Eels Attack Analysis

[Joshuatheeel]

What is good is a blog about footy that causes us to think and have opinions, not Pou using stats to prove whatever, euphemisms and other nonsense. This is a refreshing idea, footy talk , goodness me how novel

nothing wrong with stats, sometimes proves our assumptions are correct / incorrect

 

[TheRam]

If a team gets beaten by 50 the coach can't escape criticism. BA hasn't when its happened to us.

When you have a track record as good as Bennett, then maybe something else, like the roster, is more pertinent. I recall the great Jack Gibson, had 50 put on his teams as well when he was coaching weaker rosters too. We don't have a weak roster by anyone's judgment. So maybe we need to look at other explanations?

 

[Noise]

You seem hung up on specific examples, despite only ever using generalisations to describe your own points.

Here you go:

2020 Rd 6 v Roosters. There is a particularly good example in the 68th minute.

2020 Rd 14 v Dragons. Absolute pig of a game but pay close attention to how we play in the 2nd half. Side to side like a f**ken yo-yo when all we had to do was go through the f**ken middle!

2019 Rd 10 v Cowboys. I reckon we do it at least 4 times in the first half.

2019 Rd 13 v Sharks. I remember screaming at the telly during this game, begging them to stop.

Fair play for finding those examples. I reckon we attacked differently in 19/20 with Brown on the left and Moses on the right.

But my comments regarding our attacking structure of forwards generally dominating and then predictably working to the right post for a left shift is something that has occurred much more (too much more) in 2021 since Moses and Brown swapped sides.

 

[Noise]

Do any of the top 5 teams have their halves as far away from the dummy half as what we do?

A long pass from dummy half might sound beneficial, but I'm not seeing this making our attack more efficient...if anything it is a hindrance. All our attack that leads to a break or try seems to come from shorter passes from dummy half, not long ones.

Yep, that's a good point. That long pass give the defence around the ruck plenty of time to slide and adjust. The long pass would be better off 1 or 2 passes wide of the ruck with attackers moving forward so those tight defenders can't slide out as easily which may result in more one on ones on the edge with more space between defenders out wide.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Fair play for finding those examples. I reckon we attacked differently in 19/20 with Brown on the left and Moses on the right.

But my comments regarding our attacking structure of forwards generally dominating and then predictably working to the right post for a left shift is something that has occurred much more (too much more) in 2021 since Moses and Brown swapped sides.

Thats a fair point.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Yes they are capable. They are first grade footballers. Two of our spine have played origin in the last 12 months and a third would have if he didn’t get injured. They are more than capable of organizing and executing a long shift on back to back plays. The problem is the game plan wants them to get to the post then shift left ever time we are attacking the line. And when that doesn’t work kick and hope.

Not all players have the same level of skill or even the same strengths, even between players in the same position. For us this means we have a very simple (i.e. limited options) game plan to suit our dumb/inexperienced spine. We play to our strengths, and that is good coaching.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I know you don't like Murphy but maybe the players aren't as talented as you think or maybe they are just lazy.

I think our focus on the power game means we have fewer toilers than clubs like Penrith or the Roosters. These are the guys who provide all the decoys and support play that makes an attack look smooth.

 

[pazzaeel]

We definitely need to look for something different, but another serious question for you to consider...

When we played Penrith 3 weeks ago and matched them 2 tries each, they scored their 2 tries from (1) a play that started at the right hand post, went right 2 passes and then a big missed tackle by Papali'i 10 metres out from the line and (2) a play that started near the left posts after a settler from Penrith and then shifted left 2 passes before a late offload found a support player who went past some lazy defence from Lane not following and closing the gap. Penrith had nothing in attack that we couldn't defend against, except for missing tackles.

Like my original post asked, is our attacking structure and plan really any different from anyone else or is it just execution?

I was at the game last night. i lost count of the amount of times i commented on how bad our attack is.

i get what you are saying about similarities in our attack and the other tops teams - and somewhat agree with you. i think the differences are:

- when we have a whole set of 6 in the attacking 20 - maximum 1 or 2 tackles we actually try and put a play on. the other 3-4 are plod settlers that usually result in a slow play the ball and the last tackle is the same cross field bomb every time. Good teams will usually have 1 settler (quick play the ball) then go all out for the rest of the tackles.

- our plays often breakdown because of either slow play the balls or one of our players inability to execute their part of the play

- Gutho overplaying his hand and overcalling the halves. he runs sideways and doesnt have power to break the line. he needs to stick to support play, not 1st or 2nd receiver. He works best when he runs off a shortball or throws the last pass before the try

- the biggest thing for me though is just the speed and depth we play at. watch the panthers or the storm, everything they do (especially in the 20m zone) is done at pace. bodies in motion. the back line has depth and everyone is moving at speed. everyone knows their role and how to execute it. we stand flat, catch the ball standing still, get our timing all wrong and play with no speed.

its diabolical.

it either comes down to 2 things (or a combination of both)

1. not enough skill in individual players
2. not enough skill in the coaching department

if we dont practice attack in equal amounts that we practice defense then BA has rocks in his head.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

So our players are lazy and aren't talented enough??? If true which i think is BS isn't that on the coach as well???

You only have to see the way Brown played when he first came into grade and look at him now. He has regressed in attack in a big way. his job is to make his tackles and kick when needed and run the ball when he gets it. He has been so underused and undervalued it's frankly quite sad. Go back and watch his first game in first grade and watch how he went about things last night. Yeah it's all down to the players......

Drown is playing to his strengths. Perhaps that means he is better suited to a different position but we already have a great kicker, and our best playmaker is our slow fullback. Dylan Brown complements them well. With more experience he will become the Munster type.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Did you??? I watched us last night and saw the same dogshit attack i have seen for years. But to say our players aren't talented enough or lazy is just a cop out IMO.

Our edge attack was f**king sweet in 2017. Very different to how it is now. Obviously by 2018 the game demanded huge merkins pounding it up through the middle, but when we didn't have those players we played to our strengths and snuck into the top four in 2017. Obviously Norman was a much more skilled playmaker than Drown, which made that style work. We have always played to our strengths. The problem is we lack some of the strengths of the top clubs. It would be nice to build more quickly but I'm just happy that we're building. It's very something.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Setups also get our attack set. When we don't do them we lose structure and start playing "Parra Ball" which is incredibly inconsistent and results in more errors and turnovers. Its not as simple as just saying take less settlers.

The settlers are also an attempt at a quick play-the-ball, without which there is no point shifting long.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Last night Canberra were getting 3-4 players into the tackle. We needed some short balls from our middles to get 1v1 or 1v2 and we could've worked off the back of that. When our middles ball-play they're generally playing out the back to a half.

Look at last week Browny was hitting other forwards with some really nice short balls. He is the key to our attack. I think we need to simplify Junior's game a bit. Early in the game every time he gets the ball Reg and Junior should be on either shoulder, that'll spread the defence out a bit and we can get a quick play the ball off that

It worked last week because we were getting quick play-the-balls. That opens up space in the middle for passing. You need to shift early against compressed middle defence, but with the edge defenders up in your face you need to kick early to slow them down. These are all decisions that need to be made by spine players, particularly the halves. A feature of young players (including Drown and Arthur) is poor decision making, and poor execution under pressure. We need Moses back in the team.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Our issue with attack last night is pretty simple, JA / Drown aren’t up to leaving the side around yet if the opposition matches us.

Moses is more important to our side / attack then we realise

Exactly

Additionally I reckon Cartwright should start/get more time on the edge to provide another “attacking point”. Not questioning Papas form (it’s been brilliant) but his attack is more run, doesn’t really have a pass / offload in him recently (few times last time in was in “space” but could get the ball out). And his metres are probably better used in the middle where he can provide a quick play the ball more often. Thus creating more room for our edges.

Something's going on with Cartwright. Maybe he's been dropped to 'work on a few things' but also maybe he's being punished for knocking back our extension offer to shop himself around. Where's your gratitude merkin?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

But we need to do something different if we want to challenge the top teams at the end of the year. Our current system of work to the right post for 2-3 tackles, shift left, work back to the middle and kick and hope is too easy for decent teams to defend against.

It gets harder and harder for them to defend if we can control the f**king ball and wear them down. There were opportunities against Canberra late in the game that weren't there earlier. Sivo almost scored twice in the last ten minutes.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

What’s the phrase, doing the same thing consistently and expect a different result = madness

But we do the same thing consistently and do get different results. Sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. No two games are the same. It's very exciting.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Bennett sacked Walters and Lazo in 2005, club legends who won comps and bled for the club. Next year they won the comp, we year after year keep the status quo and wonder why nothing changes. It’s embarrassing.

He obviously had better players to replace them with. Do we?

 

[hineyrulz]

Drown is playing to his strengths. Perhaps that means he is better suited to a different position but we already have a great kicker, and our best playmaker is our slow fullback. Dylan Brown complements them well. With more experience he will become the Munster type.

So you don’t think Brown is capable of more?? I think he and the team are capable of so much more, but that doesn’t suit your narrative so you talk down his and the team abilities and talk up the weaknesses so the coach and his staff get a free pass.

Predictable.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

some lazy defence from Lane not following and closing the gap

*Paulo

 

[Gary Gutful]

So you don’t think Brown is capable of more?? I think he and the team are capable of so much more, but that doesn’t suit your narrative so you talk down his and the team abilities and talk up the weaknesses so the coach and his staff get a free pass.

Predictable.

Its more believable than the idea that some Kraken munching nuffy knows more about Dylan Brown's strengths, weaknesses and growth opportunities than Joey Johns and BA combined.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Dumb.

We need a geezer who can also bring us more lemons FFS. Actually, preferably some oranges and nectarines as well.

A different coach isn't going to get this current squad performing much better than BA has. To improve further we need to improve our squad as well.

Yep, merkins overrating our players as usual.

Our squad (and coach) are good enough for where we are, which is solid top six, and top four with some luck. But so many people think our squad is good enough to be premiership favorites. Have they seen the squads we're up against? Did they have a look at the Origin teams?