3 exercises not used enough

[Dirty Hoe]

+1 for posterior chain, but, do it properly! I've been squatting and dead-lifting for a couple of years now and have hit some back pain in the last 9 months or so. Just sort of ignored it for a bit but now I have decided to put the ego in check and start doing something about it.

I realised I have been doing these lifts all with quads and lower back. I barely feel anything in my glutes and hammies because my hip posture is all wrong, my flexibility is shocking and my glutes are basically dormant. I Think all this has sort of compressed my lower back a bit, which can hit a nerve and cause a bit of pain and discomfort. Apparently this is all fairly common for non-lifters who sit down a lot and even lifters who aren't in pain or anything, so i've probably been building up to this moment for years without even realising it.

Here's the article I started with, but i've read a whole bunch more http://stronglifts.com/how-to-optimize-posterior-chain-power-glute-activation/

I've pretty much stopped squats and deads until my back is right, working on hip and hamstring flexibility as well as glute activation and will start doing pull-throughs and glute-ham raises along with most of the exercises in the above article and some light upper body stuff (Bench, Bent over Rows). Once I feel my flexibility is good enough and my back is free of pain I will start rebuilding my deads and squats from scratch so I don't f**k myself up. Short term loss of ego for future prosperity.

So pretty much: Work on your flexibility, sort your posture out.

why completely stop doing deads and squats? dont stop doing them, instead practice good form. dont worry about weight, concentrate on form.

what you can do is stand facing a wall (stand about 5 cm from the wall, feet slightly wider than shoulder width, feet slightly angled out). squat down as if you were doing a squat or dead, think of it as if you were sitting down on a chair. dont use any weight to start. you can use the wall to see where you are going wrong. if your form is wrong you wont be able to squat down without hitting the wall. you may well find your forehead will hit the wall as you go down. keeping practicing this and eventually you will be able to put your feet right against the wall and be able to squat down with perfect form without touching the wall.
from there you take that form to the rack and gradually build the weight up.

 

[Martli]

why completely stop doing deads and squats? dont stop doing them, instead practice good form. dont worry about weight, concentrate on form.

what you can do is stand facing a wall (stand about 5 cm from the wall, feet slightly wider than shoulder width, feet slightly angled out). squat down as if you were doing a squat or dead, think of it as if you were sitting down on a chair. dont use any weight to start. you can use the wall to see where you are going wrong. if your form is wrong you wont be able to squat down without hitting the wall. you may well find your forehead will hit the wall as you go down. keeping practicing this and eventually you will be able to put your feet right against the wall and be able to squat down with perfect form without touching the wall.
from there you take that form to the rack and gradually build the weight up.

Only going to stop until the pain subsides. On Tuesday I did some deadlift technique practise with 60kg and got through ok but I just want to take a break and focus on my flexibility first for a bit. We're probably talking 1 month max so it's nothing major.

Thanks for the tip re: squatting in front of a wall. Just tested it out at then, I can do it without hitting the wall, but my main problem is that my back is too curved (ie my top half is too far back) and I'm not pushing through with my glutes enough which is a posture issue I'm trying to sort out. But I'll definitely test this out a bit better at the gym.

Nice! I would love to be able to afford a Glute Ham Raise.

We have a pretty basic one at the gym, will see how it goes tomorrow.

 

[Shorty]

Also along the lines of posture: Work on shoulder posture. A lot of emphasis is placed on big chest, lats, shoulders, this all pulls your shoulders forward if you don't balance out the back. I see heaps of people (myself included) walking around the gym like this.

Yeah I went in depth about this at the beginning of the thread.

Well I occasionally see people doing Smith Machine Squats, which in my opinion, doesn't count. May as well throw the thing out.

Smith Machine is made for explosive power work outs etc more for athletes.

Tal, anybody that doesn't actually do proper squats would be laughed at by professionals (and probably everyone else), those guys look like idiots and are the ones that do biceps curls like they're back curls!
I'm sure most people do squats or lunges, whether they actually do them correct is probably a different story.

Squats also have a large number of variants that can get you deeper glute activation or medial quads.

 

[GuardDog]

Well I occasionally see people doing Smith Machine Squats, which in my opinion, doesn't count. May as well throw the thing out.

yep squats/deads in the smith machine is just wrong only free weights count

 

[GuardDog]

Squats

Neglected you say? Hell yes! Have a look around your local gym and count how many guys have massive chests and arms and pencil-thin legs.

Squats work virtually every muscle in your lower body, especially when you add a calf raise to the end of each rep. Plus squats stimulate Human Growth Hormone production leading to accelarated overall muscle growth.

No workout is complete without squats.

AMEN no decent strength program is worth it unless it has
squats,deads,bench press,pull ups,bent over rows and other compounds done in free weights.Should try the super squats program from Strossen if you haven't tried already Tal

 

[GuardDog]

Yeah I went in depth about this at the beginning of the thread.


Smith Machine is made for explosive power work outs etc more for athletes.

Tal, anybody that doesn't actually do proper squats would be laughed at by professionals (and probably everyone else), those guys look like idiots and are the ones that do biceps curls like they're back curls!
I'm sure most people do squats or lunges, whether they actually do them correct is probably a different story.

Squats also have a large number of variants that can get you deeper glute activation or medial quads.

:lol: yep the quarter squat brigade

 

[18to87]

Smith Machine is made for explosive power work outs etc more for athletes.

Other than explosive bench throws and using the smith machine bar to do push ups on, I can't think of any other good uses for an athlete.

 

[GuardDog]

Other than explosive bench throws and using the smith machine bar to do push ups on, I can't think of any other good uses for an athlete.

smith machines and other machines in gyms should be for rehab only,.otherwise best melted down and forged into extra weights

 

[Shorty]

Other than explosive bench throws and using the smith machine bar to do push ups on, I can't think of any other good uses for an athlete.

Shoulder press, explosive power squats etc...
They're meant for fatigue work outs, they're safer when you can't lift anymore...they latch on etc.
But yeah I wouldn't buy one speficically.

 

[18to87]

Shoulder press, explosive power squats etc...
They're meant for fatigue work outs, they're safer when you can't lift anymore...they latch on etc.
But yeah I wouldn't buy one speficically.

Each to their own.

You couldn't pay me to squat in a smith machine no matter the circumstances, there is always a better option.

If you can't lift anymore, there is always bodyweight work, isometrics, core work or maybe its just time to call it a day and start focusing on going heavier next workout.

I don't claim to be an expert but the smith machine doesn't allow for your body to be in its natural groove so I would think it would be more dangerous when you are fatigued.

 

[Shorty]

No, I meant fatigue work...as in until muscle failure, it's a much safer option.
I remember using smith machines for this exact method ages ago studying and they were effective.

 

[GuardDog]

Each to their own.

You couldn't pay me to squat in a smith machine no matter the circumstances, there is always a better option.

If you can't lift anymore, there is always bodyweight work, isometrics, core work or maybe its just time to call it a day and start focusing on going heavier next workout.

I don't claim to be an expert but the smith machine doesn't allow for your body to be in its natural groove so I would think it would be more dangerous when you are fatigued.

my problem with doing deads and squats using a smith machine is that it travels on rails/rods on a straight line not allowing for the proper motion,potentially hurting the lower back but each to their own

 

[Shorty]

It wouldn't hurt your lower back unless you were a beginner, someone doing a proper squat would be fine but it wouldn't focus as much on certain muscles.
Like I said, it's an expensive specialist machine that has a few things it can assist in but otherwise you'd just stick to your usual bench.

 

[18to87]

my problem with doing deads and squats using a smith machine is that it travels on rails/rods on a straight line not allowing for the proper motion,potentially hurting the lower back but each to their own

I totally agree. And just because it doesn't hurt your back then and there when using the smith machine doesn't mean your not setting yourself up for problems down the track.

I am not a huge fan of muscle failure, for athletes anyway, but even when going to failure there is better ways to do so than using the smith machine.

 

[Shorty]

That's the point, it's a specialist machine...it's not supposed to be used all the time, and I don't think it'd cause problems unless you were doing it incorrectly.They wouldn't have it in gyms if the actual equipment caused injury, they wouldn't be bought.
lol but we all have machines we don't like....I'm not a fan of any weight machines, probably because I've never worked with them prefer free weights.

 

[yawn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E9CDUiyBhc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LRineGRKI4

Depends at how many heights your cable crossover machine can adjust to. A lot of them you can only pull from the bottom and top of the machine.

Others have a complex system where you can have the cable coming out at any of 30 different heights.

Shoulders are the weak civilian muscle that you need to improve particularly.

Here's some exercises most people in the weight lifting universe will have never seen.

1. Cable Shoulder raises front , back and side

With front raises an underhand grip is best to isolate the front head. Otherwise the side head is heavily involved.
With back and side raises you should use neutral grip.

2. Underhand Cable crossovers. There is no need for benching at all in the modern gym.

You can do these lying on a bench between two crossovers.

Or standing up preferably one arm at a time so you are not being fatigued in your core.

3. Bicep Cable Curls.

Cables are superior because Gravity does not interfere.

With Shoulders you need a cable on a pulley to put a constant tension of the muscle for the whole movement.

With dumbells the angle of gravity makes the resistance not constant.

 

[GuardDog]

nothing beats old school compound movements with steady progression to heavy weights as soon as it gets easier(more than 8 reps)
simple heavy movements allow you to focus your energy resulting in strength and power in the muscle,tendons and ligaments
too many young lads in gyms focus on little muscle pumping movements and wonder why their strength doesnt increase

 

[18to87]

nothing beats old school compound movements with steady progression to heavy weights as soon as it gets easier(more than 8 reps)
simple heavy movements allow you to focus your energy resulting in strength and power in the muscle,tendons and ligaments
too many young lads in gyms focus on little muscle pumping movements and wonder why their strength doesnt increase

This!

However I rarely do over 5 reps for compound movements.

And if your strong enough to care about gravity. Hook up some chains or bands to your Bench and Squat.

 

[GuardDog]

This!

However I rarely do over 5 reps for compound movements.

And if your strong enough to care about gravity. Hook up some chains or bands to your Bench and Squat.

ooohh yeah that would be an awesome achievement for me to need those items for a challenging workout,.with hard work anything's possible and dreaming is free
btw that "8" was a typo,.i follow the old school 5x5 system

 

[Martli]

Here's some exercises most people in the weight lifting universe will have never seen.

I see these all the time, and most of the people doing them aren't all that big/strong.

There is no need for benching at all in the modern gym.

Really? Most people agree that compound free-weight movements, of which the bench-press is one, are the core to any decent strength training regime. I wouldn't dream of replacing it with a cable movement.