England admit: We're sick of Australian World Cup referees

[El Diablo]

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/sport/nrl/story/0,26746,24631582-5003409,00.html

England admit: We're sick of Australian World Cup referees

By Jim Morton | November 10, 2008 11:00pm

ENGLAND are pushing for a northern hemisphere referee to control their Rugby League World Cup semi-final against New Zealand on Saturday night.

Fed up with playing under Australian whistle-blowers in their three pool matches, coach Tony Smith today appealed for anyone but a southern hemisphere official to control their sudden-death encounter at Suncorp Stadium.

Smith's plea comes as the English are seething over leading NRL referee Tony Archer's handling of their 36-24 pool loss to the Kiwis in Newcastle.

The coach took issue with three NZ tries Archer awarded plus a controversial penalty which saw the Kiwis grab a 26-24 lead with 10 minutes left.

NZ interchange player Isaac Luke, who kicked the penalty goal, was virtually accused of cheating by English players for taking a "dive" after coming into contact with Kevin Sinfield.

"We (conceded) three tries that we don't think should have been awarded tries and have actually been told that two of them, if they would have been referred to and looked at properly by the video ref, wouldn't have been given," Smith said.

"And even the two points was incredible really.

"Kevin Sinfield brushes a fly off somebody and he falls over. If that's where we've got to in this game we're in trouble.

"We've had three Australian referees in this competition so far and I think we've probably struggled in each of them.

Asked whether he had a preference for certain referee on Saturday night, Smith said: "Anybody but."

Mick Stone, the chairman of the World Cup appointments board, will decide the semi-final referees as early as tomorrow.

Smith, like Kiwis counterpart Stephen Kearney - who questioned Archer's handling of the ruck - said he would seek to meet with Stone.

"I've got a lot of areas to talk about, not just the ruck area," Smith said. "We're not happy (with) what we saw there on the weekend."

The tournament is being controlled by seven referees, including three from Australia, two from England and one each from France and NZ.

Archer and Shayne Hayne, in charge of England's opening 32-22 win over Papua New Guinea, have consistently controlled the biggest matches along with Englishman Ashley Klein who handled the Kangaroos first-up thumping of the Kiwis.

"What I would say is I would like a northern hemisphere referee, we haven't had one yet," said Australian-born Smith.

"The Australians have had an Australian referee, I don't see why we can't have a referee from the northern hemisphere.

"We would just like an even keel."

England's players said Luke "should be playing soccer" after his second-half dive.

"It's a bit of a joke - great acting from him," Sinfield told the English press.

"He certainly played for it - I think he'd have got an Oscar. It did hurt us but we can't blame the defeat on that."

Smith, who rested four of his regular players on the weekend, hinted star winger Abe Gardner would return to mark NZ's four-try hero Manu Vatuvei.

 

[miguel de cervantes]

This is good. England now have a chance.

 

[bulos01]

aussie refs are crap. they are attention seeking wankers

 

[ParraEelsNRL]

Maybe the people who run RL should put more money into Refs from other countries so we don't have to put up with this type of thing.

French and other European refs in the SL and NZ with other Pac nations in the NRL, surely there are some younger refs from NZ, PNG, France and Wales who have the potenial to step up?

If the game is played in a specific country, they'd have refs.

 

[marv]

Football (Soccer) is played in almost every country in the world, they manage to play to, pretty much, the same set of rules world wide, how hard would it be to do the same with a game that is only played professionally in Four countries, FFS I cant belive we are even having this discussion.

 

[nadera78]

The RFL brought Thierry alibert over from France for a couple of months to referee in Super League and (mainly) National League matches. He did all right although was a bit hot and cold at times. I know the NRL offered a Kiwi ref (Glenn Black) a chance to go over to Australia but as he pointed out it would have meant him being there for a few months, unpaid, while his wife and family were still in Christchurch.

IIRC the 1995 RLWC had a ref from PNG so we have actually gone backwards in this regard. Like, why did Alibert ref the France/Samoa game? How difficult is it to give that game to Leon Williamson and give Alibert Fiji/Ireland?

And Smith's right, if we have non-Aussie refs in Australia for this comp why are Australia still playing with local referees?

 

[Fairleigh Good!]

Australia have made it clear they won't play England with anything other than an Australian referee, so I don't see a problem England insisting on the same.

The interpretations from Archer are all sucked from the snail paced NRL and it makes for dull, boring games. His general decision making is also absolutely horrendous too.

Lets not beat around the bush, Australia would win anyway, but at least we'd have a game. NZ will probably destroy England this weekend anyway.

 

[VonVolks]

Klein was actually OK in the Ireland match today....

 

[shane1970]

"We've had three Australian referees in this competition so far and I think we've probably struggled in each of them.
.
Oh so that's been the problem of the Poms - the referee - Not the FACT that they suck in attack - nearly got tossed by a minnow team, then get their asses flogged by the favourites and then leak 28 unanswered points and blow a considerable lead against another team that had been struggling a little.
.
Not the fact that they suck in defence as well. Hurry up and go home you whingeing reserve graders.

 

[gatesheadthunder]

Anyone who thinks we got smashed by the aussies and tossed away the game against the kiwis because of the refs is kidding themselves. Dreadfull defence, poor kicking game and stupid knock-on's and stupid penalties, not to mention a lack of heart and fight are much bigger problems.

 

[RL1908]

Football (Soccer) is played in almost every country in the world, they manage to play to, pretty much, the same set of rules world wide, how hard would it be to do the same with a game that is only played professionally in Four countries, FFS I cant belive we are even having this discussion.

1. Soccer has a set of playing laws that are relatively simple, and don't have many grey areas that can be manipulated and/or require a referee's interpretation.

2. Soccer has many more professional competitions and players.

3. RL only has two truly pro competitions, and the current playing laws suit the advantages that can be gained by the fully trained athletes from the NRL.

RL's problem is that the game's laws are driven by the NRL game - changes made to the playing laws to address & suit issues in the fulltime pro NRL get enforiced upon all semi-pro and amateur levels of RL across the globe.

This ideal that we should have a common set of rules from the NRL to everywhere else is killing RL internationally, in the bush, in the park, and everywhere else.

We should have one set of RL laws for all of the game EXCEPT for the NRL and the Super League. These two pro comps should be able to make changes to suit their pro comps needs, (and recognise the fulltime trained athletic game that they play) without damaging the rest of the RL world.

 

[RL1908]

Whilever the rest of RL world is forced to play RL under rules/interpretations suited to the NRL, anyone waiting for the rest of RL world to catch up to the "NRL Kangaroos" is going to be waiting a very, very long time. There is no NRL equivalent comp out there for the players to come from.

The only time the Kangaroos will ever be challenged is by the "NRL Kiwis" if they get enough of their NRL players on the field, or very occassionally the Lions will jag a win.

RL's international laws should be reviewed and tweaked in a way that it reduces the advantages of being a fulltime trained "NRL ruck-wrestling and 2-man plays athlete" and begin to favour natural football skills.

The alternative is that the Kangaroos will continue to flog everyone else, and many will continue to walk away from the international game and/or ridicule it.

 

[screeny]

I hate Klown but he reffed almost perfectly today. He allowed perfect latitude at the ruck.

 

[kiwileaguefan]

Man England moan about everything....now they are moaning about the Haka...first sign of a team that is struggling is when they start blaming the referee...

Our boys just got together in making sure they were all motivated just like the opposition were motivated in going through their traditions. I think our traditions should be respected as well."

- Smith

Didnt see them do this last year when they were winning?? So how is it a tradition for England??

Smith is just a bit*h...

I didnt see Smith moaning about the Australian referee last year when Tonny Archer refereed the Test Seris between GB and NZ...

 

[Pierced Soul]

I didnt see Smith moaning about the Australian referee last year when Tonny Archer refereed the Test Seris between GB and NZ...

most refs i see suck, but it only becomes an issue when your team loses...

given englands crappy performances it's easier to blame the refs. in fairness to england i dont see why they havent had a northern hemisphere ref do one of their games....

 

[LordLeague]

If I was a Pom, I'd be a little peeved too, especially with regard to the Isaac Luke dive. Luke was 3 metres in front of the kicker and a relieving penalty to England should have resulted. Worst decision this year. Surely one of three officials saw that Luke was offside.

Ironically, if Luke had caught the ball and dived over under the posts, the video ref would have ruled an England Penalty.

Good thing the game was a dead rubber.

I hope that's the last major refereeing blunder of the cup.

Lord League

 

[ozbash]

Smith, who rested four of his regular players on the weekend, hinted star winger Abe Gardner would return to mark NZ's four-try hero Manu Vatuvei

the ref ? The French guy has been nothing short of brilliant, he'll do..

 

[JW]

If these blokes had shown some fight, then perhaps this issue in their instance could have a whole lot more merit. But that is far, far from the case. The Poms have put in 3 of the worst performances by an allegedly 'competitive' international team in recent memory, yet all the talk is about refereeing.

Only Pommies could overlook the systemic problems that have contributed to their overall shyteness and turn a 50 point drubbing and a monumental choke into a refereeing debate. RL Fans is hilarious at the moment, with shouts of "theft" and "20 point advantages". For the love of God!

Denial has kept Pomgolia in the pits for 30 years and, by the looks of it, 30 more to come.

 

[adamkungl]

Are they for real? The refs fault that they can't tackle? The refs fault that their entire gameplan falls to bits if the markers are set? ffs...
Ok, deep down somewhere their whinging has some merit, in that RL should be played internationally with the same rules, the NRL should not be allowed by the RLIF to make changes every season as it suits Ricky Stuart and co. It should be a middle ground between the touch footy of the ESL and the ruck dominance of the NRL. But coming from a team that got walloped for the last few weeks, it sounds pathetic. And they'd still get slaughtered anyway. They have NOTHING

 

[Glen from the Mount]

I would prefer an Aussie ref for the NZ V Eng semi final this weekend but if not, then the French ref will do.

No way would I be happy with an English ref. This is a semi final and we must have a neutral ref and the best neutral ref is Archer.