Eels Salary Cap Mk V

[ash411]

Misappropriation of funds might be more accurate than fraud.

 

[84 Baby]

Misappropriation of funds might be more accurate than fraud.

Even then where did they misappropriate funds to? If it was to players in the "ordinary" course of business, do the members really care?
As the police said it's an interesting matter because there's no real definitive answer, although I would be hoping if the police were investigating they'd at least have more info than us

 

[ash411]

Even then where did they misappropriate funds to? If it was to players in the "ordinary" course of business, do the members really care?
As the police said it's an interesting matter because there's no real definitive answer, although I would be hoping if the police were investigating they'd at least have more info than us

Good point, If you're taking money from merchandising takings and giving that cash directly to a player, as long as that money is reported in your accounts (i.e. the money doesn't just disappear) then I guess in a legal sense that would be fine, right?

The government wouldn't really care what a company does with it's money as long as they are paying the correct amount of tax, and aren't funding terrorists or something.. Or is there something I'm missing?

 

[Gronk]

Good point, If you're taking money from merchandising takings and giving that cash directly to a player, as long as that money is reported in your accounts (i.e. the money doesn't just disappear) then I guess in a legal sense that would be fine, right?

The government wouldn't really care what a company does with it's money as long as they are paying the correct amount of tax, and aren't funding terrorists or something.. Or is there something I'm missing?

Hysteria.

 

[ash411]

Hysteria.

Good album.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Good album.

Not a lot of people know this but their drummer didn't have any legs.

 

[ash411]

Not a lot of people know this but their drummer didn't have any legs.

Or a face..

 

[Bigfella]

Not a lot of people know this but their drummer didn't have any legs.

Much like one of Avenger's rumours

 

[Jake the snake]

Hey Jake. I think I found the plumbers chequebook!

LOOOOOOLLLLLL!!!!!!!
View attachment 8630

That's too funny!!!

 

[parra-matters]

Bizarre habits
Parramatta are doing their best to right things in their front office but the jury is out on new chief executive, Scott Seward. His reign as merchandising manager at the Bulldogs was an interesting one to say the least. The most intriguing aspect of it was $90,000 worth of Bulldogs merchandise not properly accounted for.

The Nike gear was not in stock and it was not in sales. There was never a question of any criminal activity – it was just stock that disappeared under his watch. Then there was his decision to employ his mother Robin. And his sister Kelly. And his two cousins. And even more bizarre was the way he would deal with the takings from game day merchandise sales. If there was a crowd of 40,000 – the cash sales could be as high as $40,000. The conventional manner of handling that would be to take the cash and place it in the safe at Canterbury Leagues Club and count it on the first weekday after the game. But Seward had the habit of taking it home and putting it under his bed for safe keeping.


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This is what i was referring to before.
And the alarm bells should have been ringing before they employed Seward unless they wanted a fall guy or someone who would not question things and just do it.

 

[Twizzle]

and yet we gave him the keys to the till

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Who do you think we are defrauding?
Not saying it isn't the case, but I don't think the ATO have suggested we have defrauded them. They'll probably go back last 4 years and audit them before deciding if there is fraud involved.
I'm not completely sure how OLGA works. Can you defraud them? Mislead certainly but would it constitute fraud? I'm not sure how OLGA operates.
The only other fraud case I can see is against members funds and really that will only be likely if money didn't go to players but to other people.
Money laundering and couple of others are probably more likely.
Anyway it's more just semantics over level of offence, like the Bitchell Pissed level of assault case.

And no Jake, I'm not in love with Sharp, just a consideration on the legal aspects

It is a (allegedly) a misappropriation of members funds, and (allegedly) either falsifying accounting records to cover that up, or conspiring with suppliers to achieve the same end.

Whether the funds go to players or others is not an essential plank of any potential case.

They'll go with whatever they think they have the best chance of securing a prosecution with (if anything).

Technically, it may qualify as a fraud on the other members of the competition (as the prizemoney is essentially a zero sum game), but they won't pursue that argument.

 

[The EELiminator]

Good point, If you're taking money from merchandising takings and giving that cash directly to a player, as long as that money is reported in your accounts (i.e. the money doesn't just disappear) then I guess in a legal sense that would be fine, right?

i don't see how they could report the correct total in the accounts and then hand part of it to a player without there being a discrepancy that would stand out either tax wise or salary cap wise (or both)

i think the only way you could do it is if the money does just disappear

 

[emjaycee]

i don't see how they could report the correct total in the accounts and then hand part of it to a player without there being a discrepancy that would stand out either tax wise or salary cap wise (or both)

i think the only way you could do it is if the money does just disappear

Credit: Merchandise Sales
Debit: Sundry Expenses

 

[ash411]

Credit: Merchandise Sales
Debit: Sundry Expenses

Exactly, The ATO doesn't care how much we pay our players. As long as the club reports it's income and expenses correctly to them.

They can lie all they want to the NRL, break as many of their rules as they want, that has no legal implications, because no real laws are broken. The NRL's "laws" maybe, but they aren't actually laws, not in the sense that you can go to jail for breaking an NRL Law. It's if in breaking that rule/law you actually are committing a real crime is when they can get you.

The one that concerns me the most is the loading of invoices, that also has implications for the suppliers that were involved as well.

 

[Delboy]

This is what i was referring to before.
And the alarm bells should have been ringing before they employed Seward unless they wanted a fall guy or someone who would not question things and just do it.

Possibly they thought he knew the way to do things , a la other clubs, still as leaders they should have ensured they took advice from qualified people (like Schubert I guess ) it has definitely blown up inn the clubs face
'
However, still don't understand how Greenberg can say things with a straight face, problem is , this is not an argument you can win, we need to move on and get the reform underway

There doesn't appear to be any other way , unfortunately.

 

[Chipmunk]

I wonder if the NRL starts to investigate players and agents, whether they will give all players and agents a blanket amnesty from any kind of recriminations in order for them spill the beans so to speak?

 

[ek999]

Credit: Merchandise Sales
Debit: Sundry Expenses

And if they did it like that the club would not have met its PAYG Withholding, superannuation, payroll tax and probably workers comp (not sure how it works in relation to professional athletes) obligations.

 

[born an eel]

Exactly, The ATO doesn't care how much we pay our players. As long as the club reports it's income and expenses correctly to them.

They can lie all they want to the NRL, break as many of their rules as they want, that has no legal implications, because no real laws are broken. The NRL's "laws" maybe, but they aren't actually laws, not in the sense that you can go to jail for breaking an NRL Law. It's if in breaking that rule/law you actually are committing a real crime is when they can get you.

The one that concerns me the most is the loading of invoices, that also has implications for the suppliers that were involved as well.

actually they have broken the law by lying to the NRL,
Seward has knowingly admitted to signing a false Stat Dec which is a criminal offense.

http://nswcourts.com.au/articles/what-happens-if-i-lie-on-a-statutory-declaration-form/

 

[84 Baby]

It is a (allegedly) a misappropriation of members funds, and (allegedly) either falsifying accounting records to cover that up, or conspiring with suppliers to achieve the same end.

Whether the funds go to players or others is not an essential plank of any potential case.

They'll go with whatever they think they have the best chance of securing a prosecution with (if anything).

Technically, it may qualify as a fraud on the other members of the competition (as the prizemoney is essentially a zero sum game), but they won't pursue that argument.

A business can't defraud itself so if the business (read directors) had the purview to and intended for the transaction to only be advantageous to the business and it was done in ordinary course of business (even though it isn't really ordinary circumstances) then it would be difficult to even argue misappropriation, i.e. if the directors or others got zero advantage out of it, then they haven't misappropriated the funds. Bad management doesn't constitute misappropriation. So where the money was intended to wind up is vital. The only other case for misappropriation for the members is if payments to players aren't accurately depicted in the financial report, but are any of the members really going to care (who am I kidding? It's Parramatta).

And defrauding the NRL competition at large is an interesting legal argument. Unfortunately it's also tenuous and unlikely to be challenged.