grandparent rule in rugby

[Copa]

A great deal of rules other sport use don't transfer well to RL... simply because Aust dominates so much in RL ..... rules need to be in place to counter this and get non-Aussies into international teams.

 

[elBandido]

Mate i said that International Rugby is light years ahead of league and they use it so does Cricket, B Ball, Soccer and every other sports so why does League Fans have a problem with this rule? Is it because they over kill it?

No it is because I love my sport and I want to see people playing it with pride in their shirt.

If Baseball has a world cup then using the stupid eligitibility rules of RL both Ireland and Italy could have competitive teams but the chances of a serious domestic competition in those nations is 0.

International Rugby Union may well be further developed than TGG but we have the better product and I seem to remember a Japan side in their world cup that was hardly oriental,indeed my Soccer loving mates found it absolutely hilarious,is that what you want?

As for this Holland/Serbia nonsense you are both shining lights of international development in a short space of time many born and bred nationals are playing Rugby League in both countries,people seem to have issues(considering the current rules I don't see any problem personally)but that is 110% better then trawling NSW asking where peoples grannies came from.

 

[carlnz]

weather you like it or not this rule will be in place for the next world cup and im glad it is...not every nation has played the game for a 100 years. Just dont want to see teams like Lebanon again - even though it has done wonders for the game in that country.

 

[griff]

I seem to remember a Japan side in their world cup that was hardly oriental,indeed my Soccer loving mates found it absolutely hilarious,is that what you want?

Don't your soccer loving mates remember the Brazilian Alex playing for Japan in the soccer world cup?

 

[elBandido]

Woooo Alex one player who became a national citizen and has lived there for ELEVEN years and upon doing it committed himself to always play for Japan

 

[jvujosevic]

FFS GRANDPARENT RULE Jovan.?????
Alex Smits mother and father were BOTH born in Holland and Alex has a Dutch passport.BEST PLAYER ON THE DAY

As I have stated on a previous thread ALL our players were cleared by the RLEF as eligable for the games.

Jorik Moree plays in England and is no different than Soni and Zoran playing at the Skolars.
Nathan Gee was the ONLY Grand parent rule .

Get over it mate as we have beaten you twice (home and away)and once with a lot of top players missing.
We arrived in Belgrade with a weaker team that lost at home to Georgia and still played well enough to win.

Instead of dragging up the past look forward to improving your game.

This continuous pulling down of a progressing Netherlands side is not good for the future of developing nations.

Rules are rules and we broke NONE.

Any way congrats on the result in Tbilisi.
it looks like you were very competative.

Thanks for congrats for match against Georgia, we could made better result, but trip was very hard we went with train from Belgrade to Istanbul (27h) and then with airplane from Istanbul to Tbilisi (2h) and 5 good players who play against Holland couldn’t play, Georgia is great team with 12 players from RU national side, but YANTO I didn’t mention Holland in any way I just said that I have discussion with You, just tell me why You are find Your self every time. Second Soni don't play in Scholars he is the youngest Serbian player U17, Dalibor and Zoran played in Scholars. I don’t won’t to discuss about that any more, but I just want to ask you one question, what nationality is Ben? And I want to tell that Serbia have the youngest team in this competition, average age of 22 Serbian players who played this competition is about 22,5 year old and future is in front of us.

 

[bender]

Woooo Alex one player who became a national citizen and has lived there for ELEVEN years and upon doing it committed himself to always play for Japan

What did your soccer loving mates think about the first ever Irish team to qualify for the World Cup quarter finals a couple of years ago. Eleven born and bred Englishman - but most did at least have an Irish Grand parent.

Copa is correct when he says that the success of Australia makes rugby league different, but this also means that if other nations are to compete with Australia, we need to have loose eligibility laws, not tighter ones. I am not talking about nation hopping which does legitimately seem to effect credibility in some cases, but straight out grandparent selection which is a legitimate rule. Iestyn Harris Kieran Cunningham etc are English born but sticking to one nation gives that nation legitimate claims over them and doesnt harm credibility in any way. Rugby League, IMO, has 2 tiers. Amateur and Professional.

Serbia, Holland, Germany etc are not good enough and should not be good enough to make the RL World Cup. I think the RL world cup should be made of 2 competitions. A professional and amateur competition. The amateur competition should be made solely of domestic based players from Holland, Serbia, Wales, Tonga etc. The professional competition should be open slather to professionals using the Grandparent rule. The aim should be for the professional competition to make enough money to support the travelling costs of the amateur competitions and hopefully some extra money to go towards the RLIF. The amateur competition would and could play all main matches as double headers to the main competition and would follow the same structure and pattern thus ensuring amateur players get decent crowds and media coverage. If we had for example an 8 team world cup, this would effectively turn it into a 16 team world cup with plenty of minnow nations, but without the embarassing scorelines.

Anyone who thinks that any emerging nation can compete internationally within the next 20 years with the big 3 need look no further than New Zealand and France, who are the third and fourth strongest country in the world yet could not field a competive team without players from the Aust and GB competition. Even Qld, which is rugby league heartland, could not draw a side based on players that dont play in the NRL/ESL that would be competive with the big 3. No country could. The challenge is to find a system which allows that to happen (IMO, this has happened with Lebanon and the GP rule and could happen with other countries in time). But, there also needs to be a system which encourages the minor countries to compete in as well. I think the two tier world cup would do that.

 

[screeny]

RL's in a freaky situation too as its growth has been artificially stifled by the IRB's 100 year ban on RU playing RL. So now we have have a duty to spread it as fast as possible, using our established RL areas to do so. That means passing expertise on from those experienced RL areas to accelerate the growth of the game elsewhere.

Use the GP rule, but the RLIF simply needs to impose a quota and ENFORCE IT!

 

[hutch]

we definately need:
- a quota of players using gp rule. i would like to see no more than 6 players per 17 using gp rule.
- one country for life rule. will stop ridiculous situation of aussies such as willie mason, tonie carroll and luke ricketson playing for tonga, new zealand and ireland respectively. the number of aussies and kiwis playing for other countries at the last world cup was out of control.
- each nation playing a minumum of 5 test matches a year. there is no point not playing for 3 years in between cups, (which is the current situation)
- each world cup nation granted test status, and world cup matches to be included in test records. (last wc final, aus v nz, not included in test match records).
- some kind of ranking system. similar to cricket.

 

[bender]

we definately need:
- a quota of players using gp rule. i would like to see no more than 6 players per 17 using gp rule.
[/quota]
I have never agreed with quotas and i think the one country for life rule would fix it up. But, Interestingly, a quota of 6 GPs might be fair enough, if you allow parent rule players.

[quota]
- one country for life rule. will stop ridiculous situation of aussies such as willie mason, tonie carroll and luke ricketson playing for tonga, new zealand and ireland respectively. the number of aussies and kiwis playing for other countries at the last world cup was out of control.
[/quota]
Agreed 100%. But, I do think that this will only ever work if each nation gets a quota of internationals per year and not with things being so haphazard like they are (although they are slowly improving).
[quota]
- each nation playing a minumum of 5 test matches a year. there is no point not playing for 3 years in between cups, (which is the current situation)
[/quota]
Ideally, each nation needs to build its own series and rivalries. The European Nations cup this year has been great. Samoa v Tonga will be great also.

- each world cup nation granted test status, and world cup matches to be included in test records. (last wc final, aus v nz, not included in test match records).
Disagree. I think that Test status should be preserved to legitimate nations, At the moment, there are only 5 and PNG and France are debatable. Test records should not be broken by 100 pnt strolls in the park against Russia. Still, international records should be kept far better than they are. Is it even possible to find a list of internationals played in the last 5 years, let alone scoring records etc.

- some kind of ranking system. similar to cricket.

Agreed.

 

[Copa]

A quota of GP players is probably required. I'd go as far to say a quota on the number of "parent players" also.

It sounds absurd to think I have to say this... but.... there should be places open for people from the country being represented.

 

[hutch]

by quota on grandparent players, i also meant parent players, sorry. a quota of 6 players using parent, grandparent rule. the other 11 can be from the actual country being represented.

 

[screeny]

But the risk is you actually stop new organisations - whether they be enthusiastic Sydneysiders of Brits - from starting someething new with the potential of a Windies or a Lebanon. RL just ain't in a position to do that.

But there must be a way of drafting a set of guidelines where a country has to call itself by an appelation, such as XIII, has x amount of years to get locals, antoher x amount of years to get 50% locals etc.

As for five Tests, I reckon that's a bit unworkable for a lot of nations.

 

[YANTO]

A quota of GP players is probably required. I'd go as far to say a quota on the number of "parent players" also.

It sounds absurd to think I have to say this... but.... there should be places open for people from the country being represented.

But that could cause all kinds of problems.
I am a good example.
My parents being English and Scottish I was born in Singapore.
Now would I have to play for Singapore even though I was only six months old when we returned to the UK??

Another good example is Alex Smits who has dutch parents has a Dutch passport but was born in New Zealand .

Then you have people arguing about guys only seeing the country they are playing for on TV?

Again using a Dutch example Martijn Jonkers born in Amsterdam has a Dutch passport but was brought up in ST.Helens.
In fact we have four players born in Holland that live and were raised in the UK.

Grandparent,parent,country of birth ......all could bring problems.

Looking on the team sheet which would you class as a more genuine Dutch sounding player, Aaron de Jager , born and raised Australia with a Dutch mother or Phil Parkinson born in Holland but raised in England????

 

[carlnz]

who cares as long as they only play for one country and they PLAY RUGBY LEAGUE!!

this could go on and on and on

 

[Copa]

But that could cause all kinds of problems.
I am a good example.
My parents being English and Scottish I was born in Singapore.
Now would I have to play for Singapore even though I was only six months old when we returned to the UK??

Another good example is Alex Smits who has dutch parents has a Dutch passport but was born in New Zealand .

Then you have people arguing about guys only seeing the country they are playing for on TV?

Again using a Dutch example Martijn Jonkers born in Amsterdam has a Dutch passport but was brought up in ST.Helens.
In fact we have four players born in Holland that live and were raised in the UK.

Grandparent,parent,country of birth ......all could bring problems.

Looking on the team sheet which would you class as a more genuine Dutch sounding player, Aaron de Jager , born and raised Australia with a Dutch mother or Phil Parkinson born in Holland but raised in England????

All I'm saying is that there should be some italians in the italian team, some french in the french team etc etc.... to fill the entire team with people who may have never been to the country concerned is absurd. There is a place for the GP and parent rule.... but some people from Italy in the Italian team etc etc etc would be good.

You would proably qualify from a residency point of view.

 

[Sun_Down]

Is there a quota on GPs? If so, what is it?

 

[screeny]

You are only allowed to have four grandparents. Any more and one of your parents has been lying to you.

 

[Evil Homer]

You are only allowed to have four grandparents. Any more and one of your parents has been lying to you.

:lol:

It's an international team FFS,there shouldn't be any need for a quota of any kind.

 

[Sun_Down]

You are only allowed to have four grandparents. Any more and one of your parents has been lying to you.

Hahaha..but seriously, is there/will there be a quota for the RLWC?