3rd test: NZ v Pakistan

[lockyno1]

What did he have to lose? If he loses a challenge so be it, he was 89. It was worth a punt. Vettorri should have known it was damn close as well. NZ have 2 challenges, at worst they would have 1 left even if he was wrong!

 

[Captain BF]

Excellent partnership between Vettori & McCullum.

What did everyone think of the incident between Kaniera &Vettori? It looked like an intentional trip to me. If it happened in League or AFL, he would be suspended.

I wonder what would have happened if while Vettori was laying on the ground after (imo) him being intentionally tripped, Kaniera had run Vettori out, would it be given as out? Would the 3rd umpire be allowed to be called on? Is it in the spirit of cricket?

Personally, i thought the trip wasn't in the spirit of cricket.

Pakistan bowling look pretty weak. Occassional decent spell like the second innings in the 1st test. Perhaps all of that test actually...

What has happened to the fat left handed Kiwi batsman? I can't remember his name. He was doing pretty well last year. Possibly injured?

 

[lockyno1]

Jesse Ryder is his name, pretty sure he is injured.

 

[Meth]

McCallum's decision was a straight dismissal as far as he could tell. Somebody was saying the other day that with the referral system, the non-striker should be watching the front foot and initiating a referral if the umpire has missed a no-ball.

 

[Meth]

My opinion on the opener dilemma is that Cumming, Papps, Bell, McIntosh, Redmond and How are all a much of a muchness.

Yeah- it is a dilemma. Just about every serious potential candidate has had an opportunity and is rubbished on account of their previous performances.

 

[Iafeta]

My opinion on the opener dilemma is that Cumming, Papps, Bell, McIntosh, Redmond and How are all a much of a muchness. I haven't looked at their test averages but all of those guys are likely to average between 20-30 at test level if they were given a sustained run in the side imo. There is no standout player amongst them who has the potential to average more than that. McIntosh might as well be persevered with.

Daniel Flynn will surely be dropped after this test match however. He really needs to refine his technique. I hate that ridiculous wofting of his bat during his backlift. I don't know whether he uses it as a trigger movement, but it is just f**king stupid. I cannot remember whether Crowe mentioned this or whether I said it myself while he was batting, but the wofting limits his reaction time to the delivery. It means that he takes a split second longer to get in a set position and is always rushed as a result.

He is also struggling big time with his balance. I don't have a problem with batsmen playing around their front pad, but in Flynn's case he isn't getting his eyes over the ball. Instead he finds himself off balance and a prime candidate for LBW everytime he tries to play the ball around his front pad.

Correct on Flynn. The way he's setting up, he's bringing the blade down from gully. It cuts him off a lot to go down the ground, and it also kinda cuts off his leg side play because with his arms going out there, his head tilts that way too so he's closed off and has to hit around his front pad. If the ball cuts back in on him, he's got no money to play it.

The faults on these batsmen are very simple. Fulton's for example is that he plays too much from the crease. If he was pressing off either foot he'd be a good bat.

 

[edabomb]

I have to say Tuffey is quickly becoming my favourite current Black Cap. He's been great since he has become available again. Not to mention the sex tape and 14 ball over stuff that happened a few years ago. Legend.

 

[Hallatia]

McCallum's decision was a straight dismissal as far as he could tell. Somebody was saying the other day that with the referral system, the non-striker should be watching the front foot and initiating a referral if the umpire has missed a no-ball.

perhaps, but the problem I have with this one is that I really think umpires should NOT be missing front foot no balls

 

[Deleted member 10972]

In my opinion, the top 3 is the biggest issue.

Taylor and Ryder make the ideal 4/5. McCullum is a fine 7. On green pitches NZ should play a seam-bowling allrounder at 6 (Franklin? Elliott? - one of them needs to find more consistency) with Vettori batting at 8, but on spinning pitches Vettori can bat at 6, with Jeetan Patel coming into the bowling line-up.

The best higher order talents are Guptill and Flynn. Both can either open or bat at 3, but while Guptill is a compulsive driver, Flynn is more gritty. Both SHOULD be persisted with IMO.

McIntosh is still a question mark. One good innings amidst several poor ones is not good enough at Test level.

 

[African Monkey]

In my opinion, the top 3 is the biggest issue.

Taylor and Ryder make the ideal 4/5. McCullum is a fine 7. On green pitches NZ should play a seam-bowling allrounder at 6 (Franklin? Elliott? - one of them needs to find more consistency) with Vettori batting at 8, but on spinning pitches Vettori can bat at 6, with Jeetan Patel coming into the bowling line-up.

The best higher order talents are Guptill and Flynn. Both can either open or bat at 3, but while Guptill is a compulsive driver, Flynn is more gritty. Both SHOULD be persisted with IMO.

McIntosh is still a question mark. One good innings amidst several poor ones is not good enough at Test level.

What green tracks are we talking about in NZ? All of our tracks here these days are flat. Unfortunately our batsmen lack the skill required for test cricket.

Guptill and Flynn should go back to domestic cricket, sort out their technical issues as well as score runs there. Guptill has 1 FC century ffs. He can't live on potential forever.

Jeetan Patel should never play another test for NZ. He's our version of Nathan Hauritz if you ask me with a very poor FC record.

Does anyone know if Johann Myburgh is or when he is elligible of NZ?

 

[Non Terminator]

I believe it's sometime next year...I think.

 

[African Monkey]

That would be good.

 

[KeepingTheFaith]

Guptil's problem is mental more than anything else. He's an instinctive shot playing batsman who is caught in two minds in the test arena where he feels he has to preserve his wicket at the expense of scoring runs.

The current scrutiny won't help and if anything will push him further back into his shell.

I'd be dropping Flynn before Guptil, shifting Guptil to 5 and Ryder (if he gets his act together) coming in at 3.

 

[JJ]

Guptill is talented, no question

but he's played sweet f**k all first class cricket, and done sweet f**k all in what he's played...

 

[Iafeta]

I'm of the opinion that McCullum tends to set up the slip cordon and himself too deeply. Too knicks, two half volley-ers. On a slow pitch, standing a long way back is ridiculous. My cash is on Pakistan.

Also, what is Vettori classed as these days? It should be left arm slow medium. Is he even trying to spin the ball? Its funny how many wickets he's got, because he never turns it off the straight.

 

[African Monkey]

Also, what is Vettori classed as these days? It should be left arm slow medium. Is he even trying to spin the ball? Its funny how many wickets he's got, because he never turns it off the straight.

Yep I don't know what to classify Vettori as. His last spell was one of the dullest, un-inspiring spells I've seen in a while from someone classified by everyone as 'world class'. I could have troubled the batsmen more than Vettori.

 

[Iafeta]

This 'there's no turn' talk is mind blowing. Kaneria found it. Vettori couldn't turn it on a mindfield. And the thing is he only has to turn it a few inches off a good length to change the line, but he can't do it. The amount of times New Zealand has had the last day to roll a team and claim a test victory... and Vettori has been simply unable to do it, is amazing. This is why he's not world class, he's a fighter, and a battler, but he's not a great test bowler.

 

[African Monkey]

This 'there's no turn' talk is mind blowing. Kaneria found it. Vettori couldn't turn it on a mindfield. And the thing is he only has to turn it a few inches off a good length to change the line, but he can't do it. The amount of times New Zealand has had the last day to roll a team and claim a test victory... and Vettori has been simply unable to do it, is amazing. This is why he's not world class, he's a fighter, and a battler, but he's not a great test bowler.

Exactly. I also notice that when his record gets bought up on TV, the commentators start wanking on about the amount of wickets he has in his career instead of talking about his average.

He's nothing more than an honest toiler.

 

[JJ]

v Aust 57 wickets @ 35 (16 tests)
v Bang 46 wickets @14 (8 tests)
v Eng 45 wicket @ 37 (17 tests)
v India 26 wickets @ 55 (12 tests)
v Pak 12 wickets @ 57 (6 tests)
v RSA 18 wickets @ 70 (11 tests!)
v SL 51 wickets @ 24 (11 tests)
v WI 33 wickets @ 26 (9 tests)
v Zim 23 wickets @ 31 (7 tests)

Speaks for itself really, although it seems it says different things to different people. But I'd play him as our #6

 

[hineyrulz]

When you add in his batting he is a very handy cricketer, but some of the comments you hear about him are laughable. Someone even placed him around the same level as Hadlee :lol: