Charity Shield 2017

[borat]

I hope your wrong.....for mine walk away now.....look we all know it was only a trial but you can see the same old structure or lack of it.......and made worse by our halves or lack of ........on a brighter note I thought our forwards busted their arses for most of the game and we do have the pack to be a contender for the 8 this year.....sadly it must kill them after doing all the grunt to see blokes like Widdop giving cheap turnovers with a poor kicking game

This season is clearly going to be a write off. I honestly don't care if Mary goes Rd6, Rd 1 or Rd 26 so long as we have a quality replacement on board by preseason next year. That should be the priority. If he walks early and we appoint a caretaker then thats an acceptable scenario.

What would be the worst outcome is a panic appointment in response to what seems inevitably a poor start to the season.

 

[dragon-83]

Dragons should not bother fielding a team this nrl season they should just forfeit.

 

[Carlton]

Dugan
McDonald
Milne
Herbert/Garrick???
Dufty???
Mann
McCrone

Havili coming off the bench as a hooker and lock.

I know not many will agree with this but Dugan is still our best fullback, Nighty is being found out due to a lack of pace, Dufty needs to be blooded in first grade and has pace, Havili is a beast off the bench and I still don't think Aitken is a centre. Mann needs to be tried at 5/8 and Widdop has not been able to work with any halves partner. Run with a vanilla flavoured McCrone who is at least solid and allow Mann to play whats in front of him. This will never happen with Widdop there.

 

[kit66]

How sad is it that we're already talking about next year ?
A playmaker and a coach, that's all we really need, but now not next year. We want it NOW !

 

[giboz71]

There's zero variation to our attack. Our forwards get us in position inside the 20 and that's when it all goes to hell. Because that is when your spine players come to the fore and execute the right plays. Don't just blindly run a scripted move, pass or kick. Actually see what's in front of you, select the right option and use your talent to execute. We have good forwards and centres just crying out for real playmakers to use them properly.

This is why spine players get the big bucks. This is why JT, Cronk, Boyd and Maloney despite being in their 30's are the best players in the game. They play what's in front and execute.

McCrone is a waste of space so its up to Widdop and Duges who frankly just don't have the talent to play this role. Duges if he stays needs to be moved to the centres quick smart, and Widdop should be just shown the door (along with the coach of course).

 

[Carlton]

There's zero variation to our attack. Our forwards get us in position inside the 20 and that's when it all goes to hell. Because that is when your spine players come to the fore and execute the right plays. Don't just blindly run a scripted move, pass or kick. Actually see what's in front of you, select the right option and use your talent to execute. We have good forwards and centres just crying out for real playmakers to use them properly.

This is why spine players get the big bucks. This is why JT, Cronk, Boyd and Maloney despite being in their 30's are the best players in the game. They play what's in front and execute.

McCrone is a waste of space so its up to Widdop and Duges who frankly just don't have the talent to play this role. Duges if he stays needs to be moved to the centres quick smart, and Widdop should be just shown the door (along with the coach of course).

I don't believe McCrone is the answer but he is just a solid nothing spectular player, we have a gun half coming next year. What we need is a 5/8. Get rid of Widdop who has shown nothing in the 5/8 role and try what we have in house. Don't burden them with Widdop who wants to have the ball but then can't decide what to do with it. Go with a bland half who will allow the potential 5/8s to show their wares and grow some confidence by being able to take some control. 2017 is probably not going to be a year of joy so make the most of it and build for 2018.

 

[Rocket Rod]

I could do a better job than our supposed coach.
I wonder what his pay is. ?

 

[goggles]

Googles you are the one in denial. Do not tell me the coach instructs widdop to kick the way he does. He has no vision. No fluidity. No fricken idea what to do when on the attack. Why kick for another set of 6 when down by 20 with 10 to go? Always makes the wrong decision. The coach has to go, yes, but don't let our captain widdop off the hook here! He wouldn't make the starting line up of any other team in the comp let alone the captain.
If you cannot see this it is you that is in denial mate.

I've never said any of those things Crush, either to you or anyone else! On the contrary, I totally agree that Widdop is sub-par, as are Marketo, McCrone and Lafai. I'm still at a loss as to why you were so optimistic about Mary this year? Blaming Widdop isn't the answer, you could replace him with Thurston and we would fare the same. As long as Mary's the "coach", the buck stops with him. Anyways, it is going to be a very, very long winter!

 

[possm]

Before the game I truly hoped things would be different. Now I am convinced a new coach should be announced before round 1. Don't care if Mary stays for the rest of the season or not and I don't care if the Club has a coaching option for the rest of 2017 or not because this whole mess is the Board's fault and it could have all been avoided.

 

[John moz]

Waste of time 6 years of charity shield and still no win since wayne Bennett.

 

[Carlton]

I've never said any of those things Crush, either to you or anyone else! On the contrary, I totally agree that Widdop is sub-par, as are Marketo, McCrone and Lafai. I'm still at a loss as to why you were so optimistic about Mary this year? Blaming Widdop isn't the answer, you could replace him with Thurston and we would fare the same. As long as Mary's the "coach", the buck stops with him. Anyways, it is going to be a very, very long winter!

Mary's coaching is rubbish but don't let Widdop off the hook. He has been the on field problem (a playmaker and captain that cant do either role competently in my opinion). Widdop was very quick to throw Benji under the bus but he has not done any better with McCrone or Hutchison and after tonights game Field either.

Dugan, Thompson, Frizell all look brilliant when they have a good PAIR of halves feeding them. I wonder why they look like pale imitations of the players they are in rep teams when they play with the Dragons?

 

[giboz71]

I don't believe McCrone is the answer but he is just a solid nothing spectular player, we have a gun half coming next year. What we need is a 5/8. Get rid of Widdop who has shown nothing in the 5/8 role and try what we have in house. Don't burden them with Widdop who wants to have the ball but then can't decide what to do with it. Go with a bland half who will allow the potential 5/8s to show their wares and grow some confidence by being able to take some control. 2017 is probably not going to be a year of joy so make the most of it and build for 2018.

Agreed. My point is, he's not going to be a focal point of an attack.

So come play 4 or 5, the ball invariably goes to Widdop who if he doesn't slip over or throw a forward pass either puts a nothing kick in or passes it to Duges who is equally clueless with ball in hands. Either way, the play breaks down or its an easy turnover.

It's been the same for the past 3 years and I'm f**king sick of it.

 

[Old Timer]

I wrote a scathing post after last years CS and got howled down by a few posters last year for being negative and was told why get so carried away it was only a trial. By the way I was by no means the only one to suffer this.
I could almost cut and paste it this year.
If todays game plan is what is ahead we will get the spoon with ease.
A few points
1. Our defence coaches have got no idea how to set the backline as the number of overlaps the opposition get is ridiculous. So sick of seeing Nighty coming in off his wing and seeing the opposition score easy tries out wide. The basic positioning and set up is incredibly poor. Again we shifted Nighty to the LW which is exactly what we did last year and it failed miserably. Obviously our coach is worried about a small centre and a small winger side by side (Aitken and Nighty on the RHS). Well pick one and drop the other, but what do we do, we move RHS players to the left hand side which is always thwart with danger and not content to do it with just the winger then we do it with the centre. Square pegs in round holes.
2. People are going to say how great our pack is this year and how other teams will not dominate us. We had 54% of the ball today and yet the Bunnies, who many in here are saying will not be top 8 and maybe even a bottom 4 team, rolled down the field with ease just like teams did last year. The opposition get into attacking positions way too quickly and often with little stress put on them and thats why we are easy to score against.
3. Our forwards when they do make a bust very rarely have someone on their tail to support them. This is just plain poor coaching and shows a lack of positional play. At least Quinlan used to trail Merrin and how we all loved it when it came off.
4. Our coaching staff have got NFI idea where some players best positions are e.g. Simms is not a prop and is a back row impact player, Vaughan is also an impact player but some how we started these blokes in our final trial just crazy.
5. We have trouble working out which is our best combination in the centres and while we do that some people keep paying out on Dugan. For gods sake our coach is an ex international centre and yet our centres are almost as benign as our halves. It is simple if Dugan is at FB you need to have ball playing centres of which we have 2 Mann and Milne.
6. Our halves are diabolical and we don't have a specialist halves coach nor do we bring an expert in to help remedy it. We keep sticking with a failed game plan (if there is such a thing). We can't win games with the current set up or style of play and today was the day to see something new and we got last years blue print.

After all the hype about what we were going to get, if people aren't concerned after todays game then IMO you have rocks in your head.
There is absolutely no hope for us as a club unless they announce the 2018 coach before the season starts and get a recognised interim coach by round 4 regardless of the cost.

 

[Dragonslayer]

I thought last week against the WT we looked sharp, had better attacking options and generally defended pretty well. The signs were there that the season wasn't looking too bad.

One week later............................................

Looked like we entered a parallel universe. Attack showed little, defence horrible and generally same ol' same ol' of 2016.

What changed in one week................................Gareth Widdop!!!!!

If McGregor really, truly want s to be a coach then it's time for him to make the tough decisions and not rely on the "reputations" of some. He promised he would pick a team based on trial form. To be true to his word then:
1. Widdop has to play Cutters
2. Lafai is a shadow of 2014 and should never be selected in first grade again this season
3. McCrone is not the halves answer
4. Havili should be on the bench
5. Dugan to play fullback
6. Aitken is not a centre and should be in the Cutters learning to play as a forward
7. Nighty is a shadow of his former self
8. The forward pack looks good and should be first penciled in with only Havili as the add on.

Anyway we all know McGregor won't change, he doesn't know how to. He will pick the same players each week hoping and praying they produce something, where, in some presser he can say how good he is.

I suppose 1 positive from todays game is that we are one step closer to having him removed.

 

[Dragsters]

There's zero variation to our attack. Our forwards get us in position inside the 20 and that's when it all goes to hell. Because that is when your spine players come to the fore and execute the right plays. Don't just blindly run a scripted move, pass or kick. Actually see what's in front of you, select the right option and use your talent to execute. We have good forwards and centres just crying out for real playmakers to use them properly.

This is why spine players get the big bucks. This is why JT, Cronk, Boyd and Maloney despite being in their 30's are the best players in the game. They play what's in front and execute.

McCrone is a waste of space so its up to Widdop and Duges who frankly just don't have the talent to play this role. Duges if he stays needs to be moved to the centres quick smart, and Widdop should be just shown the door (along with the coach of course).

If Mary thinks that sort of gameplan is gonna "allow them to play what's in front of them" then watching that match back in the review sessions must surely make him gerry to what everyone else can see?

Then again, maybe not.

 

[Carlton]

Agreed. My point is, he's not going to be a focal point of an attack.

So come play 4 or 5, the ball invariably goes to Widdop who if he doesn't slip over or throw a forward pass either puts a nothing kick in or passes it to Duges who is equally clueless with ball in hands. Either way, the play breaks down or its an easy turnover.

It's been the same for the past 3 years and I'm f**king sick of it.

You're spot on but my argument with Dugan is he is being used incorrectly by his 5/8. He is a power runner and needs to be used like that. Widdop (our 5/8) needs to be able to use that but he has no idea, Duges needs a bit of space, give him the ball early and he is dangerous. Big strong difficult to tackle, why the hell wouldn't you be trying to use this?

 

[FlameThrower]

I agree with every previous comment. If Widdop is not given notice then the coach needs to go for not making the tough but obvious decision to sack him. Everything breaks down when widdop gets the ball. He is the biggest problem with the attack. Send him tothe cutters or back to England

Was listening to triple M, on way home after the game Girdler smashed the halves as he said the game broke down and no creativity from halves. McCrone and Widdop are not the answer.

 

[giboz71]

You're spot on but my argument with Dugan is he is being used incorrectly by his 5/8. He is a power runner and needs to be used like that. Widdop (our 5/8) needs to be able to use that but he has no idea, Duges needs a bit of space, give him the ball early and he is dangerous. Big strong difficult to tackle, why the hell wouldn't you be trying to use this?

Absolutely. Duges is like a button. Good playmakers know when and where to press it. This is why NSW and the Kangaroos use him at centre. Running off Cronk in the 4 nations he was devastating.

But in our dogshit attack, we'd be better served with a 2nd 5/8 like Boyd or Moylan to make up for Widdop being so hopeless.

Again its the combinations that are all wrong, and something we need to get right before Hunt comes.

 

[Dragsters]

I wrote a scathing post after last years CS and got howled down by a few posters last year for being negative and was told why get so carried away it was only a trial. By the way I was by no means the only one to suffer this.
I could almost cut and paste it this year.
If todays game plan is what is ahead we will get the spoon with ease.
A few points
1. Our defence coaches have got no idea how to set the backline as the number of overlaps the opposition get is ridiculous. So sick of seeing Nighty coming in off his wing and seeing the opposition score easy tries out wide. The basic positioning and set up is incredibly poor. Again we shifted Nighty to the LW which is exactly what we did last year and it failed miserably. Obviously our coach is worried about a small centre and a small winger side by side (Aitken and Nighty on the RHS). Well pick one and drop the other, but what do we do, we move RHS players to the left hand side which is always thwart with danger and not content to do it with just the winger then we do it with the centre. Square pegs in round holes.
2. People are going to say how great our pack is this year and how other teams will not dominate us. We had 54% of the ball today and yet the Bunnies, who many in here are saying will not be top 8 and maybe even a bottom 4 team, rolled down the field with ease just like teams did last year. The opposition get into attacking positions way too quickly and often with little stress put on them and thats why we are easy to score against.
3. Our forwards when they do make a bust very rarely have someone on their tail to support them. This is just plain poor coaching and shows a lack of positional play. At least Quinlan used to trail Merrin and how we all loved it when it came off.
4. Our coaching staff have got NFI idea where some players best positions are e.g. Simms is not a prop and is a back row impact player, Vaughan is also an impact player but some how we started these blokes in our final trial just crazy.
5. We have trouble working out which is our best combination in the centres and while we do that some people keep paying out on Dugan. For gods sake our coach is an ex international centre and yet our centres are almost as benign as our halves. It is simple if Dugan is at FB you need to have ball playing centres of which we have 2 Mann and Milne.
6. Our halves are diabolical and we don't have a specialist halves coach nor do we bring an expert in to help remedy it. We keep sticking with a failed game plan (if there is such a thing). We can't win games with the current set up or style of play and today was the day to see something new and we got last years blue print.

After all the hype about what we were going to get, if people aren't concerned after todays game then IMO you have rocks in your head.
There is absolutely no hope for us as a club unless they announce the 2018 coach before the season starts and get a recognised interim coach by round 4 regardless of the cost.

This is the most disappointing aspect for mine.

 

[Carlton]

Absolutely. Duges is like a button. Good playmakers know when and where to press it. This is why NSW and the Kangaroos use him at centre. Running off Cronk in the 4 nations he was devastating.

But in our dogshit attack, we'd be better served with a 2nd 5/8 like Boyd or Moylan to make up for Widdop being so hopeless.

Again its the combinations that are all wrong, and something we need to get right before Hunt comes.

That's exactly my thinking, we have Hunt coming next year. Use this year to work out who it is who is going to be his partner. Widdop should not be resigned, so remove him from the equation and lets see what we have. If we find we don't have the answer in house at least we have time to look around. From what I have seen of Field I think he is a really exciting prospect but he is not ready for first grade especially if we have Widdop taking charge of all the play. Field and Mann both need to have the mandate to take control as a first grader and be confident to call and get the ball when they want it.