Injury update

[umina panther]

@Pomoz he didn't do a Slater. it was an accident. This sport needs less rules not more mate. Be very careful what you wish for or we wont have the sport we love much longer

 

[TheFrog]

"You can jump but once airborne your knees must be down or it is a penalty" Where is that in the rule book?

I think it comes under dangerous contact. Clearly this incident was not considered to be that, but it does leave a bad taste that a bloke can fly through the air with knee cocked in the direction of a player defending a kick. What happened was forseeable and avoidable, and it put a player in hospital and out of the game for an extended period.

Why did his knee have to be cocked? If it wasn't, Mansour doesn't get injured.

 

[umina panther]

I think it comes under dangerous contact. Clearly this incident was not considered to be that, but it does leave a bad taste that a bloke can fly through the air with knee cocked in the direction of a player defending a kick. What happened was forseeable and avoidable, and it put a player in hospital and out of the game for an extended period.

Why did his knee have to be cocked? If it wasn't, Mansour doesn't get injured.

If 100kg men sat at home no one would get hurt either. Its a contact sport

 

[mxlegend99]

Betcats the rules say you can't strike another player. The rules allow a penalty for conduct that's not in the spirit of the game. Either of those two will suffice. He can break the Olympic record for the high jump as long as he doesn't smash someone's face to a pulp why he does it. That's not really in the spirit of the game, is it? If you leap about with your knee raised like that you should accept you will be penalised and possibly charged. How Burgess gets two weeks for a nothing bruise and Don gets nothing for ending a players season and stoving their face in, is beyond me.

The two arent comparable.

You can't run and jump without lifting your knees. Its an accident as that's just a natural reaction of the body. Zero intent and was only an issue as Mansour didnt contest the kick.

You can run without raising your elbow though. Burgess incident might have caused less damage. But he had more control over the incident.

 

[BxTom]

The two arent comparable.

You can't run and jump without lifting your knees. Its an accident as that's just a natural reaction of the body. Zero intent and was only an issue as Mansour didnt contest the kick.

You can run without raising your elbow though. Burgess incident might have caused less damage. But he had more control over the incident.

Go and watch a game of soccer or basketball and you will see that this statement is dead wrong. It's illegal in soccer - it comes under the PIADM rule and the AFL also penalises it.

Tom.

 

[umina panther]

Go and watch a game of soccer or basketball and you will see that this statement is dead wrong. It's illegal in soccer - it comes under the PIADM rule and the AFL also penalises it.

Tom.

The Victorian sport celebrates jumping and kneeing in the back from what I can tell

 

[forby]

It was an accident. His knee wasnt cocked, he just jumped forward. A really unfortunate but unavoidable incident.

 

[OldPanther]

I think it comes under dangerous contact. Clearly this incident was not considered to be that, but it does leave a bad taste that a bloke can fly through the air with knee cocked in the direction of a player defending a kick. What happened was forseeable and avoidable, and it put a player in hospital and out of the game for an extended period.

Why did his knee have to be cocked? If it wasn't, Mansour doesn't get injured.

I think people are reacting worse because it's one of our players injured. A fan favourite as well. Take the emotion out of it and most would believe it's an unfortunate accident.

 

[TheFrog]

Its an accident

This is not disputed. In workplaces and in driving a vehicle, even riding a bicycle, you are held responsible for accidents. I know its a contact sport, but mostly contact with the knees, accidental or otherwise, is not permitted for obvious reasons, I'm not sure why this incident should be any different.

Fortunately this is an isolated incident. I remember when spear tackles were considered acceptable. If this happened more often they'd have to get onto it. I'm sure a sporting body with the resources of the NRL would have to have consulted safety risk liability experts on this sort of thing. I don't think the game would lose a thing if having a cocked knee at head level when contesting a high ball was made a penalty offence. The risk of allowing it has been clearly demonstrated.

The death of Phil Hughes playing cricket comes to mind. Everything practicable was done to prevent this, but still it happened. It was considered not feasible to ban short pitched bowing altogether, as this would alter the basic balance between bat and ball which is the core of the game. It did lead to a lengthy public discussion on the issues involved, though. Just because everthing practicable was done in cricket, doesn't mean it has been done in Rugby League. All we've had following the Mansour injury is radio silence (including, it must be said, from the Panthers club). There needs to be public discussion on this on a much wider scale than just the team forum of the injured player.

 

[Pomoz]

Interesting debate. Two sides. It's part of the game vs it's avoidable, penalise it. Ahh well, thats why we have a forum.

Just one thing though, please stop saying you can't leap without cocking your knee. As BX Tom has said and others, you can. Basketball and soccer players do it all the time. In Don's case, I don't even think he realised he was doing it. He was in the air a while and had plenty of time to lower it if he had thought of it.

 

[mxlegend99]

Interesting debate. Two sides. It's part of the game vs it's avoidable, penalise it. Ahh well, thats why we have a forum.

Just one thing though, please stop saying you can't leap without cocking your knee. As BX Tom has said and others, you can. Basketball and soccer players do it all the time. In Don's case, I don't even think he realised he was doing it. He was in the air a while and had plenty of time to lower it if he had thought of it.

Who ever said cocking your knee? Cocking your knees is obviously intentional.

Im saying in order to run and jump you will be bending and lifting your knees in order to spring off the ground and get as much height as you can. Your feet arent going to get very high off the ground if you don't bend and lift your knees

Anthony Don was running fast and trying to jump as high as he could to outleap his opposing winger. He doesnt know Mansour will not jump aswell.

He could have made an effort once in the air to lower his knee. But his main focus is on catching the kick. That's his job. Mansour is focused on his opposing winger and he had more control over the outcome then Anthony Don did. Don could probably sense that Mansour had not jumped and was instead going to tackle him and just braced for impact.

Everything Don did looked like natural instinct comsidering his focus was on the ball. Mansour chose not to contest the kick and instead remain grounded while a player flew through the air at him. In that situation the collision was odds on to put one or both players in danger.

Usually the guy in the air would lose his legs and be in a dangerous situation. Once in the air there's very little you can do to protect yourself.

 

[mxlegend99]

This is not disputed. In workplaces and in driving a vehicle, even riding a bicycle, you are held responsible for accidents. I know its a contact sport, but mostly contact with the knees, accidental or otherwise, is not permitted for obvious reasons, I'm not sure why this incident should be any different.

Fortunately this is an isolated incident. I remember when spear tackles were considered acceptable. If this happened more often they'd have to get onto it. I'm sure a sporting body with the resources of the NRL would have to have consulted safety risk liability experts on this sort of thing. I don't think the game would lose a thing if having a cocked knee at head level when contesting a high ball was made a penalty offence. The risk of allowing it has been clearly demonstrated.

The death of Phil Hughes playing cricket comes to mind. Everything practicable was done to prevent this, but still it happened. It was considered not feasible to ban short pitched bowing altogether, as this would alter the basic balance between bat and ball which is the core of the game. It did lead to a lengthy public discussion on the issues involved, though. Just because everthing practicable was done in cricket, doesn't mean it has been done in Rugby League. All we've had following the Mansour injury is radio silence (including, it must be said, from the Panthers club). There needs to be public discussion on this on a much wider scale than just the team forum of the injured player.

Mansour could just have easily taken Dons legs out from under him and put Don head first into the ground from high in the air with momentum.

Mansour had more control over what happened then a guy who was in the air. That's the real issue though.

There should be absolutely no tackling of players in the air. Regardless of whether they were the attacking or defending team.

Both players were put in danger in that situation. It's just a freak accident that the defensive player was injured. More often thrn not the guy in the air will be the one who comes out worse.

 

[TheFrog]

Mansour could just have easily taken Dons legs out from under him and put Don head first into the ground from high in the air with momentum.

Had he done so and put Don out for the season that would not have been penalised either because it's not against the rules. But that is not what happened. Perhaps that risk could form part of a discussion on the issue, maybe in the off season. The sort of thing Gus Gould could bring about if he is so inclined.

 

[mxlegend99]

Had he done so and put Don out for the season that would not have been penalised either because it's not against the rules. But that is not what happened. Perhaps that risk could form part of a discussion on the issue, maybe in the off season. The sort of thing Gus Gould could bring about if he is so inclined.

Tackling in the air is dangerous so its ridiculous they allow it on an attacking player despite being illegal on a defensive player. The same risks apply.

We have seen a lot of guys land awkwardly and yet the NRL haven't bothered fixing the rule. It's only a matter of time before someone lands on their head or puts their hands out to prevent it and gets seriously f**ked up.

After the McKinnon incident they cracked down on barely dangerous lifting tackles and within 12 months it was forgotten.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Ummm.... who said anything about wanting the game less physical? I’m not calling for him to be punished, I’m basically saying that Sam was unfairly suspended and the Don was lucky to not receive the same.

Fair bump play on, in both cases.

By penalising that type of play it makes people overly cautious, hence it will become less physical.

Sam was suspended because he had carry over points. But I don’t think what he did should’ve even be put on report.

 

[herbert henry1908]

This is getting silly. You wouldn’t need to develop pads that are aimed at teaching players to hit the opposing player. You would just practice jumping high.

The pads are there to prevent injuries in practice I would’ve thought?

I really doubt your hypothesis that this is designed to hit other players. I’ve never heard a single person intimately involved in the game suggest it.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Betcats the rules say you can't strike another player. The rules allow a penalty for conduct that's not in the spirit of the game. Either of those two will suffice

What’s a strike? If it’s not defined then it’s subjective.

I can’t see how it’s not in the spirit of the game if it’s unintentional.

How Burgess gets two weeks for a nothing bruise and Don gets nothing for ending a players season and stoving their face in, is beyond me.

Burgess had carry over points. If he didn’t he would’nt have received a week. (Although he would’ve got some points)

 

[herbert henry1908]

Why did his knee have to be cocked? If it wasn't, Mansour doesn't get injured.

To get higher and increase the chance of getting the ball.

If you do a running jump and straighten your leg after you jump then that will pull your body down and reduce the height of the jump.

 

[BxTom]

To get higher and increase the chance of getting the ball.

If you do a running jump and straighten your leg after you jump then that will pull your body down and reduce the height of the jump.

You're wrong - you jump by bending your leg and you then straighten to get the spring. Bending it after the launch will lessen the jump. Go and look it up in basketball training sites. Cocking the knee as Don did is a conscious act to either intimidate, attack or defend.

 

[herbert henry1908]

You're wrong - you jump by bending your leg and you then straighten to get the spring. Bending it after the launch will lessen the jump. Go and look it up in basketball training sites. Cocking the knee as Don did is a conscious act to either intimidate, attack or defend.

Those are standing jumps.

With a running jump where you want to fly through the air to so you can get to the ball knees will typically stay bent.

Go and look at how often it happens in the AFL. This is a much closer comparison to what we’re talking about.