Confirmed Signings

[Tiger5150]

"It's just he preferred going back to the Raiders rather than the other options available to the Dogs. "
LOL! Oh honey...
They had no other options because this is not the NFL or the NBA where the dogs can just trade him to another team without his consent. I guarantee you he didn't a damn cent on the table from that Dogs deal and no way in hell the Raiders, who wouldn't give him more than 500k 12 months ago, would take him now at the sticker price of 600-650k coming off the worst year of his career.
He's not at the Tigers because Cotric decided he didnt want to play there. The tigers could have offered the best deal in the world and the Dogs cant do shit unless he agrees... So no, dogs options were:
a) deal him to canberra on terms they agree to
b) keep him

There is of course another (and more likely) option....that Canberra offered more $$$ than the Tigers and therefore Dogs had to chip in less to make it work.

 

[nick87]

Paying overs for players to improve the team is one thing, bad teams do that, small markets like mine have to do it more than most, it's not paying overs that got me giggling but as i tried telling you idiots 12 months ago, shelling out a reported 650k deal for a WINGER when his best offer on the table was 500k when you didnt have anyone competent to play fullback, 5/8th, halfback or hooker was one of worst roster construction ideas i've ever encountered.

Even if Nic Cotric was worth 650k and he wasnt, there is ZERO chance that your club could have seen anything close to that level of value back from him given the massive issues with the rest of the squad. It's akin to buying the fancy gutters for the house when you havent even laid the foundations! It was a terrible idea at the time, almost everyone saw it, except deluded bulldogs fans who tried to convince themselves it was a great signing... now 12 months later here we are. It was doomed from the outset and anyone with half a brain cell knew it and said it at the time

And even now, there is deluded fans like Dogs of War who actually think Nic Cotric walked away from the richest deal he'll ever sign and the dogs are off scot free! OH MERCY! STOP IT! IT'S STARTING TO HURT!

 

[nick87]

There is of course another (and more likely) option....that Canberra offered more $$$ than the Tigers and therefore Dogs had to chip in less to make it work.

But why would Canberra have to offer more money? What leverage did the Dogs have to make that happen?
Again, the dogs cant just send him to a club he doesn't agree to go to. The tigers could have offered to take the entire contract scot free and if Cotric says "No, i dont want to play for the tigers" that's the end of that.

This is seemingly what people are not understanding, this is not the NFL or NBA. The clubs cant just do as they please. The bulldogs clearly needed to get rid of Cotric to create some room for other moves, once that happens the power is entirely within Cotric's hands. The Raiders know he wants to come home, they know the bulldogs HAVE to move him to get another things going on their rebuild, so why would canberra come in over the top on the tigers? They dont have to beat the tigers offer at all.

The dogs could theoretically say "Well we've got a better offer from the tigers, so you either accept a move to the tigers, get the raiders to up offer or we'll keep you"... to which i imagine Cotric's management and raiders would die of laughter knowing that threat is worthless and the dogs have no intention on keeping him

 

[dogslife]

It's all well and good to say why waste top dollar on a winger or a prop when you should be looking for a hooker or halves, but that's only half the equation. At the end of the day, clubs have to spend at least 95% of their salary cap, and whether it's on outside backs or in the halves will depend on the market and whether or not your club is attractive to free agents, those hookers and halves also need to want to come and play for you. I may have mentioned this, we haven't exactly been an attractive option for good players in recent years. Also, you're as deluded as the posters you claim to be deluded if you think there is no knock on effect from having your Cotric's or your JAC'S in attracting other players. Do you think we could have landed someone like Matt Burton if we offered him a bit more cash but told to him make do with Jayden Okunbur and Tui Katoa?

 

[Tiger5150]

But why would Canberra have to offer more money? What leverage did the Dogs have to make that happen?
Again, the dogs cant just send him to a club he doesn't agree to go to. The tigers could have offered to take the entire contract scot free and if Cotric says "No, i dont want to play for the tigers" that's the end of that.

This is seemingly what people are not understanding, this is not the NFL or NBA. The clubs cant just do as they please. The bulldogs clearly needed to get rid of Cotric to create some room for other moves, once that happens the power is entirely within Cotric's hands. The Raiders know he wants to come home, they know the bulldogs HAVE to move him to get another things going on their rebuild, so why would canberra come in over the top on the tigers? They dont have to beat the tigers offer at all.

The dogs could theoretically say "Well we've got a better offer from the tigers, so you either accept a move to the tigers, get the raiders to up offer or we'll keep you"... to which i imagine Cotric's management and raiders would die of laughter knowing that threat is worthless and the dogs have no intention on keeping him

Not how it works. Lets assume Cotric was om $650 at Dogs.

Dogs say to Cotric, "if you find a deal we will let you go and we are willing to chip in a max $150Kpa". Dogs dont care (or as you correctly say, have no input into) where he goes.

Tigers say we will pay you $400K pa. Canberra says we will pay you $500K pa. He goes to Canberra. I obviously dont know the actual figures, my point is that Dogs would have no input other than the max that they are going to chip in, after which whichever club pays the most is where he goes unless Nic cops a pay cut.

 

[nick87]

It's all well and good to say why waste top dollar on a winger or a prop when you should be looking for a hooker or halves, but that's only half the equation. At the end of the day, clubs have to spend at least 95% of their salary cap, and whether it's on outside backs or in the halves will depend on the market and whether or not your club is attractive to free agents, those hookers and halves also need to want to come and play for you. I may have mentioned this, we haven't exactly been an attractive option for good players in recent years. You're as deluded as the posters you claim to be deluded if you think there is no knock on effect from having your Cotric's or your JAC'S in attracting other players.

So i guess all these players are going to jump ship now the great attractive Nic Cotric has left?
Come on now. These players are going there for money and/or opportunity. Nic Cotric being at the bulldogs doesnt impact these decisions. And if he does, bad job letting him walk!

 

[nick87]

Not how it works. Lets assume Cotric was om $650 at Dogs.

Dogs say to Cotric, "if you find a deal we will let you go and we are willing to chip in a max $150Kpa". Dogs dont care (or as you correctly say, have no input into) where he goes.

Tigers say we will pay you $400K pa. Canberra says we will pay you $500K pa. He goes to Canberra. I obviously dont know the actual figures, my point is that Dogs would have no input other than the max that they are going to chip in, after which whichever club pays the most is where he goes unless Nic cops a pay cut.

There is no pay cut in this for Cotric. His 650k deal for the next two years is LOCKED in. You've got rocks in your head if you think he's leaving a cent of that deal on the table.
His 650k is getting paid by someone. He and agent dont care how that's split up between the two clubs. That's cap business, but his 650k is locked in.

So now it's tigers or the raiders. But even if the Tigers were offering 500k vs 400k (and yes we're just making the figures up here), if Nic Cotric doesnt want to play there, they're out. It's over. The dogs can't do a deal with them. The Tigers could offer 500k, or 600k or even 650k... it doesnt matter. If Cotric doesnt agree to the move, it's can't get done and media reports suggest he made it clear he didn't want to play for the tigers. So if that's correct, the tigers are simply not even a part of the equation anymore. They're a non factor.

When Cotric says he wants to go back to the Raiders, the bulldogs are in a VERY TOUGH spot because they are negotiating from a supremely weak position of ONLY being able to negotiate with Canberra.
So now it's between the Raiders and the Dogs to come up with a deal on who's paying what. And the Dogs can say they'll only pay 150k pa max, but everyone, including the Raiders know, they have other deals contingent on moving Cotric on. And they're paying him right now, the longer the negotiations go on, the more the dogs lose and maybe other deals fall through? Point is the only recourse the dogs have is to threaten to keep Cotric under his current contract at the bulldogs... which is as weak a threat as you could offer given how public they've been about wanting to move him on. No one would believe them if they said they'd just keep him.

It maybe that the raiders were happy with 150k or less! Or more? That we don't know that, though i suspect it will leak in the coming days. What we do know is Nic Cotric is getting paid his money and the power virtually rests solely with him to decide where he wants to play, and thus who the bulldogs can do a deal with.

 

[Dogs Of War]

Don't worry Nick. Phil Rothfield will make a figure that you can parrot around as proof soon. But you forget the Dogs could have just kept him as well. That's the difference. Dogs still needed class players, and he would have undoubtedly been good for the Bulldogs next year if he had stayed. A lot more to this story that just how you feel about it.

 

[McNulty]

"It's just he preferred going back to the Raiders rather than the other options available to the Dogs. "
LOL! Oh honey...
They had no other options because this is not the NFL or the NBA where the dogs can just trade him to another team without his consent. I guarantee you he didn't a damn cent on the table from that Dogs deal and no way in hell the Raiders, who wouldn't give him more than 500k 12 months ago, would take him now at the sticker price of 600-650k coming off the worst year of his career.
He's not at the Tigers because Cotric decided he didnt want to play there. The tigers could have offered the best deal in the world and the Dogs cant do shit unless he agrees... So no, dogs options were:
a) deal him to canberra on terms they agree to
b) keep him

Don't be stupid all your life mate, the dogs made a very bad deal and they'll be paying for it over the next 2 years.



I never even mentioned how much freight you guys are paying, nor have i said anything about the Raiders finishing top 4. All i've done is laugh at your stupid idiotic club for not being able to figure out what idiots on an internet forum like me (and many others) did at the time they signed this deal

FWIW - i expect the dogs are paying somewhere between 150k-200k in freight, media reports said they were happy to pay 150k, i'd wager the Raiders squeezed a little more juice from that orange but probably not that much more, and the Raiders will likely finish outside the top 8 this season.

Less than. Nowhere near 200k.

 

[nick87]

Don't worry Nick. Phil Rothfield will make a figure that you can parrot around as proof soon. But you forget the Dogs could have just kept him as well. That's the difference. Dogs still needed class players, and he would have undoubtedly been good for the Bulldogs next year if he had stayed. A lot more to this story that just how you feel about it.

They definitely could have kept him, im not forgetting that at all, as stated previous that was the one and only card they had to play. Unfortunately for them they've spent 5 months shopping the guy and have made it clear he's gotta go, so i dont think anyone would believe them if they said they were willing to keep him

 

[YoungPanther]

They definitely could have kept him, im not forgetting that at all, as stated previous that was the one and only card they had to play. Unfortunately for them they've spent 5 months shopping the guy and have made it clear he's gotta go, so i dont think anyone would believe them if they said they were willing to keep him

I really am not getting this, as it seems quite simple, as explained by Nick.
The Dogs now have $500k (as a guess) which they could put towards getting a certain Eel (that they do need) for next year instead of 2023. Both teams are happy. Raiders only pay what they wanted to pay last year and Dogs may get a player that touches the ball a few more times than a winger.

 

[Billythekid]

I know this isn't really the thread for this discussion but I think good wingers are vastly underrated in terms of their impact on the game. I also don't really like trying to turn good wingers into fullbacks. There are far more good fullbacks in the game than good wingers.

 

[Munky]

I know this isn't really the thread for this discussion but I think good wingers are vastly underrated in terms of their impact on the game. I also don't really like trying to turn good wingers into fullbacks. There are far more good fullbacks in the game than good wingers.

Agree, the last few years (in no ranking order):

1) JAC
2) To'o
3) Tupou
4) B Moz
5) AJ

Have all been truly elite and add so much to their sides. To'o and Tupou for their yards out of their own half and unique finishing (one steamrolls close to the line, the other the high kick).

JAC, AJ and Morris for being elite wingers who always make the right decision when there's an opportunity and being all around excellent footy brains. Morris and AJ failed as fullbacks yet remained awesome wingers.

Four out of the five above were in the past four premiership teams with AJ being pretty close.

 

[McNulty]

I really am not getting this, as it seems quite simple, as explained by Nick.
The Dogs now have $500k (as a guess) which they could put towards getting a certain Eel (that they do need) for next year instead of 2023. Both teams are happy. Raiders only pay what they wanted to pay last year and Dogs may get a player that touches the ball a few more times than a winger.

Dogs also free up cash from the coronavirus guy… what’s his name? How much would he be on? 150-250? If a certain hooker becomes available we now have the cap space, possibly

 

[nick87]

Dogs also free up cash from the coronavirus guy… what’s his name? How much would he be on? 150-250? If a certain hooker becomes available we now have the cap space, possibly

Its actually not a bad move by the dogs, they had to get off this contract, it was ridiculous. And if it frees up 400-500k to go and get the hooker you do that every day of the week. This move isnt bad. The error was making the signing to begin with, which as said, anyone with a brain cell said at the time was a bad move.
Gus knew it too which is why about 3 seconds after he got the job rumours emerged that Cotric was on the outter.

I know this isn't really the thread for this discussion but I think good wingers are vastly underrated in terms of their impact on the game. I also don't really like trying to turn good wingers into fullbacks. There are far more good fullbacks in the game than good wingers.

Good wingers are worth having, they do a lot for your footy team
What To'o did for the panthers, all that early dirty grunt work, that's super valuable... but they're also one of the most replacable positions in the league, junior footy is filled with really big, strong, fast athletes who can be good wingers if the team around them is good... clubs can find wingers on an open market if they need too, and they're not all as good as To'o, but they'll get the dirty work done and it's a super cost effecient position.

 

[shear_joy9]

I know this isn't really the thread for this discussion but I think good wingers are vastly underrated in terms of their impact on the game. I also don't really like trying to turn good wingers into fullbacks. There are far more good fullbacks in the game than good wingers.

it's more the wingers and their managers that want to be fullbacks for the extra $
There is no team in the league that would play someone like JAC anywhere except wing

 

[gerg]

Thankfully for the doggies they have a Supercoach to really get the best out of these great players that have joined the club.

 

[Captain Apollo]

Junior Paulo Extends till 2026

The Parramatta Eels Club are happy to announce that we have re-signed front-row forward Junior Paulo on a four-year contract extension until the end of the 2026 season.

www.parraeels.com.au

 

[Chief_Chujo]

Dreaming if you think the dogs aren't putting in at least 150k pa. 500k was a our limit when he left and the cap has lowered since then due to covid. 200k pa is probably closer to the mark.

 

[MugaB]

Its actually not a bad move by the dogs, they had to get off this contract, it was ridiculous. And if it frees up 400-500k to go and get the hooker you do that every day of the week. This move isnt bad. The error was making the signing to begin with, which as said, anyone with a brain cell said at the time was a bad move.
Gus knew it too which is why about 3 seconds after he got the job rumours emerged that Cotric was on the outter.



Good wingers are worth having, they do a lot for your footy team
What To'o did for the panthers, all that early dirty grunt work, that's super valuable... but they're also one of the most replacable positions in the league, junior footy is filled with really big, strong, fast athletes who can be good wingers if the team around them is good... clubs can find wingers on an open market if they need too, and they're not all as good as To'o, but they'll get the dirty work done and it's a super cost effecient position.

You'd be surprised, but all the movements at the better clubs are the ones that move on expensive 2nd rowers, or Centres, these two positions are becoming more and more interchangeable in regards to squads, if your a fan of a team who's just paid overs for a marquee "centre" good luck, coz that player needs to do more than just be a centre, gotya be able to fill in at 5/8th, F/B, H/B, wing etc, Manu and Crichton are good examples, BJ leilua was the opposite