News Do you care if Israel Folau returns to the NRL?

[Twizzle]

It's not about what fans are saying.

At the end of the day the NRL have allowed the likes of Lodge, Packer, Tetevano etc. to be registered so I don't really see what justification there is to not register Folau who hasn't broken any laws.

well personally, I wouldn't have any of them either but the NRL seem to be way too forgiving for mine

it really doesn't set a very good example for people with family values

 

[Timmah]

How so?

If an employer sacked someone for being atheist, that would be every bit as discriminatory as sacking someone because they are gay.

The other two, depends on if they effect your work or not.

The point is, based on his criteria, the bloke believes 95% of people are going to hell. Who cares?

I think you've crossed wires here, we're not judging whether the things he called out are reasons to employ people or not, we're judging whether he is employable or not based on how discriminatory what he said was.

His judgment on gay people was absolutely discriminatory under the sex discrimination act. Atheism yes that would fall under several acts as well. Drunks and liars - nope.

I imagine atheists give far less of a shit of what religious people think because by definition they are not religious and therefore don't engage in that space. And atheism, for the most part, wouldn't strike at the core of who they are. Much different for LGBTIQ who have faced lifelong discrimination.

 

[Exsilium]

well personally, I wouldn't have any of them either but the NRL seem to be way too forgiving for mine

it really doesn't set a very good example for people with family values

They do love a rehabilitation story.

 

[Timmah]

Talking about hate speech while doing it. Great stuff.

Can you explain how labelling someone a right wing religious nut is hate speech?

The definition of hate speech is "public speech that expresses hate or encourages violence towards a person or group based on something such as race, religion, sex, or sexual orientation".

Calling someone a right wing religious nut is not hateful not encouraging violence. Suggesting someone going to hell for who they are - is.

 

[chrisD]

He should play and the NRL should simply state something like his personal views are not those of the NRL's, we have asked him to consider the offence publicly airing his views may have on the vulnerable but will not enforce any special code of conduct. And that should be it.

The situation we are headed towards in this country is one where expressing religious views on homosexuality is protected by legislation when the right is in power and then criminalised when the left is in, and it's painfully juvenile. The attempts to drag suicide rates and historic religious persecution into things is especially cringe worthy.

 

[The_Frog]

Can you explain how labelling someone a right wing religious nut is hate speech?

Well, its derogatory isn't it? A slur. Seems demeaning of religion is open slather these days which seems to be the point you are making. The pendulum has swung too far, but it will swing back. What rules apply to gays/blacks/women should also apply to religion. It is only right. This is why the Liberal government is contemplating legislation in this regard, and the criticism they are receiving over it only demonstrates that it is needed.

 

[Valheru]

well personally, I wouldn't have any of them either but the NRL seem to be way too forgiving for mine

it really doesn't set a very good example for people with family values

Exactly.

If they refused to register the contract of those players then they would have a much stronger case IMO.

 

[Foreign Legion]

I've heard St george is singing a major sponsor with a dating app... once they get Izzy.

 

[Timmah]

Well, its derogatory isn't it? A slur. Seems demeaning of religion is open slather these days which seems to be the point you are making. The pendulum has swung too far, but it will swing back. What rules apply to gays/blacks/women should also apply to religion. It is only right. This is why the Liberal government is contemplating legislation in this regard, and the criticism they are receiving over it only demonstrates that it is needed.

I think you're failing to understand the difference between derogatory comments & slurs as opposed to the term 'hate speech'. Vilifying people because of sexuality is hate speech. Calling someone a religious right wing nutter not so much.

 

[Timmah]

Exactly.

If they refused to register the contract of those players then they would have a much stronger case IMO.

Still trying to understand the logic.

Because they were weak as f**k before on certain issues, they should be weak now?

Why not draw a line as they did with de Belin, for example, and say, 'nope, we're not putting up with this shit'?

 

[Valheru]

Still trying to understand the logic.

Because they were weak as f**k before on certain issues, they should be weak now?

Why not draw a line as they did with de Belin, for example, and say, 'nope, we're not putting up with this shit'?

Because they can't take the moral high ground against a bloke who hasn't broken any laws when people who have committed major crimes are active players.

The NRL would say those players have done their time. Well Folau was punished for those comments by his employer of the day so what is the difference?

 

[lynx000]

They do have a right to not employ anyone they choose if they feel they are contrary to the culture of the workplace. The problem here is that the dragons want to employ him and the NRL being a third party are potentially blocking someone from acquiring gainful employment.

Can you spot the rather large flaw in this contention?

 

[Timmah]

Dragons face whopping fee to buy Israel Folau

Israel Folau's return to the NRL has moved a significant step closer with his French club Catalans declaring they are prepared to release the controversial star - for a price.

Folau is still contracted to Catalans for next season and would not be allowed to join St George Illawarra without a release.

But Catalans boss Bernard Guasch has declared his club will release Folau if the Dragons gave his club a tidy sum for their troubles.

"We are not going to break the contract of Israel Folau without compensation," Guasch said in a clear message to the Dragons.

It is believed the Catalans club will allow Folau to return to Sydney for around $200,000.

Now the Dragons have to decide whether it is worth paying that amount - on top of Folau's hefty wage demands.

But there is another hurdle - the NRL is yet to give the Dragons the green light in the wake of Folau's homophobic rants that ended his association with Rugby Australia.

I ran a poll on Twitter over the past 24 hours and over 5000 fans voted - with around 65 per cent saying they did not want to see Folau back in the NRL.

https://wwos.nine.com.au/nrl/the-mo...el-folau/59db5bf5-bc61-4def-9cb4-b2c29bc67b29

 

[Timmah]

Because they can't take the moral high ground against a bloke who hasn't broken any laws when people who have committed major crimes are active players.

The NRL would say those players have done their time. Well Folau was punished for those comments by his employer of the day so what is the difference?

The majority of decisions on players who've had various indiscretions - criminal or otherwise - in recent years were made by prior administrations. Why couldn't this administration put their foot down and say no?

 

[Miller was a legend]

Because they can't take the moral high ground against a bloke who hasn't broken any laws when people who have committed major crimes are active players.

The NRL would say those players have done their time. Well Folau was punished for those comments by his employer of the day so what is the difference?

Not having a shot at you Val, but they can do what ever they like and always have.

be it unreasonable or unfair in some eyes, none the less, it’s how it is

 

[The_Frog]

I think you're failing to understand the difference between derogatory comments & slurs as opposed to the term 'hate speech'. Vilifying people because of sexuality is hate speech. Calling someone a religious right wing nutter not so much.

One's just as bad as the other. You might think making offensive slurs is fine but that reflects on you.

 

[The_Frog]

Still trying to understand the logic.

Because they were weak as f**k before on certain issues, they should be weak now?

Why not draw a line as they did with de Belin, for example, and say, 'nope, we're not putting up with this shit'?

Because posting scripture isn't in the same category as rape, even rape that is alleged. The former isn't even breaking the law.

 

[BunniesMan]

I don't agree with his views but if you give violent convicted criminals a second chance there is no possible justification for what amounts to a life ban for someone who has not done anything as bad.

 

[The_Frog]

Not having a shot at you Val, but they can do what ever they like and always have.

They know he is likely to mount a court case if he is refused, so they'll be taking legal advice. They'll say no to him if they can get away with it.

 

[Chimp]

I really don’t see how the NRL can block his signing - he won his legal case against Rugby, where he had an actual contract, because what he did was not deemed gross misconduct. And ultimately, the clubs are the employer.
The NRL can’t just cherry pick who they want in the NRL where no crime has been committed.
I totally understand why they don’t want him, but I think legally they were reliant on no clubs putting in a request to sign him - once a club tries to register his contract, as unsavoury as it is, I don’t think the NRL have much choice.
This decision is on St George, and in my opinion shows how desperate they are, and how low they value their own values, culture and public perception.
You can’t just block Folau, as that would go against the very rules against discrimination that you’re trying to defend. What can happen is everyone can have an opinion on Folau and his views, the NRL can publicly state their own views on that, they can publicly state how disappointed they are in St George and their values, sponsors can share their views or back away from any organisation aligning with Folau (this is where the NRL can save themselves by publicly shaming St George), fans can show their thoughts on the signing by voicing their views and opinions, and can ultimately vote with their feet by not attending games where he plays, not buying St George merchandise. That’s where the power really is.
Sadly though, despite all of the hysteria, if he’s signed, once the season starts, people will just go about their business and it will become a minor point throughout the year.