5TH ASHES TEST: @ The Oval London July 26-30, 2023

[undertaker]

Nothing like beating up on the windies at home to have the dopes at CA tickling themselves with joy.

Seriously, when was the last time we played a test series (min. 2 tests) against a team over consecutive summers?

Whoever was responsible for the scheduling didn't see the utter stupidity of this.

 

[gUt]

 

[undertaker]

2005 - all star team got ambushed.

 

[Twizzle]

 

[AlwaysGreen]

For me Root (ave 51 1 100 2 50s) easily ahead of Smith (avg 37 1 100 1 50) and Head (average 36 3 50s)...

Bairstow's runs vs Carey's ability to catch? lol or as a batter?

As I said Root unlucky. Bairstow was embarrassing behind the stumps.

 

[undertaker]

https://www.news.com.au/sport/cricket/pat-cummins-calls-ashes-tour-a-success-despite-drawn-series/news-story/da10312fa78bf8ed9e02e14239748f1b

 

[bazza]

Broad would keep asking for the glasses to be changed.

Apparently, he whinged for the entire second Aussie innings while we ere none for, and his argument was not that the ball was old, because it wasn't. He was heard to say "The ball is doing nothing, how can we take wickets if the ball isn't swinging ?"

Unbelievable that the umpires caved on that argument.

tbf to to the umps - they only changed it after Khawaja git hit on the lid

 

[undertaker]

Although unlikely, I do hope some form of disciplinary action is taken against whoever was responsible for the ball selection in the aftermath of that whole ball change controversy.

I don't know if they did, but if they didn't, the Aussies should have definitely lodged a complaint at the time to the match referee about that farcical situation.

 

[icewind]

Only upside from this, is maybe, just maybe Smith might be motivated to play one last away Ashes series. Woakes/Wood/Anderson should be all gone by then.

 

[Eelectrica]

Although unlikely, I do hope some form of disciplinary action is taken against whoever was responsible for the ball selection in the aftermath of that whole ball change controversy.

I don't know if they did, but if they didn't, the Aussies should have definitely lodged a complaint to the match referee about that farcical situation.

Yep. Have been thinking the same thing.

I’d imagine they’d have several boxes of balls for different ages. Maybe 1-5, 6-10 and so on. How that ball got in the 30+ over box needs to be questioned.

Maybe it was a 3 over ball and someone grabbed the 30 over box by mistake and dropped it in. Either way the umps should have realised it was not a 30 over ball.

 

[JJ]

As I said Root unlucky. Bairstow was embarrassing behind the stumps.

yep, just giving my 2c, I'd have Root and Smith probably, leave out Head

Agree on Bairstow, although he was important with the bat - as you note, Woakes was the game changer, he's terrific in the UK

 

[undertaker]

Can't remember who, but someone on this thread earlier brought up the issue of pitch doctoring to favor certain types of bowlers.

The difference between the ball-change situation last night and pitch doctoring, or pitches that offer an excessive amount of assistance for bowlers (e.g. Gabba 2022, Indore 2023):

Yes, although those pitches produce an uneven balance between bat and ball, it doesn't constitue unfair play between the two teams in the sense that both teams had to bat and bowl on the same pitch (the exception being if the pitch was tampered with in the 4th innings, meaning the bowling team wouldn't have to bat on the tampered surface).

Using the pitch analogy, the situation that happened yesterday with the ball change would be the equivalent of changing pitches during an innings. One moment, you're playing the match on a flat track that is a batsman's paradise. Then the umpire says at the lunch/dinner break to the batting side "ok guys, after the break, we're going to resume the game on another pitch that is 10 metres away", and the second pitch after the break offered an excessive amount of turn, bounce, seam/swing movement right from ball one. Unfair play and an unfair contest.

What happened yesterday definitely constituted unfair play. NO, it was not cheating from England as they didn't choose the replacement ball. However, there's absolutely no way they would've bowled Australia out with the ball that was used in the first 38 overs. Furthermore, McCullum and the Poms would've been bitching deluxe if the roles were reversed, and it was Starc/Cummins/Hazlewood achieving that excessive amount of swing and seam movement from a replacement ball that Woakes and Broad got yesterday. Not only did the replacement ball look much less than 38 overs old, it also had a more pronounced seam (especially on the second split-screen shot that Sky Sports took of the difference between the two balls), hence offering massive assistance to the bowlers.

 

[undertaker]

However, what was cheating from the Poms though was what they did to Jacques Kallis in 2008 at Edgbaston, denying Kallis' request to move the white tarp around the sidescreen to cover a certain area of the ground near the dressing room, hence allowing Flintoff to exploit an unfair advantage of bowling very wide on the crease and release the ball from a blindspot. As a result, several balls that Kallis either didn't see or was very late onto the shot, as he had difficulties picking up the release point of the ball. If that was the extent the Poms had to go to to get a batsman out, it was a dog act. Blatant cheating, and also against Baz' Spirit of the Game mantra.

Poms love to wank on years later about how that was one of the iconic, brilliant spells of bowling from Flintoff. Complete, utter tripe.

 

[undertaker]

Yep. Have been thinking the same thing.

I’d imagine they’d have several boxes of balls for different ages. Maybe 1-5, 6-10 and so on. How that ball got in the 30+ over box needs to be questioned.

Maybe it was a 3 over ball and someone grabbed the 30 over box by mistake and dropped it in. Either way the umps should have realised it was not a 30 over ball.

No doubt there would've been more than one box of used balls on standby at The Oval.

Furthermore, if the umpire couldn't see how new that ball looked compared to the previous ball where one side looked like it had been viciously chewed by a German Shepherd, that is more than conclusive evidence to show that the umpire shouldn't be umpiring at test match level, let alone primary school cricket.

Yes, I understand that everyone makes mistakes, no one is perfect. However, that decision was an elementary blunder that shouldn't happen at any level of cricket, let alone it was a mistake that had a huge bearing on the outcome of a match. The entire momentum of the match completely changed after that blunder.

 

[undertaker]

Only upside from this, is maybe, just maybe Smith might be motivated to play one last away Ashes series. Woakes/Wood/Anderson should be all gone by then.

I don't think he will be around for the 2027 Ashes

Hedging my bets, I don't see him going on any longer than the 2025/26 home Ashes series

 

[undertaker]

I'm not sure as an English cricket fan, I would be throwing shade at other teams away performances.

The ashes only has the interest it does because of how Australia performs in England. When it is hosted in Australia it is a dull series because we all know the result before a ball is even bowled in anger.

last 10 ashes series in England

England - 18
Australia - 23
Draw - 12

Last 10 tashes series in Australia

England - 9
Australia - 33
Draw - 8

5 of the wins came in the 2 series they won in that time so only 4 wins out of 40 tests in the series they have lost.

lol

Since the 1986 Boxing Day test, England have only won a paltry 6 Ashes tests in Australia: 3 of those 6 wins alone were in the 2010/11 series.

Over the same period, Australia have won 23 Ashes tests in England.

 

[King-Gutho94]

Seriously, when was the last time we played a test series (min. 2 tests) against a team over consecutive summers?

Whoever was responsible for the scheduling didn't see the utter stupidity of this.

ICC did the FTA.

The cycle ended last year and starts again now.

But yes very dumb.

Why not invite Bangladesh out and give them some respect with a few tests they have beaten us the same amount of times as the kiwis since 93.

Plus its going to be the same result anyway a complete flogging.

 

[undertaker]

ICC did the FTA.

The cycle ended last year and starts again now.

But yes very dumb.

Why not invite Bangladesh out and give them some respect with a few tests they have beaten us the same amount of times as the kiwis since 93.

Plus its going to be the same result anyway a complete flogging.

Agreed.

A joke that we haven't played Zimbabwe in test cricket for nearly 2 decades, and haven't played Bangladesh much as well during that same interval.

I mean, why give those nations test status, yet deprive them of opportunities in that arena? Same can be said for Ireland and Afghanistan. They've barely played any tests since being awarded test status a few years ago.

Do the ICC want those nations playing tests, or is test cricket eventually just going to be Australia, India and England?

EDIT: Zimbabwe did offer to play a test during their tour of Australia last year, but surprise surprise, Cricket Australia rejected their proposal. Pathetic

 

[King-Gutho94]

Agreed.

A joke that we haven't played Zimbabwe in test cricket for nearly 2 decades, and haven't played Bangladesh much as well during that same interval.

I mean, why give those nations test status, yet deprive them of opportinities in that arena? Same can be said for Ireland and Afghanistan. Do the ICC want those nations playing tests, or is test cricket eventually just going to be Australia, India and England?

EDIT: Zimbabwe did offer to play a test during their tour of Australia last year, but surprise surprise, Cricket Australia rejected their proposal. Pathetic

CA are a scum of an organisation.

I suppose we had the WTC final this time but even in 2019 when Ireland had test status why not play 2 tests in Ireland before the Ashes.

Seeing as we're basically there instead of 2 warm up games against counties. How much would that generate for cricket in Ireland if we played a test in Dublin and Belfast.

 

[jargan83]

CA are a scum of an organisation.

I suppose we had the WTC final this time but even in 2019 when Ireland had test status why not play 2 tests in Ireland before the Ashes.

Seeing as we're basically there instead of 2 warm up games against counties. How much would that generate for cricket in Ireland if we played a test in Dublin and Belfast.

I think we tried to play Ireland in a warm up Test series in 2019 but I'm pretty sure England beat us to it that year.