2017 State of Origin Game 1

[84 Baby]

We stick with these players because there is no-one better. Queensland have a handful of 9/10 or 10/10 players. We only have Hayne who is still below his best and then a bunch of guys who are 7 or 8 out of 10 for quality. The problem is we have a f**kload of such players which causes ignorant fans to ask "Why not pick a different player (of equivalent quality)?!? (Player X) has FAILED AT ORIGIN!!!" as if a different 8/10 player will magically improve in an Origin match.

Ennis would have shat all over Farah's "performances" and do you honestly believe there weren't as good if not better wingers running around at the time than James McManus?

 

[Bazal]

We stick with these players because there is no-one better. Queensland have a handful of 9/10 or 10/10 players. We only have Hayne who is still below his best (and maybe Tedesco) and then a bunch of guys who are 7 or 8 out of 10 for quality. The problem is we have a f**kload of such players which causes ignorant fans to ask "Why not pick a different player (of equivalent quality)?!? (Player X) has FAILED AT ORIGIN!!!" as if a different 8/10 player will magically improve in an Origin match.

You seriously reckon a Josh Dugan would be just as likely to break open a match as a James Tedesco or a BJ Leilua, or are you just arguing for the sake of it again?

Thoise QLDers are 9/10 and 10/10 because they have been playing at the top level since they were 20 years old. There is absolutely no reason a Tedesco or a Trobejebrah or a Keary couldn't be a 9/10 player after 25 origin games, is there? Whilst Dugan and Ferguson are never going to be better than they are now.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Ennis would have shat all over Farah's "performances" and do you honestly believe there weren't as good if not better wingers running around at the time than James McManus?

Farah was a better player than Ennis, but just like Cam Smith, star hookers need to take a back seat to the halves in a rep game.

McManus was a very good winger, especially with his go forward. The only dude clearly better was Hayne.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

You seriously reckon a Josh Dugan would be just as likely to break open a match as a James Tedesco or a BJ Leilua, or are you just arguing for the sake of it again?

Sometimes solid, safe players are the best.

I would pick Tedesco at fullback but I'd also have Dugan at centre ahead of Leilua. He would get exposed like some kind of exotic takeaway.

Thoise QLDers are 9/10 and 10/10 because they have been playing at the top level since they were 20 years old. There is absolutely no reason a Tedesco or a Trobejebrah or a Keary couldn't be a 9/10 player after 25 origin games, is there? Whilst Dugan and Ferguson are never going to be better than they are now.

I don't believe a couple dozen Origin games improves a player significantly. The reason the player is so good is also the reason he got the opportunity to play so much Origin - year after year of professionalism and success at club level.

 

[Bazal]

Sometimes solid, safe players are the best.

I would pick Tedesco at fullback but I'd also have Dugan at centre ahead of Leilua. He would get exposed like some kind of exotic takeaway.


I don't believe a couple dozen Origin games improves a player significantly. The reason the player is so good is also the reason he got the opportunity to play so much Origin - year after year of professionalism and success at club level.

Really? So how many years and years of professionalism and success at club level did Slater, Inglis, Thurston, Smith, Scott, Boyd and co have as 19 and 20 year olds when they were picked for Origin debuts??

Leilua is only marginally worse in defence than Ferguson. Difference is he offers something in attack.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Only idiots would tbh.

Yep.

QLD got where they are by backing Inglis, Smith, Cronk, Thurston when they were young players with tonnes of potential. Inglis was 19, Thurston 21, Boyd 20, Slater 20, Smith 19, Scott 20.....and so on. They picked players for the future and stuck with them and that's a big part of the reason these guys are so good.

How can a player ever take the step up if they never play rep footy til they're 28? They're not likely to improve a lot. Picking and sticking with muppets has netted us 10% of the last 10 series....why not try sticking with the next generation for a few series?

Who is this new generation of superstars that you are referring to? Hopefully they are better than the three nuffies you listed in an earlier post.

 

[Chipmunk]

We stick with these players because there is no-one better. Queensland have a handful of 9/10 or 10/10 players. We only have Hayne who is still below his best (and maybe Tedesco) and then a bunch of guys who are 7 or 8 out of 10 for quality. The problem is we have a f**kload of such players which causes ignorant fans to ask "Why not pick a different player (of equivalent quality)?!? (Player X) has FAILED AT ORIGIN!!!" as if a different 8/10 player will magically improve in an Origin match.

Cordner is as good as any forward Qld has to offer.

 

[Bazal]

Yep.



Who is this new generation of superstars that you are referring to? Hopefully they are better than the three nuffies you listed in an earlier post.

You're edging into Pou territory calling Tedesco, TrbojgfbakjdvfKLAJdfvafdgjHAGFJhagfBRAH and Leilua nuffies...arguably in the top three attacking players in their positions in the NRL.

Heck I'd argue Tedesco is up with Boyd as the best all round fullback in the game at the moment.

 

[Gary Gutful]

You're edging into Pou territory calling Tedesco, TrbojgfbakjdvfKLAJdfvafdgjHAGFJhagfBRAH and Leilua nuffies...arguably in the top three attacking players in their positions in the NRL.

Heck I'd argue Tedesco is up with Boyd as the best all round fullback in the game at the moment.

We should be assessing where they were at when the last Origin match was played, not where they are at now.

 

[Bazal]

We should be assessing where they were at when the last Origin match was played, not where they are at now.

Why? I'm talking about picks for this Origin series....

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Really? So how many years and years of professionalism and success at club level did Slater, Inglis, Thurston, Smith, Scott, Boyd and co have as 19 and 20 year olds when they were picked for Origin debuts??

And how good were they at Origin level when they debuted?

Leilua is only marginally worse in defence than Ferguson. Difference is he offers something in attack.

Agreed but Ferguson is a winger.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Cordner is as good as any forward Qld has to offer.

Agreed, but I think our pack matches Queensland's. And very few forwards are as influential in attack as guys like Inglis and Thurston.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

You're edging into Pou territory calling Tedesco, TrbojgfbakjdvfKLAJdfvafdgjHAGFJhagfBRAH and Leilua nuffies...arguably in the top three attacking players in their positions in the NRL.

Heck I'd argue Tedesco is up with Boyd as the best all round fullback in the game at the moment.

I rate Tedesco ahead of Boyd. Leilua is one of the best attacking players in the NRL but also one of the worst defensive centres (a position full of quality defenders). Trbojevich is about as good as Dugan and Boyd.

 

[Bazal]

And how good were they at Origin level when they debuted?

Cameron Smith was player of the series in a losing side as a 22 year old....I'd suggest that across the board they were better than Blake Ferguson and Josh Dugan are now as debutants.

Ferguson and Dugan do not have the talent of Tedesco, Leilua, Trbojevic, Bird, and others. Nor do they have the potential for improvement. NSW have won 1/10 Origin series picking "solid" players, what possible reason is there to continue? QLD picked their young guns early and stuck with the ones who were up to it. 9/10 series suggests maybe they were on the right track, wouldn't you think?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Cameron Smith was player of the series in a losing side as a 22 year old....I'd suggest that across the board they were better than Blake Ferguson and Josh Dugan are now as debutants.

Ferguson and Dugan do not have the talent of Tedesco, Leilua, Trbojevic, Bird, and others. Nor do they have the potential for improvement. NSW have won 1/10 Origin series picking "solid" players, what possible reason is there to continue? QLD picked their young guns early and stuck with the ones who were up to it. 9/10 series suggests maybe they were on the right track, wouldn't you think?

But that's just the point - they were picked because they were better. If we had such quality young players we would pick them too. But the young players aren't as good at first grade level as the experienced guys. We can't worry about winning future Origins before trying to win now, and picking worse players just because they're younger isn't the way to go about it. You're assuming the Queenslanders are better because they were picked young. Far more likely is that they were picked young because they were better.

 

[Bazal]

But that's just the point - they were picked because they were better. If we had such quality young players we would pick them too. But the young players aren't as good at first grade level as the experienced guys. We can't worry about winning future Origins before trying to win now, and picking worse players just because they're younger isn't the way to go about it. You're assuming the Queenslanders are better because they were picked young. Far more likely is that they were picked young because they were better.

I didn't say they were better because they were picked younger. I said they became 9/10 or 10/10 players because they were picked as young 7 or 8/10 players. They grew immensely as players from playing rep footy at a young age.

There is no doubt that Tedesco is as talented as GI or Slater, definitely more so than Slater who had nothing but speed when he first came into the NRL. Trobojevic is as good as Slater was when he was picked. Leilua (although a bit older so not really comparable to the young guys) is a far better player than the likes of Chambers, Nielsen, Tate, Josh Hannay, Matt King, Steven Bell, and others who have had as much or more impact in Origin when compared to Dugan and Ferguson.....there is no reason these guys can't be better than the nuffies we pick, and they certainly aren't worse at the moment so what do we lose?

If we're going to pick and stick, take a leaf out of the "We've won 9/10 origins book" and pick the young guns ffs

 

[Gary Gutful]

Why? I'm talking about picks for this Origin series....

I was talking about people hanging shit on him for selections in previous years.

Maybe Tedesco, Tbbtbrbrbrrriorourekjerkjserjkhzdjh and BJ are ready now. But they sure as f**k weren't in previous years. I don't blame Laurie for not picking them to date.

 

[Bazal]

I was talking about people hanging shit on him for selections in previous years.

Maybe Tedesco, Tbbtbrbrbrrriorourekjerkjserjkhzdjh and BJ are ready now. But they sure as f**k weren't in previous years. I don't blame Laurie for not picking them to date.

That's fair enough (bar Tedesco who was killing it last year too, as was Lachlan Coote), but I was talking about this year tbh. Look what QLD built by identifying and blooding young talent...bar a couple of freaks like Tedesco we can't match that crop of talent exactly, but neither can QLD when they retire. If you've got Dugan who is a 7/10 player at 26, and Jack Bird who is an 8/10 player at 22 with potential to improve, why would you pick Dugan on the back of 9 losses?

 

[I'm a loser baby...]

Isn't Tedesco the incumbent fullback?

 

[strider]

Isn't Tedesco the incumbent fullback?

Yeah ... they gave moylan a go last year when teddy was injured, but im sure he played game 3