1st Test New Zealand vs India - Sneddon Park Hamilton

[Spike]

I would say that playing cricket for New Zealand would lead to long bouts of depression. The cycle needs to be cut sooner than it would for players from other countries.

 

[Meth]

Iain O'Brien has scored more runs in this test than McIntosh, Mills, Taylor and Franklin

 

[edabomb]

The ICL has a bit to do with it. You can add the names McMillan, Vincent, Adams, Hamish Marshall to that list. Probably McMillan and Bond are the two massive losses. New Zealand's pace bowling is too slow, the only one who puts it into the deck at all is O'Brien, and realistically he's more of your second strike bowler type than your main strike bowler. The sad thing with McMillan is he was probably in career best form when he ripped up stumps on his career.

I think the New Zealand first class structure which attracts pitiful crowds and average sponsorship doesn't pay enough for fringe or non-fringe international players to keep going for a long time. At the moment there's a few experienced blokes like Sinclair going around still, but you still hear them every now and then talk about giving it away.

I also reckon McMillan not getting a shot at the test team had a bit to do with it, meant he was ranked quite lowly on the central contracts list.

I reckon our older generation have it all wrong with their retiring to focus on one dayers. It is very rare that a player can succeed solely in the shorter format, and they generally do this in their prime as a player, not at the end.

If Mills makes the next test squad then I'd say we're playing for the draw. He never looks like taking a wicket.

 

[Spike]

New Zealand lost by 10 wickets. The axe should be wielded

 

[El Diablo]

:lol:

 

[JJ]

Kyle Mills is another, not up to test cricket. Not quick enough.

Out:

Franklin
Mills
Taylor

In:

Oram
Patel
Elliott

Broom could probably be in for Taylor too, he's willing to have a good dig.

I'd keep Franklin, and don't see any point in Patel... Oram should be in if fit, Broom or Elliott for Taylor (won't happen) but he needs a kick in the arse

Southee back for Mills

 

[Blaze]

Ross Taylor, another day another disgraceful exhibition of test match batting. He's not delivering on his potential. Maybe to open his eyes and give him a short, sharp, shock that he needs to bat to his potential in this line up they might consider bringing Elliott in. Elliott's not the most talented of batsmen, and I would suggest his first couple of test matches he didn't feel he was quite good enough, though I reckon the ODI hundred at Sydney will change that, but gees he will sell his wicket a lot more dearly than Taylor.

Not only was it just a dopey stroke in terms of the shot he was trying to play, but he had half an over to go to drinks and have batted out an hour with Flynn and he plays THAT shot. Woeful. Massively underperforming.

Dropping him would do nothing imo. I don't think he is too comfortable and needs a wake up call... I just don't read Taylor's situation like that at all. I just think he is still making his way in Test cricket . The more Test cricket he plays, hopefully the better he gets. Sure he had a poor series against the Windies as well, but he was our best batsman against Australia so you have to give the guy the rest of the series at least.

Also Neil Broom is a fraud. I don't think I have seen a more tin arse innings than his one in Melbourne in the ODI against Aus in Feb. No way near Test standard.

 

[Blaze]

I also wouldn't drop Franklin, but I would give him the new ball and swap him in the batting line up with Vettori.

 

[Iafeta]

I also reckon McMillan not getting a shot at the test team had a bit to do with it, meant he was ranked quite lowly on the central contracts list.

I reckon our older generation have it all wrong with their retiring to focus on one dayers. It is very rare that a player can succeed solely in the shorter format, and they generally do this in their prime as a player, not at the end.

If Mills makes the next test squad then I'd say we're playing for the draw. He never looks like taking a wicket.

Firstly, lol @ the morons who waste their time on their impotent comments on NZ Cricket. Run along lads, no one cares, McGain will be on again tonight.

One of the reasons the older generation retire and look at the shorter form of the game is because of the ease they can get cash out of it. If you're a half decent 20/20 merchant, you don't really need to be playing the longer form of the game. As long as you keep your head above water, you can easily earn more cash focussing purely on the shorter forms and perhaps mixing in commercial business practices without worrying about first class cricket.

 

[attila_the_gorilla]

Yep, test cricket is hard work.

 

[edabomb]

Firstly, lol @ the morons who waste their time on their impotent comments on NZ Cricket. Run along lads, no one cares, McGain will be on again tonight.

One of the reasons the older generation retire and look at the shorter form of the game is because of the ease they can get cash out of it. If you're a half decent 20/20 merchant, you don't really need to be playing the longer form of the game. As long as you keep your head above water, you can easily earn more cash focussing purely on the shorter forms and perhaps mixing in commercial business practices without worrying about first class cricket.

Yup I think the end is nigh for us as a competitive test match nation, unless we can find a few genuinely penetrating bowlers.....

The thing is the test match players need a higher weighted income, but convincing the higher earning test/20twenty/ODI players to accept this is another matter.

On a positive side we'd probably dominate a minnows test championship.

Oh and re:Southee being brought back, I think that's only a good idea if he gets back to presenting the seam. I made a comment to my mate during the ODIs about how scrambled his deliveries are compared to when he started and my mate said he'd heard it was a conscious effort. I don't understand that.

 

[Beavers Headgear]

Dropping Taylor would be 1 of the stupidist things the selectors could do. He has come off a big year in 2008, had a good run of consistent scores in the ODI summer, and is probably still our best bat imo. I don't really ever see the point of view that says "Drop him, that will teach him", and the flipside of what that can do to a player can be read in the Astle and McMillan books.

Franklin should not be dropped either, not really a big fan 1 way or the other, but the luck he had from what i saw/heard in this match was pretty bad. Out without hitting it, catches dropped off him, edges falling just short etc

 

[Red Bear]

I think your major problem is opening batsmen. When was the last decent stand between your openers? When? You just arent going to improve in test cricket when a wicket seems to fall before the score is at 20.
Can Oram play just as a batsmen?

McIntosh
Guptil
Flynn
Taylor
Ryder
Oram/Elliot if Oram just isnt fit for 5 days cricket
McCullem
Vettori
Franklin
Mills/Southee/Martin
O'Brien

 

[JJ]

Yup I think the end is nigh for us as a competitive test match nation, unless we can find a few genuinely penetrating bowlers.....

The problem is, and always has been with our batsmen...

India only did what a competent batting side would do on that wicket... being bowled out for 279 twice was the problem. But if we're talking about lack of penetration in the bowlers, I'd start with Mills and then quickly look at the captain

 

[JJ]

I think your major problem is opening batsmen. When was the last decent stand between your openers? When? You just arent going to improve in test cricket when a wicket seems to fall before the score is at 20.
Can Oram play just as a batsmen?

McIntosh
Guptil
Flynn
Taylor
Ryder
Oram/Elliot if Oram just isnt fit for 5 days cricket
McCullem
Vettori
Franklin
Mills/Southee/Martin
O'Brien

You're bang on there, the problem is with the bats - Martin, Franklin and O'Brien are perfectly decent pace bowlers, not world beaters but decent.

Oram has always been a specialist bat who bowl tightly but nothing more - yes he can play as a bat, he has big weaknesses against pace, but notwithstanding he's probably still better than the rest