Knights vote to extend Brian Smith's contract

[Karmawave]

That's right Coby.

It's not taking anything away from Smiths achievements at the club so far in suggesting its a very ordinary business decision being made especially when the decision does not have to be a rushed one, and the financial risk can be reduced if contract negotiations are postponed to see 2009 performance.

 

[Jobdog]

And .... if we do perform?

 

[TooheysNew]

Uh, we are in a much better position to make decisions?

 

[Jobdog]

So you and Karma will then acknowledge that it turned out to be the correct decision made by the club?

 

[Karmawave]

So you and Karma will then acknowledge that it turned out to be the correct decision made by the club?

You clearly aren't a very good businessman Dobjog.


If we perform - then we can still SIGN HIM LATER.

If we don't perform - then we are STUCK with a contract we cannot afford to pay out.

For all the renewed professionalism Smith has supposedly bought to the club, he still led us to 15th and 9th. Hardly setting the world on fire. His first year especially was a complete shambles. Reality is, better management and organisational skills could have turned around the clubs professionalism!

If you are given a chance in business of extending a persons contract AFTER you see the final results of their first contract - then you take that opportunity.

You don't extend on HOPE or a ' gut feeling '. Not when its a hundreds of thousands of dollars of risk by a club already $3M in debt.

 

[Jobdog]

You clearly aren't a very good business Dobjog.


If we perform - then we can still SIGN HIM LATER.

If we don't perform - then we are STUCK with a contract we cannot afford to pay out.


If you are given a chance in business of extending a persons contract AFTER you see the final results of their first contract - then you take that opportunity.

You don't extend on HOPE or a ' gut feeling '.

Of course. But now we have, and if we do perform, than we can expect an "Well it turned out to be a good decision by the club" from you and Coby, just like if we crash and burn you'll be saying "We told you so!!" ;-)

 

[macavity]

lets wait and see how long the extension is for.

one year is perfect, two is marginal, any longer it is a disaster in the making.

 

[Karmawave]

"Well it turned out to be a good decision by the club" from you and Coby, just like if we crash and burn you'll be saying "We told you so!!" ;-)

Well I hope it does turn out for the best of the club!

I just think its fraught with financial danger and not very smart.

 

[Karmawave]

lets wait and see how long the extension is for.

one year is perfect, two is marginal, any longer it is a disaster in the making.

I don't believe there is any hope in the world it will be a one year extension.

2 is the most likely, but don't be surprised if its 3+.

Smith won't accept 1 year.

 

[aqua_duck]

If it was any other bloke than Brian Smith (the most bastardised bloke in the media)we'd all be saying it was a good decision. To me there's no evidence to suggest Smith is going to run the club into the ground in the next 2 or 3 years. His team have been perennial finals contenders in the past and if it were not for Joey and BK in 01 Smith would be talked about as one of the better coaches of the past 2 decades. I agreed he stayed too long at Parra but he was there for 11 years, he's been here for 2 and at most will be here maybe 5 or 6 years all up. I'm confident we'll be in better shape after Smith tenure than after Hages'

 

[TooheysNew]

Of course. But now we have, and if we do perform, than we can expect an "Well it turned out to be a good decision by the club" from you and Coby, just like if we crash and burn you'll be saying "We told you so!!"

No. I'll still be saying it was a bad decision.

If he performs well and we re-sign him then, that would be a good decision.

At the moment, it's just an unnecessary risk.

 

[perverse]

i'm with karma and coby on this one (although probably not to the extent that karma is opposed). it's certainly a bad business decision, a risk if you will. i'm pretty confident it will turn out ok for us, especially if it's only for a 2 year extension... but he's right in the fact that - as it currently stands - there is no guarentee that we will do any better this year than last... and in our current financial position it's a large risk to re-sign him before a ball has been kicked.

one thing i think karma likes to leave out though is that if we left it much longer, smith would be shopping elsewhere for a job.. and that would either drive his price up, or we would miss the boat entirely and be stuck with our pants down.

 

[voltron]

I think that at least the coach should know where they stand before the season starts
it creates too much uncertainty and will drag the team down

our previous years
2005 - 16th (joeyless for half year, 13 game losing streak)
2006 - 4th (with joey)
2007 - 15th (again without joey and the worst injury toll ever, 35 players we used?)
2008 - 9th (without buderus, simpson and cross for half the season)
i think we're improving
but i think we're a little like the gold coast titans, a few key injuries and we struggle pretty badly
but we're making improvements across the board, its not a one man show anymore, making everyone look better than they are
everyone is actually getting better

so a 2 year extension wouldnt be too bad
i mean manly had a 5 year plan and they got their premiership at the end of it
but beyond 5 years? without a premiership, wouldnt see too much improvement after that....

 

[Alex28]

If he's performing and we sign him later in the year, we risk both his price going up, and competition from other clubs requiring coaches, because there isn't a great deal of depth out there.

2 or 3 years is ideal - we give him the time to get the job done. It isn't done at the moment, and I don't think that just anybody could come in and take over at this stage. We badly need his experience and guidance. We are far from out of the "Post-Joey" woods...

 

[Bring it home Knights]

I have absolutely no issue with Brian Smith getting an extension before a ball is kicked this year. The way karma etc are talking, it's being made out like smith hasn't been around long enough to know what kind of coach he is/will be. If the board and supporters don't know what kind of coach he is after 505 games and actually need to see how he coaches after say 515 games, then we don't have a clue....

Over 505 games, he has demonstrated that tactically, he is one of the best coaches going around. Last season we didn't have Johns and also lacked having simpson, cross and buderus for extended periods and the team played with a desire and attitude that I hadn't seen in years. Under Smith players are also improving their all round game. That goes for defence, attack, offloads, support play etc.

I would offer him a one year contract extention to allow him to develop and gel our recently formed team into a premiership success. Karma said brian smith wouldn't accept a one year extention, I didn't know that he talked to Brian or his family to find out his feelings towards a one year extention.

 

[Joker's Wild]

Karma and Coby, have you considered these questions:

What makes you think we will do any better under another coach? (Assuming there is any other 1st grade coaches available)

Who would be your alternatives?

What if we hold off on signing Smith as you suggested, he signs with an ESL club for 2010 onwards (he was weighing up his options), then we have a bumper year and are without a coach? Would that have been a good "business decision"?

 

[Burwood]

Tew was uncertain what length of tenure would be offered to Smith but said last night's decision was a vote of faith in the coach, who steered Newcastle to within one win of the play-offs last year after a controversial cleanout in 2007.

Says it all really.

Some people on here seem to be overreacting to the decision by the board. How can it be a bad business decision when we haven't resigned the bloke yet? We haven't even put a length on the contract extension or spoken about when he will be resigned!

The only thing to come out of last nights meeting is that the club has the intention to extend his contract.

 

[Karmawave]

Karma and Coby, have you considered these questions:

What makes you think we will do any better under another coach? (Assuming there is any other 1st grade coaches available)

Who would be your alternatives?

I don't think thats even relevant.

I have no problems with the re-signing of Brian Smith if it is warranted after starting the season great.

Just not now. Simple as that.

There is no way he will take a 1 year deal. No way in the world.

And after 505 first grade games, ( as mentioned above ), this ' tactically brilliant ' coach has proven to be divisive, controversial, unpopular and very different while managing exactly 0 premierships. So lets not get too carried away with his ability here.

Brian Smith only deserves an extension if or when the Knights show they are heading towards the Top 4.

Forgetting the fact Stephen Kearney or Adrian Lam will make fine first grade coaches, my issue isn't as much with the re-signing of Smith to an extension, but the timing of it.

Above all else, Brian Smith on the whole remains an unpopular coach to play for, and is always at the top of the players polls of least popular coaches. Deride the player polls all you like, but perception is reality - and while ever Brian Smith remains at the head of the Newcastle Knights, the club will find it even more difficult to recruit players than they already do now.

 

[Serc]

Who else are we going to sign - Bennett? do a Lazarus on Jack Gibson??? Not every club can have the best coach in the game, and we do pretty well with one of the top few of the last 2 decades.

So do we wait until say round 7...we're (hypothetically) 4 wins 3 losses at that point (what you'd expect from us at the start of this year)...nah give it another half a dozen...

Round 13 - 6 wins 7 losses...hmmm still not sure if we should sign Smithy, lets see how he's going in round 20

Round 20 - 11 wins 9 losses...looking pretty good for top 8 now that we're in 6th position! Ok I'm pretty sure its worth signing Smithy up for another year now, lets get him to sign on the dotted line...where is he...ohh...he signed for *insert team here* a month ago? Damn.

You could also consider a scenario where we do go poorly this year and by round 10 there is a plethora of new Smith-hate articles which most of the football public believes along with the general unsettled feeling around the club which does nobody any good.

I'm happy enough to sign Smithy now, but just for a year extra and we can look at things again early next year. Pretty happy with him so far - don't forget by the end of last season we could beat the Storm without Johns and Buderus, after only 2 years since Smithy began! (with one year where we went nowhere with half the team injured at any given time)

 

[Burwood]

But we haven't signed him to an extension!?!?!?

If anything it is an incredibly smart move by the club. They have made it public that they intend to resign him, without actually committing to the decision. It's basically a way to let players, fans and the coach know that they want him here beyond next season so that Smith doesn't get itchy feet and look elsewhere, leaving the club in the lurch. Now Newcastle have the opportunity to string things along for months like they always do, but without the intense spotlight of the media saying that we are a boardroom divided on the issue. They can always go back on their decision if the season doesn't pan out like they hoped.