Brown quits

[taipan]

And will 25,000 tickets make more money than 35,000? Will playing in small venues help attract sponsors? Will it help sell the event as something worth attending? The same people shitting on suburban grounds are happy to see double headers at even smaller venues with even less going for them.

And why the f**k supposed supporters of the game still can't get the name of the RLIF right is something I can't explain.

As they have money up front provided by Govts and venues,they are at least on their way to make a profit.The RLWC is not intended as a charity event.I attended the half full SFS against NZ in 2008(21,000). With venue
hire etc ,I wonder who much was made there.
Full venues regardless of the size come across better on TV than the empty seat syndrome.
If money is lost on this RLWC,then the chances of it being staged here for some time are a possibility.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

No one is saying it's not good to have full houses. But a full Mt Smart for a semi final is still embarrassing, because it's Mt Smart. A full AAMI is still weak because it's the biggest game of the tournament outside the semis and final.

Last World Cup they played the opener at the Millennium Stadium. The semis were at Wembley. Fair backward step.

 

[adamkungl]

Ive gotta say, i love how everyone has steered away from the fact that Payne and Gus tried to damage the comp and destroy this guys reputation.

Im still waiting on that answer...

Or are we all just cool with this?

I never steered away from that, I disagree with the assertion that Payne tried to damage the comp and have been pretty clear in saying I think Brown trashed his own reputation.

As for who leaked it, quite frankly I don't care. It barely even qualifies as a leak. So yes, I'm cool with this. The only person who's conduct has bothered me is Brown's.

But really - this topic has become drawn out without anything new coming up. We'd all be better served agreeing to disagree and talking about positive WC stuff. I'm done with the Brown and Payne and Sydney topics.

 

[taipan]

No one is saying it's not good to have full houses. But a full Mt Smart for a semi final is still embarrassing, because it's Mt Smart. A full AAMI is still weak because it's the biggest game of the tournament outside the semis and final.

Last World Cup they played the opener at the Millennium Stadium. The semis were at Wembley. Fair backward step.

If the Mt Smart people offered a decent amount of money and Eden Park(which I prefer) did not,you go with the financial guarantees.
A full AAMI might be weak (or tentative),but if it offers a better financial return than its larger alternative,no commercial venture in their right mind would take the lesser return.
WE would all love to have SFS/Etihad/ANZ/Newcastle stadium filled to the brim all the time for RLWCs .It doesn;t happen.
From my perspective Tv deal $10m
Stadium/Govt deals est $6m
Sponsorship ????
Travel /accommodation deals ????(costs)
Merchandise sales???
Ticketing???
Prize money(costs)

Did they fill Millennium,and were tickets heavily discounted?

In the final washout the RLWC HAS to make decent money,else you can kiss International development goodbye.

 

[Billythekid]

I feel like some posters are being real hypocrites, namely Perth Red and it's based entirely on a hatred of Sydney (like that's the only reason people are unhappy with ground selection). How can you post so incessantly about how awful suburban grounds are for the NRL and completely change your stance for the WC? So playing regular season NRL matches in suburban grounds is totally unacceptable and a terrible look for the game but playing games in them at the WC, supposedly the most prestigious tournament in RL, is completely acceptable? Not only that but playing double headers as well. It's complete double standards.

Also whilst I think a lot of us think that Sydney deserved more games, or at least should have gotten at least 1 big match lets not frame the entire argument around that.

If anything the main argument is around the size of stadiums chosen moreso than just whether or not Sydney deserved more. There will only be 2 crowds in this WC with more than 30K people attending, that is just unacceptable. We were planning to play the opener at the MCG but have now just settled for Aami, surely there was a better compromise. Playing a semi final at a ground that holds 30K or less is just laughable as well. At some point we have to show just a little ambition. I understand that playing at big grounds that are empty can be a bad look and lose money but we didn't have to be this conservative.

I'm not convinced that the double headers were a good idea or that they'll even attract bigger crowds than they would have as individual events. Time will tell I guess but I think the matches should have been kept separated. I think that certain areas missed out when they would have made ideal locations (Newcastle and SEQ come to mind). I'm not sure how much thought was put into demographics either, France vs Lebanon (plus some of the games involving the islander teams) could have drawn well in Sydney IMO.

The travelling part of the tournament has been poorly handled. Teams are being made to travel too much which is going to increase the costs dramatically. That plus it decreases the ability for people to travel with the teams and watch all the matches which will have a negative impact on crowds.

In terms of the bidding process and how matches are allocated it's hard to have a discussion without a more transparent process. How much money did each area actually bid? How long did the negotiations last and with whom did they occur? My guess is that we haven't made as much money from the bidding process as we would like to believe and that in general they were handled poorly. I guess the proof will be in the pudding, supposedly the stadium selections were made on the basis of guaranteeing the tournament profit. Well this tournament better be incredibly profitable to the point of making up for the lack of big crowds throughout the event. Maybe it's because I have become incredibly sceptical as a fan of RL and international RL but I'm not that optimistic.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

And will 25,000 tickets make more money than 35,000? Will playing in small venues help attract sponsors? Will it help sell the event as something worth attending? The same people shitting on suburban grounds are happy to see double headers at even smaller venues with even less going for them.

And why the f**k supposed supporters of the game still can't get the name of the RLIF right is something I can't explain.

And will 25,000 tickets make more money than 35,000? Including the upfront government payment and the fact that the extra 10k is hardly guaranteed, i would say yes...
Will playing in small venues help attract sponsors? I assume the million people watching on TV are more important that an extra 10k eyes at the ground
Will it help sell the event as something worth attending? In locations that NEVER get RL, yeah probably...
The same people shitting on suburban grounds are happy to see double headers at even smaller venues with even less going for them. These arent suburban ground 3 streets away from a decent stadium, these are regional locations playing the game in the best possible stadium in front of fans who never get to see an NRL game live.

No one is saying it's not good to have full houses. But a full Mt Smart for a semi final is still embarrassing, because it's Mt Smart. A full AAMI is still weak because it's the biggest game of the tournament outside the semis and final.

HISTORY says it wont be a full house!!!

Give any evidence, any at all, that says Sydney people will arrive on mass to any of these games.

Becasue all i can see are NRL games that cannot even half fill these shitty suburban grounds and rep matches that no one even notices.

Last World Cup they played the opener at the Millennium Stadium. The semis were at Wembley. Fair backward step.

Yes, it is a shame that NSW Government didnt bid for a Double Header opening at ANZ.

Take it up with your local member.....

 

[East Coast Tiger]

What a load of bullshit.

So millions of MORE people are going to watch a game on TV at a smaller venue? Good luck explaining that one. The size of the venue won't impact the ratings at all. It WILL impact the crowds. So clearly the end result is less people going to games and less money made through the gates.

And every venue announced has hosted NRL games in the past 12 months. So that's bullshit. The only venue that has not is Port Moresby.

And as others have said, only three games in the entire tournament can get more than 30,000. Only two can get more than 35,000. That's pathetic. It tells the world this event is small time and the organisers have no confidence in it. I'm sure sponsors and fringe fans will jump at the chance to be part of something like that..

 

[taipan]

What a load of bullshit.

So millions of MORE people are going to watch a game on TV at a smaller venue? Good luck explaining that one. The size of the venue won't impact the ratings at all. It WILL impact the crowds. So clearly the end result is less people going to games and less money made through the gates.

And every venue announced has hosted NRL games in the past 12 months. So that's bullshit. The only venue that has not is Port Moresby.

And as others have said, only three games in the entire tournament can get more than 30,000. Only two can get more than 35,000. That's pathetic. It tells the world this event is small time and the organisers have no confidence in it. I'm sure sponsors and fringe fans will jump at the chance to be part of something like that..

It tells the world these matches are played all over Australia/PNG and NZ.The sight of half full stadiums BTW is not a good look,and NRL has had more than their share this year.
So very venue announced has already established a presence(NRL) and interest in the respective venues.
One of the top NRL TV ratings on Fox involved the Sharks at their home ground last year,and the ground was nowhere near full and it has a max 20,000 capacity.
The real question is would less people going to bigger venues(not full) that cost more to utilise ,be a better proposition than smaller venues packed and where money has been provided up front on the table plus better chance to fill the stadiums in new areas.
I don't believe Brown was that stupid ,not to take the position that secured the better income.The same guy was involved in other tournaments ,so IMO is hardly a novice.Sensitive yes,so what.

You can bet your biped we will be the first to whine if the tournament loses money and RLWCS are put in the too hard basket.

 

[Perth Red]

Fact is you have no idea what the deals on the table were. The only logical reason that they have chosen the venues they have is the business case was much stronger. Presumably in the few places that have options ie Auckland and Melbourne the cost of hiring bigger stadiums didn't stack up with the projected ticket sale increases.

Everything else was a bid issue so Newcastle didn't get a game but cairns did because cairns stumped up more cash than the difference in ticket sales compared to playing at Newcastle. It is pretty naive to think that the RLWC organisers have based decisions on anything other than projected profit margins.

I'm sorry to see brown go, he seems a very shrewd operator that has done some great looking host stadium deals to sell games and tv coverage for the tournament. The fact he is gone due to, in part, inappropriate actions of a small time suburban club having an inappropriate dummy spit is even more galling but par for the course for rugby league which manages to not only consistently shoot itself in the foot but blow all its bloody toes off!

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Like alienating the majority of its supporters in its biggest market.

That's like taking off its whole leg.

 

[Perth Red]

Last RLWC avg was 16,734 with six crowds over 20k.

We've potentially got seven or eight games that could break 20k.

Such a shame PNG doesn't have a massive stadium! Is their capacity still 17k?

I'd expect our qtrs to total more than 2013 57k
Semis slightly higher than 2013 67k if both sell out
Final will be lower with 20k less capacity

2013 was a very successful tournament, especially the support Australia and NZ games got so not easy to beat the crowd avg but not impossible

 

[Perth Red]

Like alienating the majority of its supporters in its biggest market.

That's like taking off its whole leg.

Welcome to the rest of the countries everyday RL experience lol. You can always take the opportunity to visit somewhere in Aus and NZ and enjoy the RLWC?

You got two games, stop whinging. You still haven't said how they could have spun it if after the nsw govt backtracked on the deal if they had just handed games free to NSW? How do you think the hosts that have paid millions would have responded?

 

[East Coast Tiger]

I won't be going to any games. Sydney isn't even the closest one to me by the way so to say I "got two games" is nonsense. I don't even like Sydney or feel any connection to it whatsoever.

It's your mate who f**ked up the deal. The NSW govt offered $4m. Why did it die in the arse?

All of this has shown up your ridiculous hypocrisy even more than ever before. You have one agenda and that's Perth. Nothing else. You bitch about no Perth NRL team to the point of slagging off suburban grounds but then support even smaller, shittier grounds hosting World Cup games. Then you tell other people that if they want to watch games to get on a plane. Hello! And you blindly back an administrator who wasn't even smart enough to keep a job with the NRL to the point of assuming he has done the best deal possible but reject any notion the NRL has done the same thing by ignoring expansion to Perth. When your agenda is so obvious you can't hope to have any credibility.

My only agenda is growing and promoting the sport. Ensuring the biggest market the sport has gets 2 games out of 28, putting big games in small grounds and playing double headers at venues barely fit to even host at all are all contrary to that aim. And the financial argument doesn't even stack up, not when you factor in how many tickets they have ensured they can't sell, how many fans they have alienated, how much bad publicity they have brought on themselves (not Payne, themselves) and in turn how many potential sponsors will be influenced by the small time attitude and poor engagement with the biggest market in the country.

 

[Perth Red]

So it's Browns fault nsw govt pulled the deal?

No hypocrisy. Darwin paid $1million for the QF. They can play it in a paddock for that sort of money for all I care. It will be played at tio and will be packed to the rafters.

Only stadiums you could criticise are cairns, Darwin and possibly Christchurch. The $'s paid to host compensates adequately for the choice of those sub standard stadiums.

Only other debate is the opener and semi venues but as we are not aware of cost of hire v anticipated ticket sales it would just be speculation so I'll go with the judgement of a team with the facts headed by one of the countries leading sports event administrators.

Then finally we have NSW, and this simply came down to nsw govt not willing to pay hosting rights. The RLWC was never going to f**k over cities that have paid millions of $'s to host by giving games free to Sydney so really had its hands tied by the nsw govt's BS.

In the ideal world nsw govt would have paid for two round games in western Sydney, QF in Newcastle and semi or final in Sydney. The fact they didn't is a cluster f**k for RL fans in NSW, but for the millionth time that isn't the NRL or Browns fault.

What any of this has to do with NRL expansion to Perth I have no fcking idea lol.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

If I look back at the 2008 WC I won't find you whinging that Perth didn't get any games even though the WA govt didn't offer enough?

There isn't a more transparent poster on here.

You don't even know the figures involved, but you'll blindly follow what the organisers did. Yet you reject entirely what the NRL decides re expansion. One administration, blind support. The other, blind opposition. What's the motive? We already know.

 

[Perth Red]

if the RLWC wasn't able to sell hosting rights and the NRL were choosing venues purely on ticket sales and strategic placement I'd be unhappy if we didnt get a game. Knowing that we now have a product that we can sell to host cities for millions of $'s, if Perth didn't get a game because WA govt didn't bid then I'd be pissed, but at the wa govt, not the NRL.

It is in the media NT govt paid $1million.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-19/darwin-set-to-host-rugby-league-world-cup-match/7642670

Not blindly, just choosing to follow most likely reality. None of us will know until post event how successful it has or hasn't been, but I am very happy with how it is playing out so far.


Of course I have an agenda re NRL expansion, I want a local club to follow every week, I want to see the NRL bigger with a wider reach, I want to see RL in WA reach new heights in popularity and participation, as a RL fan living in Perth I am not ashamed by my agenda at all. What any of that has to do with nsw govt refusing to bid for prominent RLWC games Or the RLWC losing a CEO that has delivered some great results so far I have no idea!

 

[PaulyTom]

Sydney got 2 games and have approx 100k tickets to sell.

That's more tickets than all but 1 host City and that's Brisbane (in total seats across the tournament). Don't go off number of games , go off total number of seats.

If Sydney Siders say they like International football they will attend one of the 2 games and fill the SFS to capacity.

 

[siv]

I am not sure how playing RL in 40 degree heat in Darwin and Cairns is going to be good

 

[PaulyTom]

Average temps in both will be between 24-32 degrees in both destinations. If played in the evening expect about 24-26 degrees which is I believe a reasonable temperature to play in.

I am not sure how playing RL in 40 degree heat in Darwin and Cairns is going to be good

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

What a load of bullshit.

So millions of MORE people are going to watch a game on TV at a smaller venue? Good luck explaining that one. The size of the venue won't impact the ratings at all. It WILL impact the crowds.

Can you even f*cking read, mate??

So clearly the end result is less people going to games and less money made through the gates.

Luckily, that million dollars upfront will more than offset this...

And every venue announced has hosted NRL games in the past 12 months. So that's bullshit. The only venue that has not is Port Moresby.

And as others have said, only three games in the entire tournament can get more than 30,000. Only two can get more than 35,000. That's pathetic. It tells the world this event is small time and the organisers have no confidence in it. I'm sure sponsors and fringe fans will jump at the chance to be part of something like that..

I had no idea you wanted the RLIF to go broke...

That is an interesting approach to RL development, i must say.