2009 Four Nations Opener

[marv]

I think there are plenty of people in London and surrounding areas that like RL but don't go to Quins games every week because they either have another team to support e.g. Wigan, live too far from Twickenham to go every week.

Also, people who aren't regular RL fans would be more likely to watch an England v Australia match at Wembley than a RL match involving 2 teams from small towns in the north of England.

Maybe Bazza but for me if England RU decided to play a game in my home town of Barrow (hypothetical obviously) I wouldnt feel inclined to go just because this type of thing doesnt happen in Barrow that often, I think wembley is a brave desision and i hope it comes off but even with 50k in thats 40k empty seats, Id rather see a full city of Manchester stadium, in fact the last time I watched GB v Aus at city of Manchester stadium it wasnt even full then

 

[marv]

There was a meeting at the cc final, and Frances biggest fear was losing money, not competing with the top 3.

At current the Tri nations is one of the only IRL comps to make money, everyone in the comp, not just France should be cautious about the £ $

For example week 1 England Play Australia then in week 2 England play France, nobody has bottomless pockets if I had to choose I would probably watch the England V Australia game because its more likely to be a contest and I class myself as a big supporter of the International game and the French game.

I think France could bring a lot to the 3/4 nations but we need to be making the right decisions at the right time.

things are really happening in london and down south!

Oh yeah the vast crowds at Quins are testemant to that :sarcasm:

 

[bazza]

Maybe Bazza but for me if England RU decided to play a game in my home town of Barrow (hypothetical obviously) I wouldnt feel inclined to go just because this type of thing doesnt happen in Barrow that often,

I reckon the people in Barrow would more likely be inclined to watch a RU game of England v Australia than Saracens v Wasps though

I think wembley is a brave desision and i hope it comes off but even with 50k in thats 40k empty seats, Id rather see a full city of Manchester stadium, in fact the last time I watched GB v Aus at city of Manchester stadium it wasnt even full then

I think if the RFL can't generate a bit of media interest in London out of a England v Australia RL game at Wembley then they never will
If they were serious they would play the final at City of Manchester stadium as well

 

[marv]

I reckon the people in Barrow would more likely be inclined to watch a RU game of England v Australia than Saracens v Wasps though

Yeah I think thats a fair shout mate

I think if the RFL can't generate a bit of media interest in London out of a England v Australia RL game at Wembley then they never will

Now your getting it! no seriously...I'm pretty sure they wont be able to make a dent in the Media regards RL in London, theres just too much going on, if England march back with the WC you will be lucky to dethrone Cristiano Ronaldo's new hairdo off the back page the next morning *




*not that i have ever been alive to see England RL march anywhere with anything remotly silverware-like

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Wembley has to happen. They got the best part of 15,000 Aussies to the TN game at Loftus Road in 2004. Give them the chance to go to Wembley and they should get that sort of number again. Add in a good handful of willing Londoners and plenty of folk from oop narth and they should get 50k. It will be the only Anglo-Aussie game of the tournament this time, unless they play in the final, so they should be keen. England should make the WC final too so that will help. If there has to be a double header make it England v France and Australia v NZ in England, say Huddersfield. Play France v Australia in Paris and France v NZ down south (Perpignan or Toulouse) and England v NZ in Hull with the final at CofM. Or the double header at Wigan, England/NZ at Huddersfield and final at Elland Rd.

 

[pcpp]

What does everyone think about a qualification tournament for the fourth place:

France, Wales, one or two Pacific nations

If France are good enough, they'll be able to qualify. Wales U18s beat England U18s earlier this year and theres no reason this potential can't be converted. Pacific sides in there - even if they don't qualify - will quell the alliegance switch we're seeing at this World Cup by the Polynesian players.

 

[roughyedspud]

there should be 2 qualifcation tournaments..

a pacific cup for when the 4 nations is held down under and a euro cup when the 4 nations is held up here..

 

[bulos01]

At current the Tri nations is one of the only IRL comps to make money, everyone in the comp, not just France should be cautious about the £ $

For example week 1 England Play Australia then in week 2 England play France, nobody has bottomless pockets if I had to choose I would probably watch the England V Australia game because its more likely to be a contest and I class myself as a big supporter of the International game and the French game.

I think France could bring a lot to the 3/4 nations but we need to be making the right decisions at the right time.




Oh yeah the vast crowds at Quins are testemant to that :sarcasm:

with zero advertising or media coverage to get an average of over 3000 isnt too bad. and im not saying its good. just alot better than it use to be when they opened the gates and still no one went.
have u seen the number of londoners in the jurnior english squads? they have over 30 in 3 age groups, plus the number of jrn clubs and players has grown too.
still not great but alot better than where they were 4-5 yrs ago.

 

[Robster]

I think its a bad move, France are not up to the standard yet, it was proven this year by England.

It will look rather silly if Fiji or Tonga come fourth at this years World Cup and France comes last in their pool match.

I have always said that it should be the fourth top nation vs 5th top nation to earn the right to play in the Tri Nations.

France will never be at standard if they play 1 test against one of the top 3 nations a year.

 

[kiwileaguefan]

Don't italy get flogged in most 6 nations games, however it didn't stop the union from expanding.

That is true, out of 45 matches they have played in the 6 Nations they have only won 6 matches. I would expect Frances to be worse than this unless teams put on there reserve players when they have already made the final.

Will France be in it for the long hual? As Italy have had nine years at it so far.

 

[marv]

with zero advertising or media coverage to get an average of over 3000 isnt too bad. and im not saying its good. just alot better than it use to be when they opened the gates and still no one went.

TBH in a city of 7m its piss poor IMO

have u seen the number of londoners in the jurnior english squads? they have over 30 in 3 age groups, plus the number of jrn clubs and players has grown too.
still not great but alot better than where they were 4-5 yrs ago.

Of course I have seen the numbers, it would be churlish of me to suggest this isnt progress but I feel as long as no-one is there to watch them it can only go so far.

One thing i do think regards London, point me out if Im wrong but the kids who are targeted in London are generally from the poorer areas of the city like Thornton Heath, Brixton, New Addington and even the Skolars are all places identified in the London Plan as deprived areas, it may be that these people see the pathway to the quins first team as a meal ticket, but will their family and freinds be able to, or want to go and watch quins in the future?

For me these people are the future of the RL in London, Im not suggesting another re-location of the London club but in some ways i feel the quins brand is not going to appeal to the people of Brixton or Wood Green.

 

[bazza]

TBH in a city of 7m its piss poor IMO
i feel the quins brand is not going to appeal to the people of Brixton or Wood Green.

They may not watch the quins every week but they could well go and watch a big one off England match

 

[marv]

They may not watch the quins every week but they could well go and watch a big one off England match

Im not talking about England now Bazza, Bulos commented on the great junior work going on in the capital despite the poor crowds, i said it was perhaps the quins brand that was unappealing to the average London RL player/fan/volunteer.

Back on topic I personally think that 50k (the figure has been used by a few posters as a benchmark) would look ridiculous in a 90k stadium when you are saying that England v Australia is the pinnacle of International Rugby league, yet we play it in a half empty stadium.

Also if 50k is a figure we are realistically looking at the the City of Manchester stadium is about 48k so I think that would look great full, allthough as I pointed out the last time I went to watch GB at COM it wasnt full then either.

 

[deluded pom?]

Is rugby league in the UK getting too expensive to watch considering all of the showpiece events that occur during a season? You can add the Magic weekend to the list of events I posted earlier too.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Of Italy's first 30 games (6 years) they won only 2 in the union 6 nations.

Do we think that after 6 years of pro football the French won't win a few games?

 

[marv]

Of Italy's first 30 games (6 years) they won only 2 in the union 6 nations.

Do we think that after 6 years of pro football the French won't win a few games?

I have to say I would be surprised if they did but we dont know the calibre of player that may come through in the future and it would be easy to underestimate that

 

[marv]

Is rugby league in the UK getting too expensive to watch considering all of the showpiece events that occur during a season? You can add the Magic weekend to the list of events I posted earlier too.

Well it is for sure, I have said before on the thread if I had to make a choice on wether or not I watched England V France in Huddersfeild or England V Australia in Wigan I almost certainly couldnt do both, I would therefore of course choose to watch the Engalnd v Australia fixture because it would be a better game, so there is a few things to think about before just sticking France in there blind.

 

[deluded pom?]

Well it is for sure, I have said before on the thread if I had to make a choice on wether or not I watched England V France in Huddersfeild or England V Australia in Wigan I almost certainly couldnt do both, I would therefore of course choose to watch the Engalnd v Australia fixture because it would be a better game, so there is a few things to think about before just sticking France in there blind.

It's not about sticking France in there though marv, it's about the extra expense involved travelling down to and possibly staying in London if the game/s taken to Wembley. I don't have a prob with France being involved. We have to help them reach the next level of international competition and they are the best option in Europe.

 

[marv]

It's not about sticking France in there though marv, it's about the extra expense involved travelling down to and possibly staying in London if the game/s taken to Wembley.

Yeah these all things to be taken into account, but I think my point is also valid, the tri nations makes money, with poor attendances for some of the games it could affect the profitabilty.

We have to help them reach the next level of international competition and they are the best option in Europe.

Of course and I accept that, I want France to be in the comp (sometimes my comments may seem to the contrary) , I dont see anyone better placed than them not just in Euorpe but the world, I just get annoyed by the MB hyperbilly and want to see how they go in the WC first, I maybe think 2009 is too early for them, I cant help my cautious feelings I/we have all seen failed expansion for various reasons.

 

[bender]

I have to say I would be surprised if they did but we dont know the calibre of player that may come through in the future and it would be easy to underestimate that

I may look like a fool here, but i would be absolutely flabbagasted if France hadnt won at least 2 games out of thirty in their last 30 games against Australia, New Zealand and England/Great Britain. And during this time, they havent had full time teams. Does anyone have a handy list of the last 30 games.

The question of Wembley/London crowds is very interesting. Does anyone have a comparison of the crowds in the last say 10 of these Australia vs Great Britain/England games in this area as opposed to the crowds in the same games in the last 10 Northern venues. Again, i would be extremely surprised if the London base doesnt get much bigger crowds, making this hardly a gamble. Can anyone post these figures?

And finally, just on the trinations format, i think that Celtic, France, PnG, wales and pacific Islands are good possibilities. But, if it were up to me, I think that it would be very important to use GB and Ireland, Pacific Islands and PNG, and finally France (and/or the mediterranean) in long term plans. If this in done, players will never be encouraged to play for minor nations and the Nations cup will have the same effect as state of origin on the minor nations.