Does Brad Arthur deserve the hype?

[Poupou Escobar]

Id say the pass thrown by Peats was a result of our halves not wanting to take control in the opposition red zone.

If you look at our structure the halves aren't there to 'take control' in the red zone. They both stand wide (where there is room to use their running game) with a 'middle half' standing at first receiver on the open side. This was Peats in that particular play, and he threw the pass because the Titans were moving up very quickly and he didn't want to take the tackle.

If it had been Sandow or Norman at first receiver instead then they would have had to take the tackle. That would mean the following play-the-ball was slower (because they don't win the wrestle as well as a forward) and he would be unavailable on the next play. Our halves only go to first receiver on the short side or on the last tackle. It's a smart structure, especially for our halves. Will it change when Foran comes to the club? It might, but I doubt it. Arthur is signing players that suit his structure.

 

[Gazzamatta]

If you look at our structure the halves aren't there to 'take control' in the red zone. They both stand wide (where there is room to use their running game) with a 'middle half' standing at first receiver on the open side. This was Peats in that particular play, and he threw the pass because the Titans were moving up very quickly and he didn't want to take the tackle.

If it had been Sandow or Norman at first receiver instead then they would have had to take the tackle. That would mean the following play-the-ball was slower (because they don't win the wrestle as well as a forward) and he would be unavailable on the next play. Our halves only go to first receiver on the short side or on the last tackle. It's a smart structure, especially for our halves. Will it change when Foran comes to the club? It might, but I doubt it. Arthur is signing players that suit his structure.

Possibly so but is it working?
It appears not.

 

[Noise]

Id say the pass thrown by Peats was a result of our halves not wanting to take control in the opposition red zone. Am very much looking forward to having a half that takes responsibility.
Watching the Dragons last night I was so impressed the way they worked to get back into the defensive line once they had made a tackle. Generally tacklers 2 and 3 remain in place until tackler one has gotten to his feet and sprinted back into the line. Rarely were the dragons caught out at the play the ball with either a player left laying on the ground or poor positioning by the markers. Simple stuff but goodness they do it well. They peal out of the tackle with such control. Interesting how this can be coached into a team as quickly as it has.
This is opposed to Parras method which nearly always has tackle one left on the ground (Paulo) and markers not set for the next play. Why is this so? (To coin a well used phrase)

I think it is due to our inability to wrestle effectively. We can't get the attacker on their back so we have no time for the other tacklers to retreat into marker or the defensive line.

 

[Kornstar]

I think it is due to our inability to wrestle effectively. We can't get the attacker on their back so we have no time for the other tacklers to retreat into marker or the defensive line.

The real question is that they do all that gym work but have no strength, why is that? We always look weak when running or tackling.

Has been that way for over a decade now!

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Possibly so but is it working?
It appears not.

I think it works just fine - the only time we've struggled to score points this year was against the Tigers. On those occasions where it doesn't work is it the fault of the structure or something else?

 

[Noise]

The real question is that they do all that gym work but have no strength, why is that? We always look weak when running or tackling.

Has been that way for over a decade now!

I can't understand it either. Is it a strength and conditioning issue or have we had a bad run of wrsetling coaches? Either way it needs to be fixed because as you said we have been the worst at it for a decade.

 

[Kornstar]

I can't understand it either. Is it a strength and conditioning issue or have we had a bad run of wrsetling coaches? Either way it needs to be fixed because as you said we have been the worst at it for a decade.

The worst part is that i just watched the SG Ball final and we looked the same in that grade. Our under 20's are ordinary and so is Wenty.

 

[EelsFan05]

Pou has nailed it above - I sit next to (and am mates) with a bloke that played Reserve Grade for Nths and Manly in the 80's and we are forever discussing the fact that Parra seem to panic whenever they make a break regardless of the tackle. It's like "oh shit, I made 30 metres we better score of this play" so we then see stupid kicks, hail mary passes or just under 8's mistakes and turn the ball over.

Maybe that's what BA means when he talks about our shit completion rates.

It happened twice last week and it frustrates the daylights out of me. Take the tackle, get up a play the f**ken ball quickly and there will be a good chance of scoring off the next play.

 

[Chipmunk]

I think you're missing the point regarding Parraball. Or you're failing to see the distinction. Structuring your attack where most of the players play their roll, with only key decision makers 'playing what they see' is not the same as structuring your attack so that every merkin on the team has that freedom.

My point is that having poor decision makers, like Sandow and Paulo, as your key decision makers, is conducive to the Parraball theory.

 

[Chipmunk]

If you look at our structure the halves aren't there to 'take control' in the red zone. They both stand wide (where there is room to use their running game) with a 'middle half' standing at first receiver on the open side. This was Peats in that particular play, and he threw the pass because the Titans were moving up very quickly and he didn't want to take the tackle.

If it had been Sandow or Norman at first receiver instead then they would have had to take the tackle. That would mean the following play-the-ball was slower (because they don't win the wrestle as well as a forward) and he would be unavailable on the next play. Our halves only go to first receiver on the short side or on the last tackle. It's a smart structure, especially for our halves. Will it change when Foran comes to the club? It might, but I doubt it. Arthur is signing players that suit his structure.

We are the worst attacking team inside the oppositions 20 in the competition. It was remarkably quite strong in the first two matches, with Semi and Taka in the team (having said that it was predominantly strong against Manly - so who knows how that form really racks up), but since they have been out, what we're trying to do inside this area clearly isn't working, it's hardly worked since we stopped The Plane being the main ball player inside the opposition 20. It's not working so whatever we're trying to do needs to be changed.

Our open side structure, all over the field, is a complete and utter abomination! To use the word disgraceful would be to give it a compliment... Again, whatever we're trying to do in this area is not working and needs to be changed

Out short side raids, on both sides, is excellent, more so on the left though. I would almost go as far to say that our left side short side raids are the most dangerous in the competition and should only get better when Taka and Semi return. We need to work more on getting these short side plays on more often. It appears to be the only way we're going to score any tries.

 

[Gazzamatta]

I think it works just fine - the only time we've struggled to score points this year was against the Tigers. On those occasions where it doesn't work is it the fault of the structure or something else?

Well I guess thats for our Coach to work out and repair.

 

[Bigfella]

Foran will help massively in that department.

 

[lingard]

The issue coming out of our half is largely due to our weak outside backs.

The most frustrating thing I continually see on this forward is "don't pay money for wingers" and "they are only wingers".

We have a weak fullback, and with semi out, hopeless wingers and we have very poor quality centres even without injuries.

But those players are absolutely crucial to starting your sets off and then allowing your forwards to get over the advantage line.

Our recruitment people have never made it a priority at all.

We continue promote or extend very average wingers and centres.

With Hayne gone, the problem is even more glaring.

Yep. I've been calling for a top quality centre for over five years. With Hayne at the back, the problem was obscured a bit. I agree that Toupou would be a terrific signing. If we then shifted Hoppa to the centres (he's a good centre) and bought a good to very good fullback (or Norman) we'd suddenly have a team to be reckoned with.

1. Norman
2. Toupou
3. Hopoate
4. Takairangi
5. Radradra
6. Foran
7. Sandow
8. Mannah
9. Peats
10. Wicks
11. Mau
12. Beau Scott
13. Edwards
14. Gower
15. Watmough
16. Lussick
17. Some other merkin

I'd back that team for a top eight spot. (Although I'm not sold on Norman as a fullback yet - nor am I sold on Sandow.)

 

[lingard]

On second thoughts, Norman at fullback and coming in to play a five-eight role when we've got the ball, with Sandow dropping back and playing more like a roaming fullback in attack - might work pretty well.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

My point is that having poor decision makers, like Sandow and Paulo, as your key decision makers, is conducive to the Parraball theory.

I'm sure that's part of it. But those poor decision makers have strengths of their own, which is why they are in first grade. Neither of them has a heavy decision making burden in our structure. In fact nobody does. None of our players has a responsibility he can't handle.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

We are the worst attacking team inside the oppositions 20 in the competition. It was remarkably quite strong in the first two matches, with Semi and Taka in the team (having said that it was predominantly strong against Manly - so who knows how that form really racks up), but since they have been out, what we're trying to do inside this area clearly isn't working, it's hardly worked since we stopped The Plane being the main ball player inside the opposition 20. It's not working so whatever we're trying to do needs to be changed.

Our open side structure, all over the field, is a complete and utter abomination! To use the word disgraceful would be to give it a compliment... Again, whatever we're trying to do in this area is not working and needs to be changed

Out short side raids, on both sides, is excellent, more so on the left though. I would almost go as far to say that our left side short side raids are the most dangerous in the competition and should only get better when Taka and Semi return. We need to work more on getting these short side plays on more often. It appears to be the only way we're going to score any tries.

You keep going on about our inability to shift the ball to the long side, but it received specific praise from the commentators during the Souths game.

We have plenty of ability to spread the ball. The problem is we're a bit of a one trick pony in that regard, and in the past two weeks teams have been ready for it. So we need to do some things to slow them down - an early kick behind or turning it back inside. But we don't really have the players for that (fast chasers and huge forwards).

 

[Chipmunk]

You keep going on about our inability to shift the ball to the long side, but it received specific praise from the commentators during the Souths game.

We have plenty of ability to spread the ball. The problem is we're a bit of a one trick pony in that regard, and in the past two weeks teams have been ready for it. So we need to do some things to slow them down - an early kick behind or turning it back inside. But we don't really have the players for that (fast chasers and huge forwards).

I was referring more to the long side plays in the last two weeks, before that they were OK. I suspect the loss of Semi and Taka has contributed to this on the left though. We've struggled on long side plays from left to right though for a while.

As you say, we need to come up with something else.

 

[Chipmunk]

I'm sure that's part of it. But those poor decision makers have strengths of their own, which is why they are in first grade. Neither of them has a heavy decision making burden in our structure. In fact nobody does. None of our players has a responsibility he can't handle.

It appears that we don't have a central on-field decision maker and for mine this also contributes to the "Parraball theory".

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Well it's possible but I can't see how.

 

[lingard]

Well it's possible but I can't see how.

If you can't see how it's possible, you shouldn't agree that it's possible. You should argue against it - preferably using stats to back up your argument. What's up with you? Did you have a good sleep last night or something?