brian Smith simply didn't rate Feleti Mateo as a footballer.

We aren't just talking about any of those sh*t fringe first graders either. Mateo is Top 10 NRL talent.

It is no secret that as soon as Smith was sacked from the Eels Jason Taylor turned Jarryd Hayne into an international in half a season after Smith also refused to play him in first grade.

Smith just loves trying to be different.

Ironically, Mateo credits Michael Hagan with his success.

"I owe (former Eels coach) Michael Hagan a lot of credit for what he has done for me and giving me the opportunity and it is great to give it to everyone who said I wouldn't make it or get this far. Hopefully I have only better things to come." - Feleti Mateo

I'm sure Knights fans appreciate that... :lol:

ah the benefit of hindsight

 

[Karmawave]

Really? So it's not criticism to tell someone they aren't good enough?

Well its a form of criticism that suggests they are wasting their time even trying...

That's the context Feleti Mateo's story intended when it came to Brian Smith.


Constructive criticism and dismissive criticism are quite different.


Interesting that Meteo thanked Hagan, and not Smith.


Maybe if he said " I'd like to thank Brian for giving me the incentive I needed... "

But that wasn't the context was it.

If anything, the people he referred to as wanting to ' give it to everyone who didn't think I could make it or get this far ' was more the reference to SuperCoach Smith.

I'm sure Hayne is a big Smith fan too ;-)

At the end of the day, as I mentioned earlier, Mateo plays for the Eels, while a bloke more along the lines of Chris Houston - someone Smith actually rates - is suiting up for the Knights.

The same Brian Smith who rates Danny Wicks, didn't see the potential in Feleti Mateo?

God helps us.

 

[Pika]

Stop being daft Karma, Smith saw the potential, the same as he sees it in Wicks.

He is handling Wicks the same way he handled Mateo at the moment.

You may have a point on the rest, but saying Smith never saw the potential in Mateo is plain ridiculous.

As for Houston, I wonder how last seasons stats between the two stack up. I know House dominated the penalties haha. Seriously, I think House is quality, why is he your whipping boy in this?

 

[Jono078]

Houston was one of the top young players for the Dragons and their captain in lower grades. Rogers was unreal in the lower grades.

Just about getting the best out of them now, and that's what Smith goes for. Players with untapped potential and trying to get the best out of them.

Wicks also has potential to be the best front rower, not a typical one, more dynamic frontrower who can break out a long run after busting through the line.

 

[Karmawave]

Seriously, I think House is quality, why is he your whipping boy in this?

Because I think Houston is a boofhead who is more of a hindrance overall than a help on the footy field.

Sure he can do some really good things, but he has stupid errors in his game - whether that be giving away dumb penalties, or something else thats just sh*t.

He is also nowhere near the class of someone like Feleti Mateo.

And that alone annoys me that our signings are blokes like Houston, and not a game changing footballer.

No big names ever want to come to Newcastle, and our current coach is one of the main reasons for that.

Because blokes like Smith want to spot a diamond in the rough - Taia, Wicks, Houston - but he can't see a diamond when its right under his freaking nose - Hayne, Mateo.

 

[Burwood]

Because I think Houston is a boofhead who is more of a hindrance overall than a help on the footy field.

Sure he can do some really good things, but he has stupid errors in his game - whether that be giving away dumb penalties, or something else thats just sh*t.

What from last week's game suggests that he hasn't turned a corner this season? No stupid penalties, 1 error, most yards made by any forward in either side.

He is also nowhere near the class of someone like Feleti Mateo.
And that alone annoys me that our signings are blokes like Houston, and not a game changing footballer.

And how many players of Mateo's class should we have in the one side? Afterall, Mateo is in the top 10 talents in the NRL, and we already have Kidley. Should all 16 clubs have two players rated amongst the NRL's top 10??

No big names ever want to come to Newcastle, and our current coach is one of the main reasons for that.

Because blokes like Smith want to spot a diamond in the rough - Taia, Wicks, Houston - but he can't see a diamond when its right under his freaking nose - Hayne, Mateo.

Because every other coach in Newcastle's history has had such wonderful success signing marquee players...

The fact alone that Smith kept players like Mateo and Hayne at the club, despite thinking that they weren't talented, is enough to suggest to me that he obviously did rate them. Why else would he keep them on the club's roster and not cut them loose like he has done with countless other hacks?

 

[Spike]

This kind of sh*t can go both ways still. There's been players that have come to the Knights or found a new level under Smith. Taia and Royal off the top of my head.

 

[aqua_duck]

Ok Smith didnt give Mata'utia a go in 1st grade last year, so obviously he doesn't rate him. Wayne Bennett obviously didnt rate Ben Hunt, Freddy didn't rate Ryan Williamson. Like I've mentioned numerous times, Hayne was still eligible for SG Ball in Smith's final year at Parra, all the players mentioned above were eligible for SG Ball last year but never got a run in 1st grade, does that mean that the respective coached didn't rate them? Karma you're clutching at straws in regards to Hayne.

 

[BG]

Karma,

Smith could have easily offloaded Mateo, but he rated him big time, so he loaned him out to the London Broncos to shake him up. Mateo by his own admission was 10-15kg overweight before this and one of the laziest trainers in the lower grades let alone compared to the NRL boys.

As for Taylor being responsible for Hayne's rise. Yes, he promoted him the week after Smith left. Yes, he had told Smith Hayne was ready for first grade some weeks before (because Smith was asking him and considering it!). But Hayne was extremely young, and it was only a matter of when. Ask Taylor yourself how highly Smith rated Hayne.

You also have to remember that there was a lot of politics and an unfortunate vibe going down at the Eels in early 2006 after Smith's contract was not renewed and a lot of the players were also looking for new clubs. The club was hardly functioning under the usual Smith MO early that season.

 

[Yosh]

I totally agree with Burwood. And like in all honesty I agree noone is perfect, Smith could have made a mad mistake... HOWEVER who hasn't? Who cares if Mateo credits

Hagan for everything. Has any other player in history credited Hages for anything positive? I think if anything it was coincidence and Mateo would have shined under any

new coach. Look I like Smith much more then Hagan, however I cannot say he is a much better coach unless BSmith acutally managers to win a premiership or gets us in

a couple of Grand Finals. BSmith is not perfect however some of the things you say about him Karma is unwarrented.

 

[Joker's Wild]

No big names ever want to come to Newcastle, and our current coach is one of the main reasons for that.

Name 1 marquee player that Newcastle has bought in its entire 22 year history. This is hardly Smiths fault and suggesting so is ludicrus mate.

We breed stars, not buy them. Everyone of our Origin reps barring Kennedy and Cross have been products of the Newcastle junior system and neither of those to had played Origin before coming to the Knights.

 

[Karmawave]

Name 1 marquee player that Newcastle has bought in its entire 22 year history. This is hardly Smiths fault and suggesting so is ludicrus mate.

We breed stars, not buy them. Everyone of our Origin reps barring Kennedy and Cross have been products of the Newcastle junior system and neither of those to had played Origin before coming to the Knights.

Now that our juniors system has not had the same results in recent times, relying on the junior system doesn't cut it anymore.

We have never really had to buy from outside our own juniors because of a surplus of standouts - that is no longer the case.

Having said that, a couple of names off the top of my head who would be considered bigger name buys are:-


* Adam MacDougal came from the Roosters to go on to become an Australian Rep.

* Lee Jackson - England hooker - came to the Knights as arguably the best hooker in the world at the time in 1997 on big money ( and left one of the worst hookers :lol: )...

There was also another England rep 2nd rower or two ( Chris Joynt? - a 90s version of a Gareth Ellis )

You already touched on Ben Kennedy - but that is my point.

BK was a huge buy at the time.

You don't have to buy a superstar every year - but ONE WILL DO.

When will we ever again come up with ONE superstar offseason purchase that will stay at the club for 5 years?

Never - not while Smith is here.

Why isn't the Knights ever a realistic target for an international of the calibre of K Hunt or even a lesser name like a Greg Eastwood?!

The Knights are never even mentioned in RUMOURS - let alone serious discussions.

There's no reason we can't snap up a star Under 20's player destined for stardom either. The signings don't HAVE to be internationals right now - but destined to be would be nice. WE DON'T BUY ANYONE GOOD.

Smith plays a huge part in that.

 

[Karmawave]

Kennedy and Cross have been products of the Newcastle junior system and neither of those to had played Origin before coming to the Knights.

You might want to check those facts as well.

Ben Kennedy debuted for NSW in 1999 , when still with the Canberra Raiders.