Jdb case

[merahputih]

If a blind man has valuable possessions in his home out in the open for any visitor to see, it would be risky for him to invite strangers into his home without first taking percussions - in this case putting these items away out of sight.

This does not mean that if he did not hide his valuables, he is at fault or negate any guilt from the thief if these items are stolen.

Another example would be if you left your wallet on the front seat of your locked car. It would be no lessor crime if a thief smashed the window and stoll the wallet however, I am sure the investigating police would tell you that you were very careless and this carelessness contributed towards the crime.

The image of a blind man playing the drums has made my day.

 

[giboz71]

Nice response and well researched by the look of it but for the life of me I can't understand why "common sense" is being rendered almost irrelevant by some people.
I sure as hell didn't get to my age without relying on common sense and plenty of it because without it I could have well and truly ended up in all sorts of shit just like many of the kids I grew up with.
Old saying if it smells like shit it probably is and that is the value of common sense and being able to understand potential outcomes.
For all we know if the charges are true it could well be that some other female dodged a bullet by using common sense on that night and no doubt if the men are guilty that this behaviour could be in fact repetitive on their part and in fact many other women might have dodged a bullet as well.
If that is the case you have to ask why that might be.

But the assertion is that women meeting blokes is an inherently dangerous act. There is obviously some risk involved, but it should be no different to most other things, like the example I used when you drive a car. There is always a chance something could happen, but that doesn't stop people driving.

How many men and women are hooking up on dating sites, pubs, parties etc and do so without incident? Should women exercise as you say "common sense" by locking themselves in their homes for fear of getting raped? Does that "common sense" notion apply to men who also meet strangers? Who's to say they're not in danger also?

I get elements of your argument and I agree that common sense should always apply, I just have a big problem with the original statement which infers a woman going home with a man (or in this case 2 men) somehow show poor common sense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try and do all the time.

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates, not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.

 

[possm]

But the assertion is that women meeting blokes is an inherently dangerous act. There is obviously some risk involved, but it should be no different to most other things, like the example I used when you drive a car. There is always a chance something could happen, but that doesn't stop people driving.

How many men and women are hooking up on dating sites, pubs, parties etc and do so without incident? Should women exercise as you say "common sense" by locking themselves in their homes for fear of getting raped? Does that "common sense" notion apply to men who also meet strangers? Who's to say they're not in danger also?

I get elements of your argument and I agree that common sense should always apply, I just have a big problem with the original statement which infers a woman going home with a man (or in this case 2 men) somehow show poor common sense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try and do all the time.

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates, not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.

I have 5 children and the thre girls are the eldest. My advice to them was to always go out in groups and if you plan to go to a party afterwards, never go on your own. We had a big games room about 12m x 9m with a good sound system, a snooker table, dart board and a bar in that room.

What I did was tell the girls they can bring their friends home and have the games room to themselves. They had access to drinks and snacks ect. Once they knew a young man and felt comfortable with him, they could go where they pleased. I had already explained the risks to them and they fully understood.

 

[Belta]

Gibiz71 said;

“ a women going home with a man in this case 2 men) somehow show poor commonsense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try anddo all the time.”

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates,not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.”

I get your point and agree it shouldn’t be different. Maybe I’m old fashion.
But I still view guys and girls in a different way for many reasons. Would I be more concerned about my teenage daughter being in a unit with two intoxicated male ‘strangers’ than I would if my teenage son went alone in a unit with two intoxicated female ‘strangers’. You’re right I should be equally worried for both but instinctively I would be more concerned for my daughters welfare.

 

[giboz71]

Gibiz71 said;

“ a women going home with a man in this case 2 men) somehow show poor commonsense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try anddo all the time.”

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates,not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.”

I get your point and agree it shouldn’t be different. Maybe I’m old fashion.
But I still view guys and girls in a different way for many reasons. Would I be more concerned about my teenage daughter being in a unit with two intoxicated male ‘strangers’ than I would if my teenage son went alone in a unit with two intoxicated female ‘strangers’. You’re right I should be equally worried for both but instinctively I would be more concerned for my daughters welfare.

I have no problem with any of that. And agree women need to exercise more caution than blokes. But who's to say she didn't? JDB and his mate may have been perfect gentlemen before the alleged incident. Did she still exercise bad judgement?

If a bloke gets his old fella sliced off by a psycho female he took home, did he exercise bad judgement?

No he's a victim of a crime. Just like any female hurt in a similar situation. And that should be the end of it.

Whether each exercised common sense or not is not relevant.

 

[WoyD4LWoy]

Another man has been questioned by police over an alleged sexual assault involving Jack de Belin
https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/cou...n/news-story/0dadffd1272629b8052ec769edbd8d0e

 

[Belta]

giboz71 said;

“...Whether each exercised common sense or not is not relevant.”

—————————————————————————————————

I agree. We should all feel as though we live in a society where each and everyone of us can move about free from any form of violence or fear of such violence. ( not that I’m judging this incident or drawing any conclusions)

 

[Drag Queen]

But the assertion is that women meeting blokes is an inherently dangerous act. There is obviously some risk involved, but it should be no different to most other things, like the example I used when you drive a car. There is always a chance something could happen, but that doesn't stop people driving.

How many men and women are hooking up on dating sites, pubs, parties etc and do so without incident? Should women exercise as you say "common sense" by locking themselves in their homes for fear of getting raped? Does that "common sense" notion apply to men who also meet strangers? Who's to say they're not in danger also?

I get elements of your argument and I agree that common sense should always apply, I just have a big problem with the original statement which infers a woman going home with a man (or in this case 2 men) somehow show poor common sense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try and do all the time.

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates, not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.

Spot on. It's the double standards that get my goat. Case in point: SBW and Candice Falzon-Warner having consensual sex in a pub toilet. SBW receiving high 5's whilst Candice was totally s**t -shamed and barely left the house for a year. It also destroyed her sporting career. I should add that hooking up in a toilet didn't exactly show common sense from either of them.

 

[2218]

Has anyone heard of another women making a similar complaint involving jdb and the other fella

 

[Old Timer]

But the assertion is that women meeting blokes is an inherently dangerous act. There is obviously some risk involved, but it should be no different to most other things, like the example I used when you drive a car. There is always a chance something could happen, but that doesn't stop people driving.

How many men and women are hooking up on dating sites, pubs, parties etc and do so without incident? Should women exercise as you say "common sense" by locking themselves in their homes for fear of getting raped? Does that "common sense" notion apply to men who also meet strangers? Who's to say they're not in danger also?

I get elements of your argument and I agree that common sense should always apply, I just have a big problem with the original statement which infers a woman going home with a man (or in this case 2 men) somehow show poor common sense. That completely dis-empowers women from doing what us blokes try and do all the time.

When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates, not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense.

Re the text in bold in your post.
I take it your inference is that man are always trying to get sex and women should have the same freedom to do so and I agree.
If that is your intention then by all means go back to the flat but if it is not your intention then what do you think is the common sense thing to do?
Now if you go back to the flat with the intention of having sex and then decide to bail out, that is your human right to do so and all other parties are duty bound to honour that position.
But as we don't know the facts of the situation then this argument will be circular in nature.

 

[Splinters]

"When the situation is reversed, blokes are copping high 5's from all their mates, not having to answer whether they exercised good common sense."

I don't think that this is true at all. Both men and women have to equally show caution when bringing strangers of the opposite sex into their private spaces.

Assuming the truth of what we know of the accusations, the young lady was foolish in the extreme to bring two young men (basically strangers) home from a night out on the drink.

By the same token, the two young men were leaving themselves wide open to accusations that it are very difficult to defend. So they also were very unwise.

It is no use to say "women or men *ought* to be able to do such and such" because the reality of the world is they can't do just whatever they want.

Perhaps I *ought* to be able to speak to a young female in my office with the door closed, but I can tell you that is damn well not going to happen.

Common sense. A little bit can go a long way.

 

[Splinters]

"Spot on. It's the double standards that get my goat."

For centuries and still today women have been the beneficiaries of all kinds of "double standards".

Double standards are very often not double standards at all. They are invariably just different standards that very wisely take account of the obvious and essential differences between men and women.

Or are we now going to try to claim that men and women are not different? Are we really that far down the road to complete societal lunacy?

 

[SBD82]

This thread, and the ones on the same topic in other subforums, are quite troubling. I think that's about enough internet for me.

 

[WoyD4LWoy]

The Daily Telegraph and Fairfax are reporting Callan Sinclair presented himself to police for questioning on Monday morning after he was identified as being with de Belin on the night of the alleged incident a week ago.

No charges have been laid against Sinclair.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/cou...n/news-story/0dadffd1272629b8052ec769edbd8d0e

 

[Miller was a legend]

The Daily Telegraph and Fairfax are reporting Callan Sinclair presented himself to police for questioning on Monday morning after he was identified as being with de Belin on the night of the alleged incident a week ago.

No charges have been laid against Sinclair.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/cou...n/news-story/0dadffd1272629b8052ec769edbd8d0e

Was expecting that to be the case

 

[Old Timer]

Was expecting that to be the case

Pour quoi?

 

[BLM01]

giboz71 said;

“...Whether each exercised common sense or not is not relevant.”

—————————————————————————————————

I agree. We should all feel as though we live in a society where each and everyone of us can move about free from any form of violence or fear of such violence. ( not that I’m judging this incident or drawing any conclusions)

You talk about a perfect world, one far from which we currently live in including what has transpired in history.
We are all supposed to evolve and grow learning from history and past experiences to make for a better future but does not and will ever happen when it comes to people committing crimes. That is life. So what can and should we do. We all adhere caution, commonsense and make choices in what and how we do things.
It still can not stop some unlucky people being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It can never be always right. That too is life....Geez I must be watching too much Dr Phil.

 

[BLM01]

Pour quoi?

Cause there were 2 people alledgedly in the room starkers. JDB was just the highest profile one that the media could not wait to get out there on the front and sports back pages

 

[red rocket]

Cause there were 2 people alledgedly in the room starkers. JDB was just the highest profile one that the media could not wait to get out there on the front and sports back pages

Sinclair has also been charged

 

[Belta]

You talk about a perfect world, one far from which we currently live in including what has transpired in history.
We are all supposed to evolve and grow learning from history and past experiences to make for a better future but does not and will ever happen when it comes to people committing crimes. That is life. So what can and should we do. We all adhere caution, commonsense and make choices in what and how we do things.
It still can not stop some unlucky people being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It can never be always right. That too is life....Geez I must be watching too much Dr Phil.

Yeah, sometimes ‘shit happens’ and there are no winners. And I suppose it’s easy to criticise and judge. If we really think about it, especially when alcohol is involved, it would be soo easy to get caught out in uncompromising situations, and most of the time it doesnt end as disastrous as this has.