What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Deja vue- Benji Bashing vs Benji Sceptics

madunit

Super Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,358
These are refreshing words to read.

Remains to be seen whether Potter will succeed as a first grade coach, but he has shown some fantastic qualities this week.

This is the exact attitude and leadership that is required from any first grade coach. It is long overdue and great to see. Kudos to him for having the balls to do it. I hope Marshall will respond.

Give Benji's performances this year are essentially his response to losing the test captaincy, do you hold out much hope for a dramatic improvement in form from him?

I'm not too confident.
 

dumpy

Juniors
Messages
154
I recall last year that the tigers played the panthers on Sunday afternoon and Benji lobbed in late at the recovery session. The senior members fined Benji for this late attendance. The next game Benji "played" by passing the ball on having no involvement whatsoever. At half time when Sheens was addressing the team, Benji was sitting back picking his boots appearing completely disinterested. It will be interesting to see if Benji ceases the opportunity this time and gets involved or sooks it out. Incidentally, the previous game was also against the Rabbits which we got a touch up.
 

Magpie Tragic

Juniors
Messages
384
Give Benji's performances this year are essentially his response to losing the test captaincy, do you hold out much hope for a dramatic improvement in form from him?

I'm not too confident.


Testing time for Benji I reckon, he either sooks it or we see the biggest comeback of all time, hopefully it's the latter.....I'm 100% behind Potter in benching him, just not sure about his replacement in Fulton, been there done that and it flopped....would have preferred another 'experiment' with a young bloke, that would have been more threatening to Benji, but I guess it is Souffs & not the time to blood youngsters
 

gronkathon

First Grade
Messages
9,266
With the talent coming through never have we been in a better position to move him on if his attitude and performances still stink after this wake up call.

We have a truly amazing amount of potential and talent in the ranks right now and if it is genuine rebuilding the fans and sponsors should be better prepared to accept it
 

BrotherJim05

Bench
Messages
3,463
I really really hope he proves everyone wrong and causes an upset for Bunnies.

As to Tiger05 point, the only real 1/2 he has worked well off lately was Robert Lui, who imo took on the line like a beast. We need another half like this imo. Or Benji should just stick to his running game and give kicking and play making duties to the 1/2
 

hybrid_tiger

Coach
Messages
11,684
Give Benji's performances this year are essentially his response to losing the test captaincy, do you hold out much hope for a dramatic improvement in form from him?

I'm not too confident.

I'm not confident either, but the ball is in his court. We will see his response tomorrow night.
 

moller

Juniors
Messages
498
With the talent coming through never have we been in a better position to move him on if his attitude and performances still stink after this wake up call.

We have a truly amazing amount of potential and talent in the ranks right now and if it is genuine rebuilding the fans and sponsors should be better prepared to accept it

It's gotta be genuine rebuilding or bust.
13 of this week's 18 man squad have played u20s with the Tigers, or come through the ranks otherwise.
Let the kids play. The likes of Utai shouldn't play 1st grade again whilst Nofo and Koro are fit.
 
Messages
3,320
Interesting times ahead for the WT,Benji was known to sulk for days any time Sheens questioned his performance.Potter should just stick firm with discipline and play no favourites unlike Sheens.
 

super_coach

First Grade
Messages
5,061
We on the forum have been crying out for years, for a coach to demand a certain level and when a player is not achieving this, their are consequences, and more importantly the same rules apply to everyone.

I hope Potter is allowed to continue this approach and is not forced to take another direction because of outside interference. As I have always said,the biggest marketing tool for any club is a winning football team, Benji's high profile will evaporate in a flash if we are on the bottom for a couple of years.People love winners
 

Ronnie Dobbs

Coach
Messages
17,582
Benji & Sowie should get an apartment together and cuddle each other as they sulk themselves to sleep every night.

Poor Benj - Beaus gone. Motlz is injured and thats got to be heartbreaking for Benj & now Shines is gone, he's getting a dose of reality for the first time in his life.
 

R2Coupe

Juniors
Messages
1,520
Any fair-minded person would keep in mind that Potter is still making a team with the ingredients that Sheens left him.
Also, you really need to give him a degree of time to make his mark.

Seeing that you seem keen to assess mediocrity . . . . How about you measure Benji's and Potter's performances since Potter took over ? ( the only time they have "performed" side by side )
Keeping in mind that one is amongst the highest paid footballers in the country, and the other is a stop-gap nondescript coach.
Which one has drastically under-performed ? . . . . ( has more than 3 letters and ends in i )

Benji has done for more for the WTs than Potter. It could be said Potter has failed as a coach to get the best out of Marshall. We'll wait and see although my initial trepidation still exists.

He's a Sheens fanboy - always pushing the same agenda.

No doubt I am a Sheens' fan. He understood Benji ball and didn't try to restrict it. He unleashed it! It reflected in sales of jerseys, supporters gear and especially in the number of games Ch 9 gave the Tigers. The viewing audience admired the way we use to play. Where has it gone?
 

R2Coupe

Juniors
Messages
1,520
Furthermore, everyone gave Sheens 2 years without much criticism when he first started.

Yet for some reason Potter doesn't deserve that same treatment.

That's true but the team Sheens' inherited (and the Club) was far worse than that which Potter was given. More to the point, Potter has walked into a Club with tremendous junior depth which didn't happen by accident.
 
Last edited:

R2Coupe

Juniors
Messages
1,520
Yet you did not ask these same questions about Sheens, that is what I don't get.


True, but I admired Sheens not only for what he did as an NRL coach but also his knowledge of the juniors. For example, when Luke Brooks broke his leg the first time Sheens made sure he was looked after by the Club.

Hoffman was the only significant junior we lost which happened in the transition period of him taking over and we know now how the Storm were able to make the large offer (around $80,000 for a player who hadn't played first grade).
 

hybrid_tiger

Coach
Messages
11,684
Benji has done for more for the WTs than Potter.

Of course he has. Marshall has been here for 10 years and Potter for five minutes.

It could be said Potter has failed as a coach to get the best out of Marshall.

Impossible to determine given he's only been here for a quarter of a season.

My belief is that Marshall has not improved as a player for five years and alot of that comes down to Sheens breeding an acceptance of mediocrity.

Under a coach like Bellamy or Bennett, I doubt we would see Marshall make the same mistakes week in week out as he did six or seven years ago.

No doubt I am a Sheens' fan. He understood Benji ball and didn't try to restrict it. He unleashed it! It reflected in sales of jerseys, supporters gear and especially in the number of games Ch 9 gave the Tigers. The viewing audience admired the way we use to play. Where has it gone?

"Benji-ball" worked for four months in 2005, that was the whole problem. The game has changed immensely since then and Sheens never moved on.

We have not been attractive to watch since 2011, our attack was awful last season and that was when Sheens was in charge.

You know what is attractive? Winning. Channel 9 will give us games and the club will sell jerseys if we win, not if we play "Benji-ball".

True, but I admired Sheens not only for what he did as an NRL coach but also his knowledge of the juniors. For example, when Luke Brooks broke his leg the first time Sheens made sure he was looked after by the Club.

Hoffman was the only significant junior we lost which happened in the transition period of him taking over and we know now how the Storm were able to make the large offer (around $80,000 for a player who hadn't played first grade).

Sheens did lots of good things for the club. He also did many poor things, especially towards the end of his tenure, which you refuse to acknowledge.
 

Tiger05

First Grade
Messages
9,869
I really really hope he proves everyone wrong and causes an upset for Bunnies.

As to Tiger05 point, the only real 1/2 he has worked well off lately was Robert Lui, who imo took on the line like a beast. We need another half like this imo. Or Benji should just stick to his running game and give kicking and play making duties to the 1/2

I'd love to see Benji fire tonight.

I think Benji has to be a general play maker. He just has to get his game together and do everything well. I think we predominately need another half who can run the footy and help out with passing, kicking etc. Lui did that well. Maybe Sironen can be that player but he has to be able to pass the ball as well and I'm not sure if Siro is that player.

I wish Lui was still here - he could run the footy, had a nice pass on him and could kick the ball as well. His only problem was defense. Miller I think ran it once in all his chances but when he did he looked good. Sirro hasn't done enough but maybe he deserves some more chances but I'm starting to think he isn't the best option either.
 

Tigers Tale

Juniors
Messages
1,417
I'd love to see Benji fire tonight.

I think Benji has to be a general play maker. He just has to get his game together and do everything well. I think we predominately need another half who can run the footy and help out with passing, kicking etc.

This is where I think Benji has gone wrong. He has tried to become a play maker but he doesn't have a football brain like those of Cronk, Thurston, Lockyer or Johns. He has strayed away from those freakish things he could do, whether by design or through instruction from Sheens.

I believe we can not survive without a play making half. If Benji is to remain in the team he must stop trying to get his hands on the ball all the time and let the play making half determine the plays...Benji must be a running 5/8.

I have said this before, you need a Sterling/Kenny type arrangement. Remember when Sterling was put out of the game with his shoulder, Kenny played on but in my opinion he was never as damaging a runner as he was when he had a smart half to set him up. Kenny tried to be a play maker but it wasn't his natural game and he didn't succeed doing it.

Marshall needs to run the ball, we don't need a running half, we need a play making half in my opinion.
 
Messages
3,310
Like him or not, think he is doing it for the benefit of Parra or not, I for one like what Stuart has said in his column today.

BEFORE last year's first round my column was about Benji Marshall. I know it's no business of mine now, but I wrote it in a year when I wasn't involved in the NRL.

Anyway, now is probably the right time to bring it to closure.

I wrote that his time had come. That 2012 was the year that he had to make good on all that potential he possessed - to take his place among the great five-eighths in the game, and join the likes of Lockyer, Fittler and Daley, he needed to go to the next level and take the Tigers with him.

He was the right age, and talking to his coach at the time, Tim Sheens, it was clear I wasn't the only one who thought so.

The Tigers were considered to have the best roster in the NRL at the time. Looking back now, and their 10th-placed finish, we can see they failed.

I also believe Benji failed to deliver.



For years now, the Tigers have been his team and they have played accordingly; at times brilliant, but at times too inconsistent.


As that fell away more this year, new coach Mick Potter took the ultimate action last week when he put Benji in the No. 14 jumper and brought him off the bench.

Now we get the chance to find out the real Benji.

The Tigers are in a tough position.

The new salary cap has activated a clause in his contract allowing him to renegotiate his contract, which calls for a substantial upgrade and, according to all reports, he is also looking for a two-year extension to the end of 2017.

At 29, that's some risk for a player like Marshall. It would have been less of a risk if he had stepped up like I'd hoped last year and become more of a game manager, as Lockyer, Fittler and Daley all became as age slowed them a little, rather than a player who relied simply on his brilliance.

The Tigers have some terrific young halves coming through in Curtis Sironen, Luke Brooks and Mitchell Moses.

Such succession plans are what every club strives to implement; have a quality set of youngsters ready to mature when the seasoned campaigners are ready to retire. Sironen is already playing regular first grade (and will end up in the back row) and the other two are coming through and will be ready soon.

About the only thing you can be sure of is they won't be prepared to wait another four years for Benji to see out his deal.

With his contract there for renegotiation, the Tigers have to make a decision whether Benji is capable of becoming that game manager. Or whether they cut ties and invest in that future.

Now, I'll make it clear here. Because every player off-contract is linked to Parramatta, this isn't about any agenda or ploy to get Benji to the Eels. We have our own plans for the future.

But Benji has to make a decision - and that is whether he wants to stay there another four years with so much rebuilding to be done at the club.

Players are remembered for how they end their careers, not how they start them, and it's a fair argument that at this point in his career, with the skills he brings, Benji might have more success at another club where he could complement the roster already in place rather than having to carry them on his back, like he will have to do at the Tigers.

That might sound a bit tough on the Tigers, but it's a decision that has to be made quickly.

In many ways, it appears the toughest, but the smartest call.

But I believe Benji can't go.

He owes the Wests Tigers.

They have invested so much in him over the years that he needs to spend the rest of his time giving the club back as much as he can. For a start, if the club can manage to find a way to accommodate Benji and those young halves coming through all in the same side, they would benefit significantly.

The thing about young halves is it's important to have experienced players around them. I was very fortunate that I had experienced players around me when I came into first grade, teammates like Chris O'Sullivan, Dean Lance and Gary Coyne. Guys, positionally, who were close to me on the field. Older heads create a calm head for a player starting his career.

It's always important to know, as a club, that your best products are coming through with your senior, experienced players around them.

I could see in difficult circumstances on Friday night for the Souths game that there was a different desire and energy in Benji's efforts.

That's good for those kids to see.

Handled correctly, Benji can turn it around and make good on what I wanted to see from him last season.

And I hope it works, I truly do, as the game is better having him in his best form.

The time has come for him to cut back on his extra activities, like his television appearances and some of his sponsor commitments, and refocus on what enabled those extra incomes to fall his way.

He needs to re-dedicate himself to his football, because the football came first, and needs to stay first.

It's the only way these stories end happily.
 
Messages
3,310
Like him or not, he has achieved more than any of his commenting on this forum, unless some are former Australian captains, coaches and premiership winning coaches :lol: but Futon had something interesting to say yesterday.

BOB Fulton has described the decision to bench Wests Tigers superstar Benji Marshall as "incredibly stupid" and questioned coach Mick Potter's attitude toward the embattled five-eighth.

Speaking on 2GB yesterday, Fulton said Marshall could not improve from the interchange bench and questioned why Potter had not done more to help him.

"I've heard the decision by Mick Potter (to bench Marshall) described in many ways," Fulton fired.

"A line in the sand, brave, incredible. I would say incredibly stupid," Fulton said.

"It's the responsibility of the coach to get the best out of his players both individually and collectively. So if (Potter) determined Benji was out of form a number of weeks ago, help him. That's the key to coaching

"How can he get any better on the bench? He can't. So help the kid."

Fulton said Marshall was struggling because the Tigers pack was continually being dominated.

"Then you look at the other side, at (John) Sutton who struggled for many, many years," Fulton said.

"And all of sudden, what have they put together there? Probably the best forward pack in the competition.

"I can't believe so many commentators and ex-players in the media, some of them jump on the back of it and say 'oh that line in the sand, it had to be done'. That's just crap.

"Benji needs help. The coach has gotta help him."
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...all-to-the-bench/story-fni3gpz1-1226645936431

I have heard that there is another side to the dumping to the bench and it's more to do with Benji's recovery and what he hasn't done correctly by the club and for the club. Potter had no choice. It comes back to ego and now he has been given the kick in the arse he deserved.

Fulton and many other people do not get the true story, then again, maybe I have been told some crap.
 

Ron's_Mate

Bench
Messages
4,133
Bob Fulton is a dribbling idiot - the only proof needed for that is the years he has spent crapping on with Hadley & co on the weekends. Ricky Stuart tells it like it is.
 
Top