The Game Future NRL Stadiums part II

[Iamback]

Its really not a bad outcome so far IF clubs get with the times and move permanently to these great venues that have been provided for them. Hopefully Penrith gets done, the other clubs that its feasible for move, and then there is only sharks and manly to sort out down the track. That's a great outcome for the game. Then eventually the building (or total refurb) of a proper 80k national rectangular stadium joint funded with feds to replace accor. Much better and more likely than the nonsense of trying to fix up 10 venues currently used!

Not going to happen, a few event games get moved but not every game. That is the nonsense

 

[Perth Red]

Not going to happen, a few event games get moved but not every game. That is the nonsense

Then they reap what they sow and the game in Sydney will remain all the poorer for it. Sydney only needs 5 good stadiums and the NSW govt should stop pandering to the 70's rhetoric of Vlandys and tell the NRL so.

At the very least there should be a hyped sydneyvsydney Friday night game at Commbank EVERY week and a Sunday afternoon game at SFS EVERY week. That was what Smith tried to convince the clubs of and was shot down. Tribalism and all that BS.

 

[Iamback]

Then they reap what they sow and the game in Sydney will remain all the poorer for it. Sydney only needs 5 good stadiums and the NSW govt should stop pandering to the 70's rhetoric of Vlandys and tell the NRL so.

At the very least there should be a hyped sydneyvsydney Friday night game at Commbank EVERY week and a Sunday afternoon game at SFS EVERY week. That was what Smith tried to convince the clubs of and was shot down. Tribalism and all that BS.

You have unrealistic expectations though.

Lets take the Dragons for example, Every 2nd year they have hosting rights to the ANZAC day at the new SFS. There is 35-40k, Throw in being the home team for Magic round and it leaves 10 games including games against Sharks, Parra and Dogs that usually draw well.

Every week isn't possible. Sunday for example is the weaker games in the weekend. You aren't going to get big numbers for it. Just need 1-2 event games across the season.

Warriors will be home, Sharks in July have their full capacity

 

[macavity]

Its really not a bad outcome so far IF clubs get with the times and move permanently to these great venues that have been provided for them. Hopefully Penrith gets done, the other clubs that its feasible for move, and then there is only sharks and manly to sort out down the track. That's a great outcome for the game. Then eventually the building (or total refurb) of a proper 80k national rectangular stadium joint funded with feds to replace accor. Much better and more likely than the nonsense of trying to fix up 10 venues currently used!

So certain communities lose their clubs.

you don’t get it, you have shown you will never get it.

 

[Perth Red]

You have unrealistic expectations though.

Lets take the Dragons for example, Every 2nd year they have hosting rights to the ANZAC day at the new SFS. There is 35-40k, Throw in being the home team for Magic round and it leaves 10 games including games against Sharks, Parra and Dogs that usually draw well.

Every week isn't possible. Sunday for example is the weaker games in the weekend. You aren't going to get big numbers for it. Just need 1-2 event games across the season.

Warriors will be home, Sharks in July have their full capacity

I dont think I do, there are two solutions that I can see but both require change and thats where the problem lies.

Reality is 7 of the current 10 stadia in use are not fit for purpose for a 21st century top tier sport. The NRL's and clubs answer is to throw money at them or to pretend they are and keep using them. Its not working as can be evidenced by clubs continuing financial poor performances that has meant the NRL has had to up the grant massively year on year to keep them sustainable (at the expense of spending in other key strategic areas) and in the total stagnation of crowds for these clubs.

The answer is to either move to Commbank or SFS stadium Ft for those clubs that could (ie Dogs, Tigers, Dragons, Souths)
or for the NRL to take control and actually benefit from having so many clubs in one city by scheduling Sydney v sydney games each round at these stadiums with a whole range of strategies that go alongside it to get people to fill them. So clubs end up playing 3 or 4 games at least at these grounds in the best time slots for fans attending.

That doesnt solve the problem of their other home stadia needing massive spends on them but thats something they will have to live with I suppose and hope one day the NSw govt throws some money at them.

I still cant see any real logical reason you couldn't have
Dogs, Eels, Tigers at Commbank FT
Roosters and Souths FT at SFS
Dragons PT at SFS and WIN
Panthers new stadium
Leaving just lobbying for new Sharks and Manly stadium developments.

It'd be a hell of a lot easier for NRL to sell that to NSW Govt than the current nonsense of spending $50mill on LO or $100mill on shark park which are a fraction of what they need to be modern 21st century stadiums.

 

[Perth Red]

So certain communities lose their clubs.

you don’t get it, you have shown you will never get it.

wtf? Lose their clubs, its a 30min train ride every two weeks to support your team, its not the medieval days where you didn't leave your village lol.
Clubs are still based in and connected to their communities but, hey guess what, not every fan of that club still lives 3 streets from the local oval!

So whats your answer? Keep playing in front of 12k people in run down grounds until hopefully one day a NSW Govt comes along to throw a shed load of money at half developing them? Remain unviable so NRL has to keep throwing more and more money to keep you afloat at the expense of growing the game? Sounds a great plan!

Parra v Penrith the other night, that's the vision for what the game in Sydney should be aiming for on a regular basis. Keep up or get out the way I say.

 

[Iamback]

So certain communities lose their clubs.

you don’t get it, you have shown you will never get it.

He really has no idea

 

[Perth Red]

He really has no idea

so what's your answer? Easy to say others have no idea and not offer anything up for discussion!

 

[Iamback]

so what's your answer? Easy to say others have no idea and not offer anything up for discussion!

Not everyone thinks there is a problem though. So in which case what is to discuss?

 

[Perth Red]

Not everyone thinks there is a problem though. So in which case what is to discuss?

so your answer is stay as is? lol. Yep that usually works well for businesses.

 

[Iamback]

wtf? Lose their clubs, its a 30min train ride every two weeks to support your team, its not the medieval days where you didn't leave your village lol.
Clubs are still based in and connected to their communities but, hey guess what, not every fan of that club still lives 3 streets from the local oval!

So whats your answer? Keep playing in front of 12k people in run down grounds until hopefully one day a NSW Govt comes along to throw a shed load of money at half developing them? Remain unviable so NRL has to keep throwing more and more money to keep you afloat at the expense of growing the game? Sounds a great plan!

Parra v Penrith the other night, that's the vision for what the game in Sydney should be aiming for on a regular basis. Keep up or get out the way I say.

Only 1.5 Sydney teams average 12k.

Sharks will have 20k capacity as of July next year.

The bottom 3 sides for Average is

Warriors - Move back to NZ next year

Canberra

Dragons - horrible weather in Wollongong has hurt them.

The next lowest crowd ave is Souths who play at Accor

 

[Iamback]

so your answer is stay as is? lol. Yep that usually works well for businesses.

What is a realistic attendance for RL then?

 

[Perth Red]

What is a realistic attendance for RL then?

good venues, right pricing, reciprocal membership agreements, smart scheduling, better experience there is no reason we shouldn't see Sydney clubs hitting 15k went not going great and 20k when they are. Most major sports around the world at the level of NRL are comfortable drawing significantly more than that in decent sized cities. Sydneys over saturation of clubs means we wont ever hit the 30-60k of other major comps but 15k to 20k plus should be very doable for a comp the size of the NRL.

 

[Iamback]

good venues, right pricing, reciprocal membership agreements, smart scheduling, better experience there is no reason we shouldn't see Sydney clubs hitting 15k went not going great and 20k when they are. Most major sports around the world at the level of NRL are comfortable drawing significantly more than that.

Currently the 8 Sydney clubs combined are ave 15,616.

That is with Shark Park capacity capped at 11,500. That improves back to 18k next year
Horrible weather, Covid hangover

As for things that will boost that,
Roosters games will get a boost with away fans checking out the new Stadium - SCG is horrible for crowd.
Bulldogs are a sleeping giant. With how they have ended the year their crowd will lift

So the crowds are heading in the right way anyway. Just need to move a few things around, Like if it is a long weekend move the Thurs night to Sunday night game, A few minor changes like that

 

[Colk]

Its really not a bad outcome so far IF clubs get with the times and move permanently to these great venues that have been provided for them. Hopefully Penrith gets done, the other clubs that its feasible for move, and then there is only sharks and manly to sort out down the track. That's a great outcome for the game. Then eventually the building (or total refurb) of a proper 80k national rectangular stadium joint funded with feds to replace accor. Much better and more likely than the nonsense of trying to fix up 10 venues currently used!

To be fair the only club with an excuse to play all their games at a outer suburban stadium is Penrith as they are actively seeking growth in areas outside of Sydney and also due to their nominal geographic location. If Manly look for growth on the Central Coast (play games there) then they may also be included with Penrith

Cronulla can play their home games against regional teams like Cowboys, Raiders, Knights, Warriors, Dolphins at Shark Park but they should be playing their games against Sydney sides (and maybe even other clubs with big supporter numbers like Broncos or Storm) at a bigger venue like SFS. Dragons should also be playing their games against Sydney teams at the SFS. Regional clubs at Wollongong

Dogs, Tigers and Parra can play at Commbank full time. Roosters and Souths at SFS

 

[Colk]

So certain communities lose their clubs.

you don’t get it, you have shown you will never get it.

Oh for god’s sake. No other sport demands suburban teams have their own ground and if they do (like soccer) they pay for it themselves. The world will end if Cronulla or Manly for instance play some games at the SFS

 

[Perth Red]

Currently the 8 Sydney clubs combined are ave 15,616.

That is with Shark Park capacity capped at 11,500. That improves back to 18k next year
Horrible weather, Covid hangover

As for things that will boost that,
Roosters games will get a boost with away fans checking out the new Stadium - SCG is horrible for crowd.
Bulldogs are a sleeping giant. With how they have ended the year their crowd will lift

So the crowds are heading in the right way anyway. Just need to move a few things around, Like if it is a long weekend move the Thurs night to Sunday night game, A few minor changes like that

That number is boosted though by the bigger stadia. If we look at the stadia you are saying are ok to continue to be based at then we are looking at avg's of

Brookvale 12.7k
Kogorah 8.1k
Shark Park 10k (and lets not kid ourselves that it is due to capacity issues, it rarely breaks 13k pre covid)
LO 14.1k
Campbelltown 8.7k

throw in very poor corporate sales at those stadia and there in lies the problem.

 

[Iamback]

That number is boosted though by the bigger stadia. If we look at the stadia you are saying are ok to continue to be based at then we are looking at avg's of

Brookvale 12.7k
Kogorah 8.1k
Shark Park 10k (and lets not kid ourselves that it is due to capacity issues, it rarely breaks 13k pre covid)
LO 14.1k
Campbelltown 8.7k

throw in very poor corporate sales at those stadia and there in lies the problem.

If you are moving the bigger games it leaves the smaller drawing games, Very likely those same games draw the same at the bigger grounds

 

[Perth Red]

To be fair the only club with an excuse to play all their games at a outer suburban stadium is Penrith as they are actively seeking growth in areas outside of Sydney and also due to their nominal geographic location. If Manly look for growth on the Central Coast (play games there) then they may also be included with Penrith

Cronulla can play their home games against regional teams like Cowboys, Raiders, Knights, Warriors, Dolphins at Shark Park but they should be playing their games against Sydney sides (and maybe even other clubs with big supporter numbers like Broncos or Storm) at a bigger venue like SFS. Dragons should also be playing their games against Sydney teams at the SFS. Regional clubs at Wollongong

Dogs, Tigers and Parra can play at Commbank full time. Roosters and Souths at SFS

I think there is an argument for Cronulla and Manly, they aren't well supported outside their immediate community and getting to Commbank or SFS isnt the easiest trip for where their fanbase is, especially with the KO times we put on clubs.

5 really top notch stadiums for Sydney is about right number. SFS, Commbank, Penrith, Northern Sydney Stadium (could be used for Union as well) and Southern Sydney stadium (could be used by a future A league franchise as well). Only caveat would be NSW Govt take over ownership. They should not be pouring big money into properties owned by someone else imo.

 

[Colk]

If you are moving the bigger games it leaves the smaller drawing games, Very likely those same games draw the same at the bigger grounds

There are a few solutions to these problems.

Schedule double headers at the bigger stadiums such as SFS
Play lower rating games at suburban venues and the big games at bigger venues