Expansion voting.

[BDGS]

Ok Morgan Freeman, continue to drive Miss Daisy.

There are plenty of regional areas without NRL teams, do they deserve one just because they don't have one? Is it insulting them to tell them support an NRL team because they don't have one in their area? Why not put a side in Wagga, Tamworth or Dubbo then?

Wagga and Dubbo don't have a population of 300 thousand people.

CC would quickly home to their own side. They are a very close nit community like Newcastle. A side there would be an instant success like the Titans.

Zigwaa - This.

Eels Dude - Thanks for answering for me.

 

[kia ora storm]

Perth and Wellington for me...

 

[flamin]

Sparing a current Sydney club folding it should be South/West Brisbane Jets and Perth Reds.

Then whichever of Jets/Bears misses out should be given Auto entry in 2017-8 and re-open bidding for the other spot. Hopefully a Wellington and/or Christchurch team will be bidding by then.

Sharks to Adelaide, Manly to Sunny Coast or CQ and Darwin and PNG to QLD Cup with links to NRL sides then we're set for a long time.

Yes yes yes.

 

[Ray Parlour]

-Central Coast Team added
-2nd Brisbane team added
-Perth team added
-Cronulla kicked out from the competition

 

[caylo]

I think the Reds and a second brissy team are the most viable atm.

I would like to see a CC team because outside of Newcastle they dont have a team in the area and most people from the Gosford area hate Newcastle. There would be an immediate local derby/rivalry to bring the crowds aswell.

SA and a Pasific Island team would be something to look forward to producing. Why restrict ourselves to NZ. A country like Fiji would be awesome to bring into the NRL.

 

[PaulyTom]

I really don't think the NRL will allow 2 teams to enter in the same year. I think we will find that one will enter in 2013 and the 2nd team enter in 2014 or 2015.

Baby steps not giant leaps.

 

[Jason Maher]

I don't like the Central Queensland idea at all. We already have one very disbursed population base for a team in the Cowboys, and Central Queensland would be even worse in this regard. The Cowboys work because Townsville is big enough (180,000) to act as a base for the team. The biggest centres Central Queensland would have to pick from would be Mackay and Rockhampton, both around 80,000. They are separated by about the same distance as Townsville and Cairns, two much bigger cities.

Extra teams in Queensland will have to be based in the South East. The Sunshine Coast (310,000), and the Toowoomba-Ipswich-Logan corridor (600-odd thousand combined) are the only two areas with a big enough population base outside of Brisbane itself.

For the record, the population of the Sutherland shire is 210,000 and the combined population of the Manly and Warringah council areas is about 180,000. Some other Sydney teams (council area populations, realising that some teams draw from surrounding areas): Canterbury-Bankstown (Bankstown, Canterbury): 330,000; St. George (Rockdale, Kogarah, Hurstville): 240,000 (530,000 when combined with the Illawarra); Souths (Marrickville, Botany Bay): 120,000; Roosters (Randwick, Waverly, Woollahra, City): 430,000; Balmain (Leichhardt, Ashfield, Canada Bay, Burwood): 205,000; Wests (Camden, Liverpool, Campbelltown): 390,000 (combined Wests Tigers: 595,000); Parramatta (Parramatta, Holroyd, Fairfield): 460,000; Penrith: 185,000. Not included were Strathfield (35,000) and Aubrun (75,000) council areas, which would either be Parramatta or Canterbury territory (if someone could clue me in?), and Blacktown (300,000), which would be split between Penrith and Parramatta I imagine, and if it isn't, it should be (no wonder the AFL have targetted the area as a base).

Easy to see why Souths pinched Randwick from the Roosters, why the Roosters decided to claim the City, why Wests moved from Ashfield to Lidcombe and ultimately Campbelltown, why Balmain were in trouble (I've included Wests original district in the Balmain total), and why Newtown folded.

For mine, the areas where ultimately we should see teams based are:

- Central Coast
- Perth
- Toowoomba-Ipswich-Logan
- Sunshine Coast
- Wellington
- Christchurch
- Adelaide
- possibly another team in Brisbane City

Central Queensland for mine would only be viable if one of the coastal cities experiences a massive boom. The tyranny of distance will be too much otherwise.

I think ultimately we can sustain a 20-team competition. To achieve that and cover all the abses mentioned will require either more mergers in Sydney, or (preferably) the relocation of Sydney teams with the full, long-term support of the league.

 

[PaulyTom]

The 2nd NZ team will not happen in the 2013 applications. No one has even submitted interest for a possible Christchurch or Wellington franchise.

I'm all for it but I think you will find it will be the next expansion plans maybe in 2018.

 

[BDGS]

I don't like the Central Queensland idea at all. We already have one very disbursed population base for a team in the Cowboys, and Central Queensland would be even worse in this regard. The Cowboys work because Townsville is big enough (180,000) to act as a base for the team. The biggest centres Central Queensland would have to pick from would be Mackay and Rockhampton, both around 80,000. They are separated by about the same distance as Townsville and Cairns, two much bigger cities.

Extra teams in Queensland will have to be based in the South East. The Sunshine Coast (310,000), and the Toowoomba-Ipswich-Logan corridor (600-odd thousand combined) are the only two areas with a big enough population base outside of Brisbane itself.

For the record, the population of the Sutherland shire is 210,000 and the combined population of the Manly and Warringah council areas is about 180,000.

For mine, the areas where ultimately we should see teams based are:

- Central Coast
- Perth
- Toowoomba-Ipswich-Logan
- Sunshine Coast
- Wellington
- Christchurch
- Adelaide
- possibly another team in Brisbane City

Central Queensland for mine would only be viable if one of the coastal cities experiences a massive boom. The tyranny of distance will be too much otherwise.

I think ultimately we can sustain a 20-team competition. To achieve that and cover all the abses mentioned will require either more mergers in Sydney, or (preferably) the relocation of Sydney teams with the full, long-term support of the league.

Agreed and in that order also.

 

[mattyf]

WA and CC

 

[Jason Maher]

One final population fact: in addition to the 300,000 on the Central Coast, the Bears would be tapping into the currently unrepresented northern Sydney region, increasing their effective population base (Manly were idiots not to try claiming the area directly west of their base when the Bears folded, assumiong anyone in the region would have welcomed the bastards). I realise the region is full of rugger buggers, but there'd be enough league fans to put the Central Coast Bears in the same ball park as the Gold Coast (council area 515,000, though if you add in the northern NSW areas claimed by the Tits, you'd be around the 700,000 mark).

 

[Eels Dude]

One final population fact: in addition to the 300,000 on the Central Coast, the Bears would be tapping into the currently unrepresented northern Sydney region, increasing their effective population base (Manly were idiots not to try claiming the area directly west of their base when the Bears folded, assumiong anyone in the region would have welcomed the bastards). I realise the region is full of rugger buggers, but there'd be enough league fans to put the Central Coast Bears in the same ball park as the Gold Coast (council area 515,000, though if you add in the northern NSW areas claimed by the Tits, you'd be around the 700,000 mark).

That's right. I know a fair few Bears fans who cannot wait to support a Central Coast Bears side. All the die hard Norths fans will support them no doubt. The Central Coast Bears had nearly 5000 paying members this season, not bad for a club that's not in existance yet.

 

[BDGS]

That's right. I know a fair few Bears fans who cannot wait to support a Central Coast Bears side. All the die hard Norths fans will support them no doubt. The Central Coast Bears had nearly 5000 paying members this season, not bad for a club that's not in existance yet.

Correct, last year i told a mate (former Norths fan) that the Central Coast Bears may be put into the competition in 2013 and then told him to remember where he heard it first. Since Norths left the comp he hasn't supported the NRL much. Watches a few of the bigger clashes but is a huge AFL and Union fan. But the moment i mentioned the Bears on the coast he was instantly a supporter again. His eye lighted up and etc, didn't need any convincing. Although he did comment that 2013 was pretty far away. lol

 

[Jason Maher]

To expand on my earlier post, it seems to me the clubs which are squeezed in terms of their population base are Souths, Cronulla, and Manly. There really is only room for one of Souths or the Roosters in the inner city/eastern suburbs area. Cronulla are hemmed in by St. George and Illawarra. Manly could theoretically expand west and north, but I would hazard a guess that neither North Sydney or the Central Coast would want them, and they themselves probably wouldn't be interested in looking outside their own insular little hamlet. If the Bears get the gig though, Manly suddenly find themselves in the same basket as Cronulla.

These three clubs, and arguably the Roosters to, do not have the population base to sustain themselves. Souths have a massive fan base, but a very small part of it would actually exist in their geographical base, suggesting they wouldn't lose too much by moving (other than their own stupid pride). They could still claim the South Sydney junior base if they moved (hey, they could even be nice and give Randwick back to the Roosters ), in the same way that Melbourne did with the Central Coast and Brisbane Norths. Personally I think playing out of Homebush is a tacit admission that they cannot sustain themselves long term out of their traditional base, but I'm not holding my breath for the penny to drop for the stubborn pricks.

The Roosters are in a similar boat, except for the fact they have a lot of money. Souths do too, until such point as Rusty gets jack of it, or loses his movie star profile and can't afford to use them as his plaything anymore.

Cronulla are up sh*t creek without a paddle, there is no two ways about it. The sooner the NRL taps them on the shoulder, suggesting a move elsewhere, with a promise of long term support if they do, the better for everyone.

Manly are not quite in as big a pile of sh*t as Cronulla, but they will be once the Bears get in. I'd also be tapping them on the shoulder and offering long term support to move elsewhere.

The other team that should probably be mentioned is Penrith. They have a fairly small population base. What they need to do is take advanatage of their mega-rich leagues club and start staking claims to surrounding areas, which are growing rapidly. Blacktown is the obvious piece of unclaimed turf, but I'd also be looking South (plenty of development happening and planned in the corridor between Penrith and Campbelltown, which is currently largely unpopulated), and West into the Blue Mountains. Forget about being the team from the foot of the mountains. Lay claim to being the team for the mountains.

 

[BDGS]

I disagree about manly, they'll find another area to put funds into, get juniors from and help with player development. Actually, they already have. Manly seem to be checking out the sunshine coast with positive results. The area is accepting and Manly were going to put their juniors on the line for the sunshine coast. Apparently Manly is still involved with the sunshine coast, they are just unable to send players there now.

Hopefully in a few years, the sunshine coast will be Manly's area and hopefully they'll play a few games up there each years (4-6). That way they won't end up like the sharks.

 

[CC_Roosters]

WA and Central coast for me

 

[bobmar28]

Wagga and Dubbo don't have a population of 300 thousand people.

CC would quickly home to their own side. They are a very close nit community like Newcastle. A side there would be an instant success like the Titans.

Liverpool has a population of 200,000. We don't have an NRL team. People in my neighborhood go for Roosters, Dragons, Tigers, Bulldogs.

An Ipswich team would also be an instant success.

 

[bobmar28]

I really don't think the NRL will allow 2 teams to enter in the same year. I think we will find that one will enter in 2013 and the 2nd team enter in 2014 or 2015.

Baby steps not giant leaps.

To prolong the interest.

 

[bobmar28]

I disagree about manly, they'll find another area to put funds into, get juniors from and help with player development. Actually, they already have. Manly seem to be checking out the sunshine coast with positive results. The area is accepting and Manly were going to put their juniors on the line for the sunshine coast. Apparently Manly is still involved with the sunshine coast, they are just unable to send players there now.

Hopefully in a few years, the sunshine coast will be Manly's area and hopefully they'll play a few games up there each years (4-6). That way they won't end up like the sharks.

That would be when the Central Coast gets a team.

 

[Jason Maher]

Liverpool has a population of 200,000. We don't have an NRL team. People in my neighborhood go for Roosters, Dragons, Tigers, Bulldogs.

An Ipswich team would also be an instant success.

On the occasions I've asked people from Liverpool, they've always said it's Tigers territory. Obviously I've been catching the Tigers fans. ;-)

As for Ipswich, they are in no way a guaranteed success. If any new team should have been, purely based on the population base it had to draw from, it would have been the Crushers. Also note the Titans succeeded where the Seagulls failed miserably.

Ipswich are going to have to do the hard work the Titans did if they want to be a success, and they'd be wise to look west to Toowoomba and the Lockyer Valley and east to Logan and possibly even the Redland Bay area. They have to get the community involved if they want to have a hope in hell of standing up to the Broncos. Make sure they get some serious corporate money behind the bid, and then promote the hell out of it across SEQ. Have membership drives ala the Bears and Reds, organise regular fan days with plenty of fun and free stuff for the kiddies in Toowoomba, Gatton, Ipswich, Logan, and Cleveland (and anywhere in-between, and even in Brisbane if they dare), create and maintain a decent website, offer free e-memberships, have votes (like the Titans did, which I participated in incidentally) for the team name, colours, and jersey (and invite fan submissions for the design of the latter), create a cheap junior membership program. Basically think otuside the square, and work hard to win the local community and local business support. Money and kids are the keys. Money secures the club at start-up, winning the kids secures the clubs future.