How Roosters plan to win the 2012 Grand Final

[marshall stalin]

It's very simple. Reconstruct the team with a mixture of talented youth and experienced high performing stars. Here is the likely 2011 team that they think will be in the top four by 2011, and winners of the Grand Final in 2012.


Full Back: Sam Perrett

Three Quarters: Shaun Kenny-Dowell, Tom Symonds, J P du Plessis, (+ 2 undetermined)

Halves: Todd Carney, Mitchell Pearce (cover: Ben Jones)

Lock: Braith Anasta

Second Row: Willie Mason (?), Nick Kouparitsas, Setaimata Sa (+ 2 undetermined)

Props: Frank-Paul Nuuausala, Lopini Paea, Nate Myles (?), (+2 undetermined)

Hooker: Jake Friend

No room for Daniel Wagon??

 

[Lambretta]

No room for Daniel Wagon??

:lol: Good call. I'm always amazed we didn't offer him $250,000 a season.

Krishnan Inu has been playing like pooh recently and with Tahu coming back to Parra, there's a Golden opportunity to offer him huge money so we cant afford anyone decent instead

 

[Albert Rosenfeld]

Your knowledge of your own club is pathetic.

Anderson let Soward go in round 12, 2007. Finch joined the eels at the start of 2007 season. Josh Lewis left 3-4 weeks before Soward to the Titans.

You are just technically right that it was Anderson who let Soward go to the Dragons. But it was Ricky Stuart who had decided that the kid had no future at the Roosters, and relegated him to reserve grade. It happened to be on Anderson's watch that Soward got the chance at St George, but it was Stuart who had killed his career at the Roosters and indicated to Soward that he should look elsewhere.

Moreover it was Ricky Stuart who decided, of all the potential halves the Roosters had, that he would prefer the now certified sook Finch. He stuck with him until the pressure -- especially from the fans -- became too much. That is when he was let go to Parramatta.

So I am absolutely correct to lay the blame for the Roosters earlier halves problems on on the poor judgments of Ricky Stuart.

As for rugby union converts you've referenced in other posts, Shaun Foley was a winger/fullback you guys had up until recently, where is he now? Is Sisa Waqa a quality convert as well? I don't need to list all the failed attempts, most of them never even get to first grade. Your club alone has had more failures than successes in recent years converting these players. Thats the funny thing about converting players, you never know how they'll perform until you put them on the field. Some take to it like a duck to water and others just never grasp the basics to make it in the top grade. Yet you're already saying he'll be an "amazing center".

Shaun Foley came to the Roosters in 2006 with a big reputation and was signed until 2008. He started off well, scoring a lot of tries. However he was injured in 2007 and missed most of 2008 with a broken ankle. He is now playing for Randwick rugby union, and for the Wallabies in 7s.

Sisa Waqa has been dealt with in my earlier post. To repeat, he has had 7 months on the job. Give him time!

Is this all you can point to in terms of failures?

How about the famous successes in the Easts/Sydney Roosters club history. John Brass, Russell Fairfax, Dick Thornett (who converted first at Parramatta). Two of them famous internationals, and Fairfax would have been if he had not broken his leg in 1975. This club has had far more success than failure with union converts -- especially since the only "failure" that you can point to is Foley, who was injured for most of his contract. In any case it is a huge come down from your comical reference to "hundreds of failures" in your previous post. Yet you are still wrong.

Because of "Firey Dragon"'s defective knowledge of rugby union to league convert history, here is an incomplete list of famous converts from rugby union to rugby league over the last 50 years, and their rugby league clubs:


Full backs: Ken Thornett (Leeds, Parramatta), Russell Fairfax (Easts), Jonathan Davies (Widnes), Bev Risman (Leigh, Leeds), Matthew Ridge (Manly), Clive Griffiths (St Helens, Salford)

Wings: Michael Cleary (Souths), John Bentley (Leeds, Halifax, Balmain), Noa Nadruku (Canberra)

Centres: John Brass (Easts) Michael O'Connor (St George, Manly), David Watkins (Salford), John Devereux (Widnes, Manly), John Timu (Canterbury), Bob Honan (Souths), Craig Innes (Leeds, Western Reds, Manly), Allan Bateman (Warrington, Cronulla), Scott Gibbs (St Helens)

Five Eighths: Wally Lewis (Brisbane, Gold Coast), Phil Hawthorne (St George, Easts) Jim Lisle (Souths) , Frano Botica (Wigan, Auckland)

Half Backs: Arthur Summons (Wests), Ricky Stuart (Canberra)

Locks: Ray Price (Parramatta)

Second Row: Dick Thornett (Parramatta, Easts), Scott Gourley (St George, Sydney Roosters)

Props: Rex Mossop (Manly), Kevin Ryan (St George, Canterbury), Scott Quinnell (Wigan).


All of these other than Fairfax and Ken Thornett were dual code internationals. Thornett however played rugby league for Australia. Fairfax played rugby union for Australia before converting to league.

I have listed here 30 successful converts from rugby union to rugby league. "Firey Dragon," told us that for every success there have been "hundreds of failures."

How many failures does "Firey Dragon" really have?

3000? :lol: No.

30? :lol: No

Just one dubious case of Shaun Foley, and a lot of hot air. We will decide on Sisa Waqa next year. So "Firey Dragon" has no leg to stand on.

The overwhelming majority of converts from union to league have been carefully scrutinised, and they have been raging successes.

Barring injury, we can expect the same from J P du Plessis.

 

[Firey_Dragon]

You are just technically right that it was Anderson who let Soward go to the Dragons. But it was Ricky Stuart who had decided that the kid had no future at the Roosters, and relegated him to reserve grade. It happened to be on Anderson's watch that Soward got the chance at St George, but it was Stuart who had killed his career at the Roosters and indicated to Soward that he should look elsewhere.

Really? Please direct me to a quote where Stuart said he should look elsewhere. Soward was in and out of first grade in 2006 under Stuart, but he was not barred from first grade, he had flaws in his game, then got sent back to reserve grade to work on them, once he did, he was welcomed back into first grade. Stuart handled him poorly, but at no point did he completely brush him from the side like Anderson did. In 2006, not unlike 2007, the Roosters had a poorly functioning forward pack, the halves copped the blame for it. Anderson never gave Soward a shot however, dropped him from the fulltime squad (which never happened under Stuart), and finally played him once he'd already signed with the dragons.

Moreover it was Ricky Stuart who decided, of all the potential halves the Roosters had, that he would prefer the now certified sook Finch. He stuck with him until the pressure -- especially from the fans -- became too much. That is when he was let go to Parramatta.

I think the last few years have proven that your coaches had nowhere near as much influence on the sides as they should have. Freddy indicated as much in his interviews after he was sacked.

So I am absolutely correct to lay the blame for the Roosters earlier halves problems on on the poor judgments of Ricky Stuart.

Some of the blame no doubt lies with him, but you're not looking at the whole picture if you only blame him either.

Shaun Foley came to the Roosters in 2006 with a big reputation and was signed until 2008. He started off well, scoring a lot of tries. However he was injured in 2007 and missed most of 2008 with a broken ankle. He is now playing for Randwick rugby union, and for the Wallabies in 7s.

Again, was he a success in league, even with all those wraps? He is was average at best, even in his limited time in first grade, he was never a player that was going to make it.

Sisa Waqa has been dealt with in my earlier post. To repeat, he has had 7 months on the job. Give him time!

No need to give him time, he is deadset useless. Save the quote for a few years time, because it'll be right.

Is this all you can point to in terms of failures?

How about the famous successes in the Easts/Sydney Roosters club history. John Brass, Russell Fairfax, Dick Thornett (who converted first at Parramatta). Two of them famous internationals, and Fairfax would have been if he had not broken his leg in 1975. This club has had far more success than failure with union converts -- especially since the only "failure" that you can point to is Foley, who was injured for most of his contract. In any case it is a huge come down from your comical reference to "hundreds of failures" in your previous post. Yet you are still wrong.

Because of "Firey Dragon"'s defective knowledge of rugby union to league convert history, here is an incomplete list of famous converts from rugby union to rugby league over the last 50 years, and their rugby league clubs:


Full backs: Ken Thornett (Leeds, Parramatta), Russell Fairfax (Easts), Jonathan Davies (Widnes), Bev Risman (Leigh, Leeds), Matthew Ridge (Manly), Clive Griffiths (St Helens, Salford)

Wings: Michael Cleary (Souths), John Bentley (Leeds, Halifax, Balmain), Noa Nadruku (Canberra)

Centres: John Brass (Easts) Michael O'Connor (St George, Manly), David Watkins (Salford), John Devereux (Widnes, Manly), John Timu (Canterbury), Bob Honan (Souths), Craig Innes (Leeds, Western Reds, Manly), Allan Bateman (Warrington, Cronulla), Scott Gibbs (St Helens)

Five Eighths: Wally Lewis (Brisbane, Gold Coast), Phil Hawthorne (St George, Easts) Jim Lisle (Souths) , Frano Botica (Wigan, Auckland)

Half Backs: Arthur Summons (Wests), Ricky Stuart (Canberra)

Locks: Ray Price (Parramatta)

Second Row: Dick Thornett (Parramatta, Easts), Scott Gourley (St George, Sydney Roosters)

Props: Rex Mossop (Manly), Kevin Ryan (St George, Canterbury), Scott Quinnell (Wigan).


All of these other than Fairfax and Ken Thornett were dual code internationals. Thornett however played rugby league for Australia. Fairfax played rugby union for Australia before converting to league.

I have listed here 30 successful converts from rugby union to rugby league. "Firey Dragon," told us that for every success there have been "hundreds of failures."

How many failures does "Firey Dragon" really have?

3000? :lol: No.

30? :lol: No

Just one dubious case of Shaun Foley, and a lot of hot air. We will decide on Sisa Waqa next year. So "Firey Dragon" has no leg to stand on.

The overwhelming majority of converts from union to league have been carefully scrutinised, and they have been raging successes.

Barring injury, we can expect the same from J P du Plessis.

Congratulations, you can use google. How many of them are in the last decade? In fact, many of the players you have listed are from eras where the sport was amateur or semi-professional, many of them undertaking both sports simultaneously. The games are vastly different now. Unfortunately, failures aren't as easy to google because no one cares.

Du Plessis may turn out to be a brilliant player, but it is no guarantee at this point. Just because he has raps on him in SA means nothing unless he can translate that onto the rugby league pitch, which defensively is a completely different kettle of fish to union.

 

[Yosh]

It's very simple. Reconstruct the team with a mixture of talented youth and experienced high performing stars. Here is the likely 2011 team that they think will be in the top four by 2011, and winners of the Grand Final in 2012.


Full Back: Sam Perrett

Three Quarters: Shaun Kenny-Dowell, Tom Symonds, J P du Plessis, (+ 2 undetermined)

Halves: Todd Carney, Mitchell Pearce (cover: Ben Jones)

Lock: Braith Anasta

Second Row: Willie Mason (?), Nick Kouparitsas, Setaimata Sa (+ 2 undetermined)

Props: Frank-Paul Nuuausala, Lopini Paea, Nate Myles (?), (+2 undetermined)

Hooker: Jake Friend

Most other teams aim to win it every year but then you guys can just give up and not even try to win 2010 or 2011 if you want ahaha. However BSmith a great coach.

 

[AlbertRosenfeld]

Because of "Firey Dragon"'s defective knowledge of rugby union to rugby league convert history, and his refusal to identify specific players who had converted from rugby union, I provided a list of 30 famous converts from rugby union to rugby league over the last 50 years, and their rugby league clubs:


Full backs: Ken Thornett (Leeds, Parramatta), Russell Fairfax (Easts), Jonathan Davies (Widnes), Bev Risman (Leigh, Leeds), Matthew Ridge (Manly), Clive Griffiths (St Helens, Salford)

Wings: Michael Cleary (Souths), John Bentley (Leeds, Halifax, Balmain), Noa Nadruku (Canberra)

Centres: John Brass (Easts) Michael O'Connor (St George, Manly), David Watkins (Salford), John Devereux (Widnes, Manly), John Timu (Canterbury), Bob Honan (Souths), Craig Innes (Leeds, Western Reds, Manly), Allan Bateman (Warrington, Cronulla), Scott Gibbs (St Helens)

Five Eighths: Wally Lewis (Brisbane, Gold Coast), Phil Hawthorne (St George, Easts) Jim Lisle (Souths) , Frano Botica (Wigan, Auckland)

Half Backs: Arthur Summons (Wests), Ricky Stuart (Canberra)

Locks: Ray Price (Parramatta)

Second Row: Dick Thornett (Parramatta, Easts), Scott Gourley (St George, Sydney Roosters)

Props: Rex Mossop (Manly), Kevin Ryan (St George, Canterbury), Scott Quinnell (Wigan).


All of these other than Fairfax and Ken Thornett were dual code internationals. Thornett however played rugby league for Australia. Fairfax played rugby union for Australia before converting to league.

Congratulations, you can use google. How many of them are in the last decade? In fact, many of the players you have listed are from eras where the sport was amateur or semi-professional, many of them undertaking both sports simultaneously. The games are vastly different now.

None of them have been in the past decade because rugby union has become massively wealthy and can keep all of its established stars while raiding the rugby league ranks for its stars.

Only recently has rugby league cottoned on to the idea of recruiting schoolboys, whom we could afford, although in the case of du Plessis even that appears to have been done surreptitiously.

None of the 30 stars I listed were playing both sports at the same time. It was impossible, since they had been repudiated by rugby union in the days before open professsionalism. And in those days rugby union and league were both on the same winter schedules. It would have been a physical impossibility. You are just inventing scenarios that have no basis in reality.

Unfortunately, failures aren't as easy to google because no one cares.

Du Plessis may turn out to be a brilliant player, but it is no guarantee at this point. Just because he has raps on him in SA means nothing unless he can translate that onto the rugby league pitch, which defensively is a completely different kettle of fish to union.

There may well have been failures of little known rugby union players to become good rugby league players. But that is not the kind of rugby union player we are concerned about, just as we are not concerned with all the little known rugby league players who failed to make the big time professionally.

If the failure to convert had been of an established player we wouldn't need google, we would know about it from the regular media, just as we all know from there that Willy Mason did not make the cut in American football. People do care, just as they cared how Mason was doing in the USA. The fact is that no high profile purchase from rugby union has so far failed to convert into an outstanding rugby league player.

It is possible that JP will not succeed. But it is highly probable that he will succeed -- especially given that the man who recruited him has such a great track record of success.

 

[_STING_]

Waqa hasn't played much first grade but from what I have seen, he has a long way to go to secure a regular first grade position. Smith really has to put a lot of work in him and I am not so sure Waqa will be given that opportunity. But he has done wonders with some very average players and one thing he is reported to have is great work ethics which you probably couldn't say for a few of our players this season.

JP is 18 years old and that is his advantage. He has a couple of years in NYC to learn the game. He will not have the pressure of showing immediate success in first grade like Waqa had to. I doubt he will be in first grade for a couple of years but I am eager to see him play next year. I haven't heard anything about this other SA player we were supposed to sign. O'Sullivan said he was "exceptional" so it will be interesting to see if this has fallen through.

 

[gorilla with a shotgun]

What about the Raiders 2012?

FB- Josh Dugan
Wingers/centres- Croker, Carney, Vidot, Monas(maybe)
Halves- Campese,?
Hooker- Waddell
Backrowers- LL, Harison, Tongue, J.Thompson, Thurling
Frontrowers- Shillington, Tilse
Coach- Someone who isnt dave furner

 

[Choppies]

What about the Raiders 2012?

FB- Josh Dugan
Wingers/centres- Croker, Carney, Vidot, Monas(maybe)
Halves- Campese,?
Hooker- Waddell
Backrowers- LL, Harison, Tongue, J.Thompson, Thurling
Frontrowers- Shillington, Tilse
Coach- Someone who isnt dave furner

Sorry we have already claimed 2012 but you are quite welcome to start a thread on how the Raiders will win the comp in 2013. ;-)

 

[Albert Rosenfeld]

Important breaking news:

Brian Smith, the poker faced, charmless new coach of the Roosters has indicated that he will not go the Roosters roster with a broom. He said that he is looking forward to working with the young talent that the club now has ...which can be taken to mean that he will do his best to develop the new breed of stars like J. P. du Plessis, Tom Symonds, Ben Jones, etc.

On the other hand he has told Willy Mason that he can leave anytime he wants to.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/im-not-phil-gould-and-willie-mason-can-go-too-brian-smith/story-e6frexnr-1225754157812

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/prying-into-the-mind-of-brian-smith/story-e6frexq9-1225754165037

So it looks like the Roosters renaissance willl get under way next year.
If Minichiello could get back to fitness and form, then the Roosters will certainly have a backlline that will be the envy of the NRL by 2011.

It appears that the St George Dragons will only have this year and next when they are faced with the serious challenges of only Canterbury Bulldogs, Gold Coast Titans and Melbourne Storm. By 2011 the Sydney Roosters will be right up there.

 

[OVP]

Sorry we have already claimed 2012 but you are quite welcome to start a thread on how the Raiders will win the comp in 2013. ;-)

Nah it'd be a pointless thread because we'll get that 3-peat we want ;-)

 

[Monk]

unless we go

2010-2011-2012

 

[OVP]

unless we go

2010-2011-2012

Good thunking sir

 

[$$Poor Boy Blues$$]

They'll win it by match fixing, surely

 

[OVP]

Yeah its called The Bronco Method.