What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Stephen Kearney

carcharias

Immortal
Messages
43,120
With Rtvs Foran and Johnson and Isaac in the team you'd think they could at least compete.
Last week was worse than this week.

Bellamy would have that team coming top 4 and being a threat.
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
With Rtvs Foran and Johnson and Isaac in the team you'd think they could at least compete.
Last week was worse than this week.

Bellamy would have that team coming top 4 and being a threat.

Bellamy would have to be the most respected coach by NZ'ers due the work he does with their forwards, if he thought he could find Halves in the joint devoid of the bash'n'barge mentally and brought up on finesse he would have done so by now

Stacey Jones's size dictated brains over brawn, an anomaly in NZ RL, while ever Kearney's mob persevere with 'crowd favourites' and don't import more 'Maloneys' 2011 will not be replicated. Foran might had of sufficed had he wanted to be there . . . can you blame him for not wanting to be second fiddle
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
With Rtvs Foran and Johnson and Isaac in the team you'd think they could at least compete.
Last week was worse than this week.

Bellamy would have that team coming top 4 and being a threat.

No forward pack really negates the spine. No spine can compete off the back of that foundation. Not to say they haven't been shit too, but they're getting no help up front.
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Warriors U20s 0 & 11.

Kearney is infectious.

Always got great juniors but this is terrible!

"Great" is a questionable term. Warriors juniors are much like Hollywood blockbusters. People get excited, they see potential, they buy in, and then afterwards when they sit back and watch they might have been entertained but realise it was all style and no substance.
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
"Great" is a questionable term. Warriors juniors are much like Hollywood blockbusters. People get excited, they see potential, they buy in, and then afterwards when they sit back and watch they might have been entertained but realise it was all style and no substance.
Mainly because their methodology is limited, if a Warriors juniors team was to be coached by Cronk or Thurston finesse might become contagious
 

carcharias

Immortal
Messages
43,120
No forward pack really negates the spine. No spine can compete off the back of that foundation. Not to say they haven't been shit too, but they're getting no help up front.

Warriors and forwards should be the least of their problems
A good coach ...he'll ..even a pleb like me ...could work out those big kiwis need fitness and to run hard and straight then let those back kill it.

They look like they don't even care.
What the hell is Kearney saying at training and before games?
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
Warriors and forwards should be the least of their problems
A good coach ...he'll ..even a pleb like me ...could work out those big kiwis need fitness and to run hard and straight then let those back kill it.

They look like they don't even care.
What the hell is Kearney saying at training and before games?
You're right, Kearney can't be saying the right things, the Warriors aren't making the best of what they've got. When Jones was pointing the way his forwards followed his line of sight and ripped in. Kearney's forwards need eyes in the back of their heads
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Mainly because their methodology is limited, if a Warriors juniors team was to be coached by Cronk or Thurston finesse might become contagious

That's over simplifying things to say that horrible development pathways (across the board in nzrl), and poor/lazy talent identification (Warriors) can be overcome by a magic bullet of Yoda like wisdom from a great player.
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Warriors and forwards should be the least of their problems
A good coach ...he'll ..even a pleb like me ...could work out those big kiwis need fitness and to run hard and straight then let those back kill it.

They look like they don't even care.
What the hell is Kearney saying at training and before games?

You lost me at "big" Kiwis. Since 2011 the Warriors pack has probably gotten smaller while so many other sides have gotten bigger.

And they are running straight, one out, turning to marshmallow on contact.

I do agree though that it "should" be the least of their problems,, but then that brings me back to my other post about development and talent identification.
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
That's over simplifying things to say that horrible development pathways (across the board in nzrl), and poor/lazy talent identification (Warriors) can be overcome by a magic bullet of Yoda like wisdom from a great player.
Need to start somewhere ol'mate, in tiny tot RL in Australia little smart blokes develop, less and less unfortunately, because they have to come up against Islander heritage kids twice their size. Can't imagine many tiny tots in NZ, no reason to develop footy beyond run hard

I could be wrong but there aren't too many Thurston/Cronk/Maloney's in Australia either, takes a special type of little bloke to run today's gauntlet. Nothing to do with anything but attitude, thinking outside the square is what's needed
 

Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,902
I honestly thought with the spine they have they would have put something together this season.

That said, Luke is a shadow of the player he was a few years ago and Johnson is a touch footy player.

Who'll be the next coach there?
 

DiegoNT

First Grade
Messages
9,378
Always found it weird that the team that has been the most successful in the under 20s has also been one of the worst at getting young players to be established first graders.

Maybe over the time they've focused too much in making their youngsters to be great u20's players instead of focusing on them being good first graders
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
The next coach will have to be able to survive after making unpopular decisions . . . can that be in NZ
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Need to start somewhere ol'mate, in tiny tot RL in Australia little smart blokes develop, less and less unfortunately, because they have to come up against Islander heritage kids twice their size. Can't imagine many tiny tots in NZ, no reason to develop footy beyond run hard

I could be wrong but there aren't too many Thurston/Cronk/Maloney's in Australia either, takes a special type of little bloke to run today's gauntlet. Nothing to do with anything but attitude, thinking outside the square is what's needed

No arguments there. When we were dominating NYC in 2011 someone posted the height/weight of the players when they played the Raiders I believe. Warriors forwards were a little bigger but the difference was negligible. However, the backs were on average, 10 kilos heavier and 3-4 centimetres taller.

That's how the Warriors won NYC, by essentially having a dozen forwards on the field just running over people as they developed. First grade comes along and it's a lot harder to do that to men.
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
No arguments there. When we were dominating NYC in 2011 someone posted the height/weight of the players when they played the Raiders I believe. Warriors forwards were a little bigger but the difference was negligible. However, the backs were on average, 10 kilos heavier and 3-4 centimetres taller.

That's how the Warriors won NYC, by essentially having a dozen forwards on the field just running over people as they developed. First grade comes along and it's a lot harder to do that to men.
I remember when 'bellyache' coached Junior League he used to tell parents unsure of their skinny kids' welfare that one day size will even out, if their boy really wants to play the game think about everything he does . . . thinking wins games more often than not
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Always found it weird that the team that has been the most successful in the under 20s has also been one of the worst at getting young players to be established first graders.

Maybe over the time they've focused too much in making their youngsters to be great u20's players instead of focusing on them being good first graders

I can break it down for you based on my opinion of what the big issues are. Some involves limitations of the environment and others are completely at the feet of the Warriors.

First thing is to break the myth that the Warriors have a whole country to themselves in regards to talent. That's like saying the QLD/NSW Union sides should dominate because they have a whole state (which is size/population comparative to NZ). In reality we know that the best players end up playing league more often than not because that's what they dream of and aspire to. The reverse is true for the Warriors because we know how much Union dominates the minds of most Kiwis when it comes to sport.

The second limitation is that in Australia there's SG ball/Jersey flegg etc which give players a higher standard of competition and better standard of coaching at a very young age. Over in Warrior land the coaching and standard of competition is just not there for these guys so they start behind. Added to that the way Union tries to restrict players from playing league and it's a fight just to keep players, let alone develop them properly. Too often it seems like Warrior players feel like they've made it just by reaching first grade with no real hunger to go further.

What this does is create a third limitation where in the past we've gone after junior union players (Hurrell, Kata, Laumape, Vete etc) and while they're physical specimens and have obvious physical talents, we're not getting to them until they're far along in their development. When we were dominating NYC we were doing that based on guys just being bigger and running over the opposition. This does nothing to prepare players for NRL, which is problem one of the Warriors poor development in the past.

The net result there is that you win NYC trophies, but players don't actually start learning to play rugby league until they're already in first grade. That's never going to work out well and is a big part of the reason why so many of our players are rocks and diamonds.

Problem 2 with the Warriors is their piss poor talent identification in the past. They almost exclusively grab players from South Auckland. While teams like the Storm/Panthers/Dogs etc are scouting the country looking for the next NAS or JFH. The Warriors just mosey on down to South Auckland, wait to be wowed by a physical specimen and pat themselves on the back because somehow this one will be different.

This further kills the "whole country to themselves" argument because the Warriors have often been too lazy to utilise the entire country.

In recent years we have improved our pathways, putting our best talent in NSW Cup and using NYC to blood 17 year olds rather than trying to win it. With NYC leaving I know the Warriors are attempting to get entry into SG Ball/Jersey Flegg etc, but no idea how close that is to becoming a reality.

Long story short, Kearney might not be the solution here, but like most Warriors coaches he's being handed a nice looking product that has serious fundamental design flaws and then is expected to go out and sell them. Half the reason the Warriors probably can't get a decent coach is that the decent coaches are smart enough to say "Yeah, nah, f**k that."
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
I remember when 'bellyache' coached Junior League he used to tell parents unsure of their skinny kids' welfare that one day size will even out, if their boy really wants to play the game think about everything he does . . . thinking wins games more often than not

Preaching to the choir on that one.

Anyone who watches the Warriors play can see that beyond desire/heart/will to win, they lack awareness, have almost no anticipation and poor reaction times. None of them actually see where the danger is coming before it's already on or passed them. I honestly believe if football IQ was something that could be measured then the Warriors would be bottom of the class, and I'm not just talking this year.

Although wins kind of provide a reasonable measure so the Warriors record there will suffice.
 
Top