Dragons In No Hurry To Sign Mary

Discussion in 'St George Illawarra Dragons' started by possm, Apr 13, 2017.

  1. ALSGI

    ALSGI Juniors

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    OT,
    There is nothing reticent about OV's comments while yours are annoyingly reticent but more balanced and enjoyable.

    My main point was that many of us are enjoying a diiferent Dragons and whilst it may well be a false dawn as you put it some of us are entitled to be basking in the morning shunshine and be optimistic about the rest of the year.

    Some of us are happy to wipe egg and acknowledge the remarkable transition with our team well on the way to surpassing our 10 wins in 2016.

    Winning 6/7 allows optimists such as me to experience some euphoria that's sadly been missing for 6 years, even during our early 2015 run there wasn't the enjoyable footy that we're now watching.

    The Dragons are literally on fire and we don't need to be reminded of 2016 or previous years every time some one applauds players, coaches or Club.

    As for Sir Winston I'm a bit more than a quick study and yes he was stubornly wrong about plenty of things but also one of the greatest leaders in history. He certainly wasn't wrong about the 'skulls' mate Adolf before the war.

    Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm.
    If you're going through hell, keep going.
    You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.

    Sir Winston Churchill.
     
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  2. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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  3. ALSGI

    ALSGI Juniors

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    I think we've learned from history and we're making history with a minor premiership and good show in the finals.

    If that sort of wild optimism is allowed on here.
     
  4. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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    Allowed?! Lol dude, this is how pretty much every exchange has gone on here in the last 2 weeks:

    Optimists (self-professed) - yay, we rock, gun' go buy me some GF tix.
    Realists - We are going well after 7 rounds, but we still have weaknesses in XYZ positions. Also, remember 2015.
    Optimists - HEY, f**k OFF, WE'RE PERF. MARY 4EVA.
    OV - Mary sux y'all.
    The Doc - *generic meltdown*

    Rule of thumb - no one is 'allowed' to say anything in here. ANything put in writing is subject to ridicule, be it positive or negative!
     
  5. Crush

    Crush Juniors

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    Hahaha, that was quite good.
    I think there is also room in there for pessimist though.
    Optimists- grandfinal here we come!
    Realist- steady on boys, its only round 7
    Pessimist- we are doomed!
    OV- Mary Apologists! Mediocrity! BLAH!
     
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  6. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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    Possum: TPAs
     
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  7. Old Timer

    Old Timer Bench

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    Not disagreeing with your main point as I am also enjoying the current situation and am also optimistic but have been around long enough not to get the cart in front of the horse.
    I try to be objective in my posts and try to see things from all sides.
    Whilst 6 wins from 7 games is a damned fine start I am not willing to say we are now in clear water and have smooth sailing ahead.
    No doubt I am curious as to how others come to that conclusion so easily in light of recent history as I think the jury is still out and if people see that as negative well I think they are wrong to assume that.
    To that end I believe that you are not quite interpreting my posts correctly but time to move on.

    In respect of Churchill
    You are entitled to your opinion but I cannot share it.
    IMO his failings in WW1 stand like a beacon and the unwarranted waste of life a blot on his Facebook page forever.
    If not for John Curtin's (thank god he was in and not Menzies) strong leadership further loss of Australian lives was on the cards due to more mistaken strategy by Churchill in WW2.
    In any ways Churchill's situation is not unlike Mary's.
    Many WW2 people will say he saved the day and what a glorious leader he was whilst many will also say that he cost endless lives due to failed strategy in WW1 and no amount of success in WW2 can ever be used to substitute for previous failures.
    All a matter of perspective really.
     
  8. The Doc

    The Doc Juniors

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    Funny how you imitate the supporters of the team, or optimists as you call them, as being yobbos, and the apparent realists as being so calm and laid back.
    Just a few things, when has any "optimist" said he is "gun go buy som GF tix"?
    Lets call a spade a spade shall we?
    Iv noticed a few, myself included, constantly say "no one is saying our management is all fixed"...
    What we say is, lets give the boys and mary some credit where its due.
    After all, we fans spent the entire off season complaining about the last few years (rightfully so).
    We demanded a team that wins. A team that is nore competitive. ..
    Guess what? We got it.
    The team is coming first and literally kicking ass.
    We say lets give them credit qhere credit is due.
    The so called realists wanna jump on and still sook about the last 5 years.
    Iv said many times, maybe the wheels will fall off, maybe the bubble will burst...
    But by the same token, maybe those wheels stay on... maybe that bubble doesnt burst.
    Why is it that we can get shot down because of our positive views, which we have because of the teams CURRENT success...
    But the ones that just sit and dont acknowledge anything at all about this year because "we were shit last year" are made untouchable?
    In 2015 the raiders finished 10th.
    Had ricky stuart as coach.
    In 2016 how did they go with that same shit coach?
    Im sure many were waiting for there bubble to bust.
    It didnt.
    Whos to say we wont have a similiar year this year?
    Why must we be negative towards the team?
    If we win this week ill be f#cked if im gunna sit here all sad with a "why be happy, we are gunna lose eventually" mentality.
    F#ck that dude, we win, im smiling.
    Iv got faith the team will keep this up.
    We will lose a couple of games here and there, but that wont break my spirit.
    I was marys biggest critic in the off season.
    Right now, im his biggest fan.
    He has my team coming first.
    He has my team winning games.
    F#ck 2011... f#ck 2012.... f#ck 2013
    F#ck 2014... f#ck 2015... and f#ck 2016....
    We are in 2017... and mary has my team coming first... winning games... and has given me bragging rights so far this year!!!
    Maybe its time you boys jump on board the 2017 dragons train.
    Stop disrespecting the 2017 playes by taking away from there accomplishments because of issues you have with management.
    Thats really not a big ask.
    Think about it.
    And p.s.... its no meltdown champ.
    Its a proud fan sticking up for his team for the efforts they have given in 2017.
    Now excuse me while i order some GF tix ;-)
     
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  9. Dragons 09

    Dragons 09 Juniors

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    Love the passion Doc, good for you!......i'm enjoying the ride myself also, with some cautious optimism laced with a suitable amount of reality, allows me to grin like a Cheshire Cat for now but not at a point where i will start sticking sharp objects in my eyes if the wheels fall off.

    Have to be honest though, i saw a response of yours on another thread (can't remember which one) and I seriously thought it was an A-grade Tourettes outburst.....made me chuckle like a little biatch:D
     
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  10. possm

    possm First Grade

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    I like what you have said and if it's true, it could very well be a great model. My life's experience tells me that major figures in an organisation need to have the smarts and capacity to ensure their side of the bargin is carried out to the highest standard.

    I'm sure if we were trying to attract a top line coach, he would be positively moved by such a concept if:
    We had a dynamic Board in place.
    We had a very smart CEO in place.
    We had a great recruitment team in place.
    We had a great NRL squad in place.

    If the all of the above was in place, I'm sure the coach would welcome a team like that who would take care of the ancillary items of coaching.

    Now let's see what we have at the Dragons:
    A tired old boy Board who are more interested in their own security.
    A CEO who has stayed on way past his used by date.
    A head coach who he would find it easy to do a better job than.
    A Recuitment/Pathways Director who has conjured up such a great mess in his first year.

    I say put the professional people in place and then move to the NFL model. It just won't work with the people we currently have at the Club.
     
  11. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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    The point I was making (with tongue firmly planted in cheek) is that each side of the story (optimists, pessimists, realists and so on) spends half their time complaining that their views are under attack. Of course I made out like the realists are calm and measured, its part of the tongue-in-cheek part!
    Those of us who are overly positive complain about people bringing them back down to earth.
    Those who are trying to remain grounded and cautious complain that they get accused of not enjoying the wins.
    Then of course there are those, like yours truly, who complain about people complaining!
    Neither are wrong. THat's the point of the forum, Everything said here is subject to attack and ridicule, it's how it should be (with the occasional discussion of football here and there)!

    Lighten up Doc, we are coming first! ;)
     
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  12. The Doc

    The Doc Juniors

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    Lol i remember that outburst.
    It was when a heap on here just went negative on the team even though we'd won.
    Lol i hate that shit. Im obviously very different to many on here.
    As much as management shits me, i actually support the team. Not management.
    Anyways.... slowly but surely every negative suicidal parrot on here will have no choice but to compliment the team and even mary.
    Like iv said... we will lose a few here and there, thats inevitable, but will finish top 4 with ease.
    Anyone who still complains when that happens, well, what can i say?
    Hahaha ill just sit back and keep smiling that my team has turned the corner.
    Ill rather cheer them on around that corner rather then hold them back with my negativity.
    2017 so far has been our year.
    Im a believer that it will continue being our year.
    I'll just happily continue enjoying the wins. Theres plenty more coming ;-)
     
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  13. The Doc

    The Doc Juniors

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    Mate, i get what your saying.
    But, heres my take on it.
    Hate the board all you like (not you directly, everyone).
    Im no fan of the boards or club management either.
    But.... heres a realists point of view.
    If your not willing to get up off your ass and take action for something that pisses you off so much, just shut up about it sometimes.
    Stop letting it consume your every breath.
    The facts are the facts. From a football team perspective... mary has the team coming first.
    So.... why does the shitty job the board and mamagememt has done in the last 5 or so years have to take away from the teams performance so far?
    Iv never told anyone they are wrong for having an issue with the board.
    But as a die hard fan of the team, i cant stand people not giving the team credit for what its achieved so far.
    And that includes Mary.
    Like it or not, He is the coach after all.
    All off season every so called realist stated they wanted a team that wins, that is competive.
    Guess what? Thats right. These same guys need to take a look at the NRL table.
    If someone lets there hatred of doust and the board take away the joy of there team winning... then f#ck, the teams in alot of trouble.
    They play for the fans, when thats no longer good enough.... then what?
    Be negative when its called for, and give credit when its called for.
    Its pretty simple really.
     
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  14. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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    Aahhh, see now you are overlapping the realists and the pessimists.
    There are a lot of people happy with the results, but firm in the stance that they dont wipe out what has happened the last 5 years and the fact that no one other than Price has been held accountable for it.
    There are a lot of people happy with the results, but still recognising the issues with the team that could be improved.
    There are a lot of people happy with the results, but wary of the fact that we were on a 7 game winning streak and top of the table in Round 12 2015 and ended up scraping into the finals after the biggest losing streak in the clubs history, under this very same coach.
    Then there's the cranky pants people!

    Gotta recognise the difference!
     
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  15. Dragon Revival

    Dragon Revival Juniors

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    Possum while I agree with some of your sentiments you seem to have a vendetta against Mc Gregor or the Illawarra. The Dragons have done a complete turnaround this year and
    Mac Gregor has the following successs rates:-
    2015 50%
    2016 42%
    2017 84%
    From 2015 to date the success rate is currently at 51%. Yet you want to upset the applecart and bring in a new coach
    who will put the Club through the cleaners after five years of total upheaval. Bellamy, Bennett, Maguire and Robinson have had an unfair
    advantage both financially and NRL support wise. You advocate to go through turmoil again from 2018 onwards. You need to come out of your tree and wake up to yourself as your
    strategy is destructive. All us Dragons
    supporters want is for our team to play to the the best of their ability and to win a majority share of the games by playing attractive football. If you succeed in your quest for unnecessaty
    change you will.be first to scream out if your so called better coach stuffs up which is quite likely. I say that if it is working well and not broken leave it alone. As an old Bexley North boy I suggest that you hibernate for rest of the football season and let the Dragons machine get on with destroying the pretenders and their prima donna football coaches most of whom must be a pain to put up with due to their
    selfish natures.
     
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  16. possm

    possm First Grade

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    Just what I've been saying 'It's a mess' and Coyne needs to get back in there and sort it out.
     
  17. possm

    possm First Grade

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    No vendetta against anyone. Just banging on about what I see a wrong within the Club/Team. I am extremely happy with the way the Dragons are playing now - so proud. But I am tired of this old boy thing where incompetent people are put in very important positions at the Club and don't have the necessary skills to do the job properly. It's just a wink and a nod and off you go.

    I understand everyone by now has had enough of the Millward thing and the TPA thing. Along with the Board thing, the Doust thing and the Mary Young and Hornby thing, I suppose I've had enough and want a change. I really want skilled, capable and clever people to be running our Club.
     
  18. The Doc

    The Doc Juniors

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    Your almost there benny.
    You see it... your just struggling to grasp it.
    The teams performance so far in 2017... has nothing to do with 2016.
    Or 2015... or 2014...
    The raiders finished 2015 in 10th spot, true?
    Then in 2016 went on a unbelievable run.... true?
    Everyone was waiting for them to stumble and fall and the bubble to burst.
    After all, pretty much same team and same coach... true?
    Did it happen?
    We signed Vaughan, almost every single member on here lost there mind over it!!!
    Management f#cked up big time with that signing they all said.
    He was a reserve grader at best they said....
    What happened there?
    McInness... some laughed at management for signing the hooker that couldnt crack first grade at souths...
    What happened there?
    Heres one even better...
    Tim Lafai... Mary said he trained the house down in pre season... as a coach he gave him first shot.
    Everyone jumped on Marys throat for that. Myself included.
    I can honestly say this humble pie is tasting f#cking delicious.
    Mary got it right... i got it wrong.
    McCrone at half has worked so far.
    Mary got it right... i got it wrong.
    Vaughan signing?
    Mary got it right... i got it wrong.
    McInness....
    Mary got it right... i got it wrong.
    I thought the team would struggle to be 3 from 7 to start the year...
    Mary has us 6 wins from 7 games...
    Mary got it right... i got it wrong.
    See the pattern?
    Mary seems to know what he is doing so far.
    Some will say no he doesnt.
    The NRL ladder says yes he does.
    He has a team playing some pretty good football.
    He has a team coming first in 2017.
    He has the best attacking team.
    What do last years failures have to do with these facts?
    The bulldogs ended last year on a losing run... and started this year the same.
    A couple of wins and last year is forgotten.
    The raiders failed in 2015... yet in 2016, 2015 was forgotten.
    Why is it only our fans keep the stick wedged up there backsides?
    Tell me... what if we continue winning? What if come round 16-17 we are still sitting pretty on top?
    Are most going to still be negative because of management?
     
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  19. BennyV

    BennyV Coach

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    For the most part, TL;DR.

    Our 2017 performance doesnt have much to do with our 2016 performance, but if we are judging Mary overall as a coach then we have to account for his full tenure, including big winning streaks (now and 2015) and big losing streaks (2015 and 2016). We also have to look past the numbers and look at where he actually struggles, whether that has been fixed and if so, how? For the moment, he has egg of many a face with the way the team is playing but there are still holes, despite coming first, and many of us are wary of those holes being exploited, like they were in 2015.
    I know you werent around these parts back then, but the general vibe on our winning streak was 'if we were blowing teams off the park, I would be worried, but we are winning ugly and that is what's needed to win a premiership'. In truth, as longa s we are winning people will look to say that the way we are winning will take us all the way. In 2015, it didnt, and while I'm loving being at the top (the A1 ladder I tape to the wall of my office at work every week will tell you) there's concerns about this year too.

    I dont give a f**k what raiders or bulldogs fans thought in 2015 or 2016. I care about my team!

    Oh, and many people didnt dispute the signing of Vaughan and McInnes. There were some of us who were cheering. In addition, I really liked the idea of signing Lafai last year (just ask OT!) and while I was against him starting this year, it seems my jubilation was simply a year early!
     
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  20. Crush

    Crush Juniors

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    Optimists: We are a different team this year! 2017 is our year! Mary was right!

    Realist: Steady on, remember 2015 we were in a similar position and look how that turned out

    Pessimist: The wheels are falling off! We need a real coach! We are doomed!

    OV: You're all pathetic! Short memories!

    OT: Actually OV is partially correct. You do all have short memories. I have spoken.
     
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