Ideal team/city representation if comp was starting from scratch first few year

[titoelcolombiano]

We dissagree. Think there is room for both clubs and supporters.

Yes! You finally get it...

There is enough room for all:

Perth - NRL

Manly & Norths - NSW Cup

 

[titoelcolombiano]

With the 8000 Manly fans and the 1500 Bears fans it would be quite an occasion at NS Oval.

It would be perfect - Brooky or NSO would be rocking, these venues are perfect for NSW Cup and it would emulate the grass roots movement of the Shute Shield in Manly. NSW Cup would have more flexibility to schedule in family friendly time slots too.

 

[gUt]

Cairns
Townsville
Mackay
PNG
Rockhampton
CQ (based on Bundaberg)
Gympie
Sunshine Coast
Moreton
Brisbane
Ipswich
Melbourne
Perth
Auckland
Illawarra
Canberra
Newcastle
Central Coast

Once this comp is up and running I would push into more speculative RL territory like Fiji and Sydney

 

[flippikat]

We dissagree. Think there is room for both clubs and supporters.

Maybe for supporters, but my concern is sponsorship money & especially player depth. Last time we had 20 teams, some of them were atrocious.

 

[Perth Red]

It would be perfect - Brooky or NSO would be rocking, these venues are perfect for NSW Cup and it would emulate the grass roots movement of the Shute Shield in Manly. NSW Cup would have more flexibility to schedule in family friendly time slots too.

Move the Tigers license to Perth and Balmain and Wests to resume battle in NSw cup as well at liechardt and Campbell town fulltime. I can see NSW cup becoming an awesome second tier comp, chuck in a couple of NZ clubs and Fiji for some exoctica and the Sydney fans will flock to it surely? Fan friendly times, suburban grounds, tinnies on the hill, seems to be what everyone is asking for?

 

[TheFrog]

Tigers have 6 home games there this year, and possibly more next year, parramatta eels are not the only club the WSS will cater for

I wasn't talking about that. I'm sure the new stadium is (or will be since I'm hearing there are issues with it being completed on time) just lovely. Commiseration were for being a Parramatta supporter. Kind of a small dig at the neighbour who've won 3 spoons recently.

 

[Timmah]

Tigers have 6 home games there this year, and possibly more next year, parramatta eels are not the only club the WSS will cater for

4, not six. Three CTN and three LO with two others taken elsewhere (Brisbane & Tamworth)

 

[MugaB]

4, not six. Three CTN and three LO with two others taken elsewhere (Brisbane & Tamworth)

Nope not this year 2 at Campbelltown rounds 2 &3, and 2 at leichhardt has 1st and last round, then 7 games at WSS, 6 of them are home games
I posted their schedule down below

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Move the Tigers license to Perth and Balmain and Wests to resume battle in NSw cup as well at liechardt and Campbell town fulltime. I can see NSW cup becoming an awesome second tier comp, chuck in a couple of NZ clubs and Fiji for some exoctica and the Sydney fans will flock to it surely? Fan friendly times, suburban grounds, tinnies on the hill, seems to be what everyone is asking for?

These are my thoughts exactly. I know you've mentioned this before in a few posts but NSW Cup could perfectly cater to the tradition and nostalgia of suburban grounds, historic Sydney clubs (even if some are a reserves team) and Sunday afternoon family friendly kick-off times. Put in craft beer gardens for the hipster crowd and cheap tickets for families and you will have a RL experience that will offer something different to the NRL. Then the NRL can get on with playing in big shiny new stadia with just the biggest Sydney clubs and allow it to grow and cater to a different market (with some obvious overlap).

 

[Perth Red]

What would a revamped up scaled NSW premier state comp look like (not a reserve grade for NRL clubs) per se, they could be linked to each of the clubs for pathways but not run them)

Manly
Wests
Balmain
Newtown
North Sydney
Mounties
Wyong
Blacktown
Hunter
Central Coast
Illawarra Steelers
Auckland somethings
Wellington Somethings
Adelaide Rams

Could add in Cronulla if their golden goose fails to lay the golden egg they need and Fiji for a 16 team comp. Each side to get $4million grant from NRL, two games a week televised nationally on FTA. That would bring back Stallions desired rivalry

That would free up two NRL licenses allowing the NRL to expand immediately with Perth and Brisbane 2 and also give Adleiade, Wellington,CC and possibly Fiji a platform to lay claim to two future expansion places when the comp is ready to grow number of teams in a few years time.

 

[flippikat]

What would a revamped up scaled NSW premier state comp look like (not a reserve grade for NRL clubs) per se, they could be linked to each of the clubs for pathways but not run them)

Manly
Wests
Balmain
Newtown
North Sydney
Mounties
Wyong
Blacktown
Hunter
Central Coast
Illawarra Steelers
Auckland somethings
Wellington Somethings
Adelaide Rams

Could add in Cronulla if their golden goose fails to lay the golden egg they need and Fiji for a 16 team comp. Each side to get $4million grant from NRL, two games a week televised nationally on FTA. That would bring back Stallions desired rivalry

That would free up two NRL licenses allowing the NRL to expand immediately with Perth and Brisbane 2 and also give Adleiade, Wellington,CC and possibly Fiji a platform to lay claim to two future expansion places when the comp is ready to grow number of teams in a few years time.

Stop it mate, you're talking too much sense! ;-)

Seriously, though.. if we have a 16 team NSW cup (your plan plus Cronulla & Fiji) & a 16 team Queensland Cup (current 14 teams plus Darwin & another Pacific Island team.. let's say Tonga), you could even have...

* An "inter-league" round (or rounds) in the middle of the year. All 16 NSW Cup teams play Qld Cup opponents, the round(s) counts for points in their respective competitions, and could build new rivalries across borders.

* A knockout cup over 5 weekends (16 games.. then 8 games.. then quarterfinals, then semis, then final). Schedule it where you want - before the regular season, at the end.. or in the middle over the Origin period.

As well as the existing State Championship between NSW & Qld Cup champions.

So much more could be done with the 2nd tier, it just needs the will to do it.

 

[Perth Red]

Id love to know what was in Richardson's strategy that never made it into the NRL thinking.

 

[Timmah]

Nope not this year 2 at Campbelltown rounds 2 &3, and 2 at leichhardt has 1st and last round, then 7 games at WSS, 6 of them are home games
I posted their schedule down below

No idea where you got that graphic from but it's not correct at all.

The Cowboys home game is at Leichhardt, and the Newcastle home game is at Campbelltown.

There are 5 games at Bankwest, 4 of them are home games, one away v Eels.

https://www.weststigers.com.au/draw/

 

[MugaB]

No idea where you got that graphic from but it's not correct at all.

The Cowboys home game is at Leichhardt, and the Newcastle home game is at Campbelltown.

There are 5 games at Bankwest, 4 of them are home games, one away v Eels.

https://www.weststigers.com.au/draw/

The image was probably wrong i got it on the nrl.com site
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/10/25/wests-tigers-2019-draw-snapshot/

 

[flippikat]

Id love to know what was in Richardson's strategy that never made it into the NRL thinking.

I suspect it may have been like some of the "beefed up" 2nd tier ideas that have been suggested here - which is not bad in itself. I think the only reasons the NRL would kill that are..
a) if they were worried that a 2nd tier would take focus off first grade.
And b) they were worried about the impact on CRL competitions if it included country NSW teams in a 2nd tier.

I seem to remember the 2nd bit was actually a concern at the time.. but as I see it, country teams in a revamped 2nd tier could do a lot of good for the game there.

I believe the *REAL* reason the report got buried had nothing to do with the CRL however.. I really think Richardson was going to float the idea of demoting or relocating Sydney NRL clubs as part of the restructure. The NRL probably saw THAT, and got spooked.

 

[Timmah]

The image was probably wrong i got it on the nrl.com site
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/10/25/wests-tigers-2019-draw-snapshot/

Not in the least surprising NRL.com got it wrong

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Id love to know what was in Richardson's strategy that never made it into the NRL thinking.

@flippikat @Perth Red

I love the idea of a national second teir (i.e. the best of the QLD & NSW Cup plus any NRL teams that can't survive at that level. The comp would need to run independent teams that aren't just feeder teams to the NRL.

Fox league would televise it and channel 9 would show one game a week as they currently do for the QLD / NSW Cups. The current funding also given to the QRL & NSWRL to run the state comps can be used. I am sure we can generate enough interest to rival the NBL for example which manages to run a full-time comp.

The NSW and QLD teams focus on catering to the traditionalists with suburban grounds and traditional match timeslots (as it wouldn't be dictated by TV so much) and the x factor can come from the newies (Perth, Adelaide, PNG, Fiji) that have to enter the comp if they want promotion to the Telstra Premiership.

Promotion is by application only at at the discretion of the ARLC based on their strategy (lol). This is good news for the Bears because if they can prove that they have a great case, sponsors, members etc and there is another underperforming Sydney club the NRL can make a strategic switch to allow the underperforming team to regroup in the second teir. It means that no club is locked out forever and no club is left out in the cold because even the second teir is well promoted and televised meaning that fewer fans are lost to the game if a team goes down.

It also gives bids like Brisbane Bombers, WA Pirates etc a pathway to build fans, sponsors etc whilst they wait for entry to the NRL and they are not just wasting time and money spinning their wheels on a bid that may never see the light of day.

 

[The Great Dane]

I've thought for a while now that the long term goal for the NSW cup and Q cup should be to merge them and introduce a conference system to reduce travel costs as much as possible in an attempt to make it as cheap as possible to run a semi-pro club in the comp as possible with the hopes of making it feasible for clubs from at least the larger country towns (and in theory under/unrepresented metro areas as well).

A system where towns like e.g. Dubbo and Goulburn can support semi-pro/pro clubs alongside places like Brisbane, Sydney, and even clubs in expansion markets like e.g. Perth or Adelaide, in a comp that gets reasonable coverage would be huge, it'd address so many problems that the sport has in this country and create so much room not only for consolidation of markets but for growth as well.

 

[flippikat]

@flippikat @Perth Red

I love the idea of a national second teir (i.e. the best of the QLD & NSW Cup plus any NRL teams that can't survive at that level. I would go. The comp would need to run independent teams that aren't just feeder teams to the NRL.

The NSW and QLD teams focus on catering to the traditionalists with suburban grounds and traditional match timeslots (as it wouldn't be dictated by TV so much) and the x factor can come from the newies (Perth, Adelaide, PNG, Fiji) that have to enter the comp if they want promotion to the Telstra Premiership.

Promotion is by application only at at the discretion of the ARLC based on their strategy (lol). This is good news for the Bears because if they can prove that they have a great case, sponsors, members etc and there is another underperforming Sydney club the NRL can make a strategic switch to allow the underperforming team to regroup in the second teir. It means that no club is locked out forever and no club is left out in the cold because even the second teir is well promoted and televised meaning that fewer fans are lost to the game if a team goes down.

It also gives bids like Brisbane Bombers, WA Pirates etc a pathway to build fans, sponsors etc whilst they wait for entry to the NRL and they are not just wasting time and money spinning their wheels on a bid that may never see the light of day.

I agree. A Premiership (The current NRL first grade) *and* A championship (A combined NSW/Qld Cup, with NZ & Island teams as a 2nd tier) would be fantastic.

It makes sense as a natural place for Sydney clubs that aren't in the NRL, the best non-NRL Queensland clubs, locations like the PNG that aren't likely to sustain top-tier clubs AND clubs that are working towards an NRL spot like the Pirates.

I'm not sure I like the idea of demoting clubs as a "turn-around" strategy, then promoting them again.

I think that if Sydney is to be rationalized by demoting clubs (eg reducing the Sydney clubs to 5 as part of the restructure, moving the others back to 2nd tier), then the only way a Sydney club (recently demoted, or already in 2nd tier like the Bears or Jets) could come up is in the unlikely scenario where a top-tier NRL Sydney club falls over, in this case ensuring there's always 5 Sydney clubs - no more & no less. A kind of 'zero sum' rule where the number of Sydney clubs in the top tier is capped to a certain number.

 

[MugaB]

I think that if Sydney is to be rationalized by demoting clubs (eg reducing the Sydney clubs to 5 as part of the restructure, moving the others back to 2nd tier), then the only way a Sydney club (recently demoted, or already in 2nd tier like the Bears or Jets) could come up is in the unlikely scenario where a top-tier NRL Sydney club falls over, in this case ensuring there's always 5 Sydney clubs - no more & no less. A kind of 'zero sum' rule where the number of Sydney clubs in the top tier is capped to a certain number.

I think at the moment the NRL has this in place with 8 teams, (with st george exempted) i like the idea of sliming it down, the problem is when a team like manly fall down, and gets replaced by newtown, there isn't any northern sydney teams and too many south eastern teams, again relegation wont work in Australia, and you cant just bump up north sydney coz they are in the area, coz they might not be doing well at that moment form or management wise (again for an example)
I think we need to keep all as is and add more teams in locations that create more revenue and better markets
Perth and QLD will do this, with Adelaide in the future, lower tier teams will most likely stay there, although id rather see a central coast team in the bears make a comeback