Beers cost footy players three days in recovery

[El Diablo]

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/sport/nrl/story/0,26746,25276497-5003409,00.html

Beers cost footy players three days in recovery

Mike Hurst | April 01, 2009 11:00pm

HERE is the scientific report every footballer needs to read before even thinking about cracking open the top of their next stubby of beer.

Studies have shown a few drinks after training can take more than 60 hours to physically recover from.

In all likelihood a player who has a few beers after training tonight won't be back to his best until Sunday night at the earliest.

"The results of this study are absolutely stunning," NSW Institute of Sport chief scientist Kenneth Graham told The Courier-Mail yesterday.

Graham was referring to the simple but dramatic study done by fellow Australian Steve Stannard (and associates) at Massey University, New Zealand, and presented at the European College of Sports Science annual conference last year.

"The graph displaying recovery actually projects that you're easily looking at 72 hours before you can recover from a few beers and the reality is you don't get 70 hours between resistance work (weightlifting or body contact training) or running training when you're an elite athlete," Mr Graham said.

The alcohol level used in the study was the equivalent of five schooners of beer for a 100kg male.

At least one NRL club has already taken the physiological research to heart this season.

"I got Kenneth to come and actually chat to the boys about that sort of thing," South Sydney coach Jason Taylor said.

Sports medicine doctor Nathan Gibbs said the adverse effects of alcohol on recovery were particularly significant in the case of injured or sore players.

"If you're actually injured, alcohol will increase blood flow, leading to increased bleeding and swelling," he said.

For players who simply had muscle soreness from a game, alcohol caused dehydration which geniused muscle recovery by slowing the removal of lactic acid.

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Beers cost damn near $7 at the football.

 

[Eels Dude]

I don't buy these 'scientific studies'. It's basically a bunch of Masters students doing a bit of research and coming to a generic conclusion. If you read the newspapers every single week there's dozens of stories stating "recent studies have shown that... bla bla bla".

The amount of time, money and effort wasted trying to work out the best way for people to lose weight is highly disturbing.

I take this article with a grain of salt.

 

[$$Poor Boy Blues$$]

Beers cost damn near $7 at the football.

LOL!

When i was doing weight training, i delved deep into biology and sports science.

For muscles, alcohol is a gigantic no-no.

It ruins your gains dramatically. Not only does it impinge on blood flow and stops lactic acid from leaving your muscles, it kills off testosterone levels, drops your liver's efficiency, and interferes with digestion.

In body building (and other sports), recovery is everything. Its the culmination of all your work so you can be 100% again as fast as possible and flog your body all over again. The three pieces of the puzzle are (weights or other training/nutriton/rest-sleep). If you booze up during the recovery phases where your body repairs itself, you are severely limiting your gains in fitness, etc.

Basically, if you do a session and then have some beers, you would be wasting your time. The decrease in your body's efficiency is astronomical. I've never understood how footy players can drink so much. I guess their one saving grace would be that its probably limited to one session a week, after the game. After the event may be the best time in an athletes regeme to consume alcohol.

But its hardly ideal during a season.

If you liken this to a football player, this kind of behavior could be costing them a premiership.

 

[bartman]

Trouble is that unlike most other sports people, our rugby league players by and large don't care about the athlete part of being a professional athlete... they just care about their $$$$.

Ask yourself how many of them earn more than the prime minister, and then ask yourself whether they shouldn't be making some kind of leisure time sacrifices for the privilege - for their own sake as well as that of their employer (club) and industry (league).

 

[Kiki]

bart i think thats an extremely cynical view. and a massive generalisation. you keep lumping footy players into a huge group when the fact is they are just as varied as any other group of people. it breaks my heart when i see footy players getting such a bad rap when i know for a fact alot of them are absolutely lovely blokes with nothing but respect for their job.

sometimes it seems that you really loathe footy players. i dont get it?? i know you adore the game.

 

[caylo]

LOL!

When i was doing weight training, i delved deep into biology and sports science.

For muscles, alcohol is a gigantic no-no.

It ruins your gains dramatically. Not only does it impinge on blood flow and stops lactic acid from leaving your muscles, it kills off testosterone levels, drops your liver's efficiency, and interferes with digestion.

In body building (and other sports), recovery is everything. Its the culmination of all your work so you can be 100% again as fast as possible and flog your body all over again. The three pieces of the puzzle are (weights or other training/nutriton/rest-sleep). If you booze up during the recovery phases where your body repairs itself, you are severely limiting your gains in fitness, etc.

Basically, if you do a session and then have some beers, you would be wasting your time. The decrease in your body's efficiency is astronomical. I've never understood how footy players can drink so much. I guess their one saving grace would be that its probably limited to one session a week, after the game. After the event may be the best time in an athletes regeme to consume alcohol.

But its hardly ideal during a season.

If you liken this to a football player, this kind of behavior could be costing them a premiership.

first and for-most, the idea that lactic acid is what causes pain after a arobic session was disproved by physiologist about 3 years ago. Lactic acid is removed from your blood stream in 3 seconds. To slow this process down isn't a big deal because it might now stay in your body for 20 seconds (guess?) but not doing any damage, so you will just feel the effects for a little bit longer.

Alcohol is high in carbohydrates but will not be stored, so it is actually good for recovery after physical activity, plus an increase in blood flow will actually promote healing by promoting oxygen carried to your muscles.
Beer is very hight in carbs, and great fro carb loading which is essential when trying to increase strength.

Liver function does not play a role in recovery, liver also does not play a role in digestion. Digestion is caried out by the intestines (mainly small) and a little bit in the stomach. The liver removes toxins from your body, so unless you drink posin the night before it will not have a major effect on you.The only real issue with alcohol is the effect the next day (hang over) and that is from drinking to much and becoming dehydrated. Alcohol in moderation is actually good for you... and that is information I got from 3 years of a medical science degree, and a med degree. Not some arty farty wikipedia sorced grovel

 

[bartman]

Cynical perhaps, but compare rugby league players generally to athletes of other sports (generally) who earn a lot less but are a lot more serious about their health and fitness, eg AIS athletes, swimmers, runners, cyclists, whoever.

I think your last sentence hits the nail on the head Kiki. I adore the game, and don't want it to continue to earn the reputation it has, which has been going down hill for the past five years.

The game/NRL needs to take practical measures to turn the bad wrap is has - and keeps on getting - around, so that families and sponsors do not fear being involved in the future. The only way to do that is for players (generally) to become smarter, and not give the media anything to focus on in the way of their bad behaviour, or excessive alcohol intake leading to such.

Sure, for every one idiot player who brings the game down with his actions there are five good ones who don't, that may be the same level for society or whatever. But that doesn't change the fact there are too many idiot players who haven't learned the damage they cause the game, and whose player mates are clearly not looking out for them properly.

The players (generally) clearly need help, and it's up to the game (not the individual clubs and their self-interest) to do it through having some stricter policies on it for a period of time. Three years should do it, that way a new generation of U20s can know that rugby league isn't all about being down at the Sapphire Lounge drinking your body weight once a week, isn't about getting drunk enough to get into fights in public, and isn't about putting yourself in positions in public that lead to allegations of sexual misconduct.

*shrugs*

 

[bartman]

Bit by bit the players are coming around to this point of view...

http://www.leaguehq.com.au/news/lhqnews/chooks-home-in-on-koup/2009/04/01/1238261647073.html

Meanwhile, Parramatta captain Nathan Cayless has called for the NRL to establish a set of guidelines on player behaviour.
Punishments for off-field incidents have been under plenty of scrutiny following a rash of early season misdemeanors by players at a number of clubs.
Cayless said the NRL needed to take the lead and ensure consistency. "There needs to be some sort of guideline set out by the NRL, it's got to be balanced," he said.
"It can't be a knee-jerk reaction to something that happens, it's got to be a certain set of guidelines that are in place so that every player and every official knows what happens if they do stuff up.
"At the moment, it's just sort of all over the shop.
"It's a tough one but the boys have just got to behave and do the right thing."

...and bit by bit we the fans have to back them up, and stop looking for excuses for why these elite level players who have the privilege to represent their code at all times can't just be left to behave in public like anyone else with no responsibilities might.

 

[Kiki]

im not making excuses. i simply think that footy players should have the same rights to enjoy their lives, like everyone else.

 

[Eels Dude]

Bit by bit the players are coming around to this point of view...

http://www.leaguehq.com.au/news/lhqnews/chooks-home-in-on-koup/2009/04/01/1238261647073.html
...and bit by bit we the fans have to back them up, and stop looking for excuses for why these elite level players who have the privilege to represent their code at all times can't just be left to behave in public like anyone else with no responsibilities might.

You're missing the point of this thread and article Bartman. This isn't about excessive alcohol intake but the use of recommended intakes of alcohol. Bad player behaviour due to drunkeness is a different matter and has been covered many a time in many threads in this forum most still active. This thread should be reserved to the physical effects that alcohol has on a footballer's body and the effect it has on their game or recovery rather than off field behaviour because that is an entirely different matter.

 

[bartman]

You're missing the point of this thread and article Bartman. This isn't about excessive alcohol intake but the use of recommended intakes of alcohol.

I know the point of the article and thread. I made a comment on it, was asked a question, and answered it.

 

[bartman]

im not making excuses. i simply think that footy players should have the same rights to enjoy their lives, like everyone else.

I'm not saying that you are Kiki, I'm saying that fans in general do make excuses for almost every single instance. Rather than look at the larger problem that the instance cause the game, financially, and in potential patronage in people taking up the sport as kids.

I don't really have any moral view over whether players should or shouldn't be able to enjoy life like everyone else, merely the practical observation that they need to realise that they can't... At least not in the ways they've become accustomed to, if the game is to maintain its status and revenue and all the money for players to enjoy this lifestyle they apparently may or may not enjoy anymore.

Sorry Eels Dude, for not sticking to your view of what this thread should be exclusively reserved for, but I'm sure you'll cope ;-)

 

[Eels Dude]

Sorry Eels Dude, for not sticking to your view of what this thread should be exclusively reserved for, but I'm sure you'll cope ;-)

No worries mate I'd much rather a thread turn into an actual discussion unlike most which involve forum members just throwing meaningless insults at one another ;-)

Your points make a lot of sense but I don't think fans are defending players as such, just defending them in relation to how a normal person would be treated in the same situation. Peter Meakin was done for drink driving and evading police but he wasn't stood down or anything even though he has a more high profile job than Jake Friend.

It's up to the media mate, the media will pick up on anything negative they can because that's what makes a good story. Even if it's just a rumour they'll dig their heals in because it'll sell more advertising space if they can get the official scoop on the follow up story. I doubt players are behaving as badly as they are claimed to be, and in situations where incidents occur they are always going to be spun to make them sound worse they are simply because they sell more papers or result in more internet 'hits'.

 

[bartman]

Your points make a lot of sense but I don't think fans are defending players as such, just defending them in relation to how a normal person would be treated in the same situation. Peter Meakin was done for drink driving and evading police but he wasn't stood down or anything even though he has a more high profile job than Jake Friend.

I know, but the comparisons to "normal people" or to other public figures like Peter Meakin actually don't achieve anything... they simply create a siege mentality which allows us as fans, players, and clubs to duck the responsibility that the game faces in this day in age, and in its future survival.

It's up to the media mate, the media will pick up on anything negative they can because that's what makes a good story.

Agree, but we and the game have more change of changing player behaviour, than we do of changing the media.

16 clubs, 25 players, that's... around 400 people we're talking about. Double it if we want to inlcude the NYC guys. Compared to media empires that thrive on sensationalism no matter what the topic, rugby league, celebrities, politics, world disasters etc. Getting 800 people (contracted employees) to learn to behave differently (out of hours as well) is much more achieveable for the game than complaining about or trying to change a media it can never have any control over.

No-one's saying players can't have a drink (at least I'm not). Just that a drink doesn't have to turn to excess every single time. And that drink also has to be somewhat limited while the players are in training - some clubs are saying one day a week during the season, which I think is fair enough for elite professional athletes - given the claims of this article - earning more than the prime minister, and responsible for the future standing of their sport?

If they want to enjoy themselves like "normal people" then they have the choice to refuse the privilege and not play at NRL level.

 

[Lego_Man]

first and for-most, the idea that lactic acid is what causes pain after a arobic session was disproved by physiologist about 3 years ago. Lactic acid is removed from your blood stream in 3 seconds. To slow this process down isn't a big deal because it might now stay in your body for 20 seconds (guess?) but not doing any damage, so you will just feel the effects for a little bit longer.

Alcohol is high in carbohydrates but will not be stored, so it is actually good for recovery after physical activity, plus an increase in blood flow will actually promote healing by promoting oxygen carried to your muscles.
Beer is very hight in carbs, and great fro carb loading which is essential when trying to increase strength.

Liver function does not play a role in recovery, liver also does not play a role in digestion. Digestion is caried out by the intestines (mainly small) and a little bit in the stomach. The liver removes toxins from your body, so unless you drink posin the night before it will not have a major effect on you.The only real issue with alcohol is the effect the next day (hang over) and that is from drinking to much and becoming dehydrated. Alcohol in moderation is actually good for you... and that is information I got from 3 years of a medical science degree, and a med degree. Not some arty farty wikipedia sorced grovel

Thanks for the counterargument, interesting stuff.

 

[Bobby DIGital]

Beer is f*ckin disgusting.

 

[Garts]

It is all about worklife balance. Players need a release and they should be allowed to drink. I watch the product on offer every weekend and I do not think it is suffering due to players having a drink once per week or once per fortnight.

As for the salaries compared to the prime minister. I would have thought the average salary is less than what the PM receives, but some definately get more than him. However lets not forget the PM gets a very large pension for the rest of his life. Tbh I have no idea why you are even trying to compare the 2 Bart. They have no relevance.

 

[Parra]

bart i think thats an extremely cynical view. and a massive generalisation. you keep lumping footy players into a huge group when the fact is they are just as varied as any other group of people.

People keep saying that like it is some sort of mantra. Is it true? Why should a group of young men who earn up to 10 times the average wage be representative of wider society?

For one - they are vastly fitter than the rest of us and possess extraordinary talents both physically and mentally.

I'll put it another way - if you claim that these blokes are just as varied as any other group are you also claiming that anyone can be an NRL player? Of course not.

Are they over represented in the areas of alcohol fuelled incidents and sexual misconduct? Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. But repeating the "same as everyone" else mantra over and over doesn't make it so.

They are not representative of wider society at all - they are an elite group. I would expect the differences that make them NRL players are also reflected in other traits as well.

 

[adamkungl]

I don't buy these 'scientific studies'. It's basically a bunch of Masters students doing a bit of research and coming to a generic conclusion. If you read the newspapers every single week there's dozens of stories stating "recent studies have shown that... bla bla bla".

The amount of time, money and effort wasted trying to work out the best way for people to lose weight is highly disturbing.

I take this article with a grain of salt.

Bzzzt.
2 weeks ago, I did squats at the gym. Legs were a bit stiff the next day. Fine 2 days after.
Last week, same squats, same day. Got drunk that night. Legs were very sore for the next 4 days. Had to play touch footy and it f**ked me up big time.
This week, same squats, same day. No drinking alcohol, lots of water and good food. Recovered in 24 hours.