Mark Webbers formula 1 dream to come true if he wins final race

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Ferrari can suck the fat one Petrov did a number on Alonso and so justice prevails and Alonso doesn't win. Webber was never in it and all the pissing and moaning from Australian media and fans about Webber not being the number one driver has proven to be crap.

 

[The 18th Man]

Congrats Seb Vettel, brilliant drive.

I guess though who wanted Red Bull to favour our own Mark Webber were proven to be wrong in their assessment, Vettel had the nerve to win the Driver's Championship. Mark didn't. Seb Vettel showed that you don't need team orders to win a Driver's World Title. You need heart, speed and a certain amount of arrogance to grab the crown. All traits of past World Champions.

Agree on Petrov drive, might have just saved his F1 career.

 

[franklin2323]

Vettel 10 poles. He should of romped it in. Webber did well to stay infront for so long when clearly vettel had the better package

 

[Jimbo]

Seb crashing into Webber in Turkey didn't help things however.

Webber crashing into the wall in Korea is what really didn't help...

I've been a fan of Mark's since way back in 1995 when he was driving Formula Fords, this year marks 30 years since an Aussie last won the F1 title, it's about time Mark's name joins Alan and Sir Jack's on the honour roll!

Agreed

I've been a fan since my dad and I passed Webber's Yellow Pages trailer out in the middle of nowhere on the drive to Adelaide for the GP in 1995. I followed him through FF, F3, the ups and downs (literally) at Mercedes, the adventures in F3000 and F1 with Paul Stoddart, the false dawns of Jaguar and Williams and finally genuine competitiveness at Red Bull

Which is why it's disappointing to say that the person most responsible for Mark Webber losing this year's championshiop is Mark Webber

 

[Danish]

Webber should have had the championship wrapped up before this race, as as such yes he can really only blame himself in the end.


However, did anyone else have a sneaking suspicion of sabotage this race weekend??

Webber has ALWAYS been competitive in qualifying all year. He and Vettel have taken a huge amount of the pole positions, and the two of them are never more than a few 100ths apart. His times in the practices would have seen him 4th at worst, and generally they are still holding back at that stage.

Something drastically wrong happened to that car in quals, and really his fate was sealed on saturday.

Red Bull didn't just not favour Webber this season. They unapologetically favoured Vettel. Not that I blame them, given the huge dollars he brings to the team, but still its a shame.

 

[Jimbo]

However, did anyone else have a sneaking suspicion of sabotage this race weekend??

Interesting theory, which on the face of it would be supported by Red Bull's actions prior to Abu Dhabi

But it would have been way too risky, given the likelihood of Alonso finishing better than fifth

 

[franklin2323]

Danish your right they did favour Vettel although 10 poles meant Vettel prob got the best race setup being the highest ranked driver Red Bull would argue.

So we will never know the answer but Given Webber had moderate success 3rd's a good result. Not having re-fuelling meant no oppotunity if you have a poor qualifing

 

[Danish]

Interesting theory, which on the face of it would be supported by Red Bull's actions prior to Abu Dhabi

But it would have been way too risky, given the likelihood of Alonso finishing better than fifth

You're right in that the odds of Vettel winning were obviously worse than Webber prior to qualifying, however F1 teams have shown time and time again that they will only too happily sacrifice one driver for another.

I think they knew they could get Vettel on pole, and were willing to risk the chance.

However I also think they were likely hoping to have Webber qualify 2nd or 3rd ahead of Alonso so they could then use him as a block.

Danish your right they did favour Vettel although 10 poles meant Vettel prob got the best race setup being the highest ranked driver Red Bull would argue.

So we will never know the answer but Given Webber had moderate success 3rd's a good result. Not having re-fuelling meant no oppotunity if you have a poor qualifing

I actually think not having refuelling is what led to Webber's success this year.

He has always been a tremendous qualifier, and in my opinion an excellent racer for position. His main problem seems to be pit stops, as he has forever been the no.2 driver at his team and as such got the no.2 pit crew. His pit strategies have also left a lot to be desired from time to time (how much influence he has on that I have no idea).

Vettel certainly took out plenty of poles this year, and don't get me wrong he is a worthy world champion. I just would have liked to see Red Bull throw their weight behind Webber this year. They have a decade to win 4-5 world titles with Vettel.

 

[franklin2323]

I actually think not having refuelling is what led to Webber's success this year.

He has always been a tremendous qualifier, and in my opinion an excellent racer for position. His main problem seems to be pit stops, as he has forever been the no.2 driver at his team and as such got the no.2 pit crew. His pit strategies have also left a lot to be desired from time to time (how much influence he has on that I have no idea).

I just would have liked to see Red Bull throw their weight behind Webber this year. They have a decade to win 4-5 world titles with Vettel.

Yeah it prob was 50/50 as for the refuel. He has struggled for fast starts this year for some reason. With the early pit option maybe he could of got some points on bad qualifing weekends.

I agree. Korea yes he crashed but after the re-start could of switched the 2 and Vettel could of done a holding job on Alsonso. Brazil also swith the positions given he was number 1 for so long other teams would of done such a thing.

The question is does he stay and put up with it again or go??

 

[abpanther]

Can one of you F1 fans explain to me the reasoning behind removing refueling? I mean I can't see any advantages out of it and I can see plenty of disadvantages, one of which being removing one of the best opportunities for gaining places in a race through pit stop strategies, shouldn't they be trying to increases position changes as much as possible>?

 

[Jimbo]

You're right in that the odds of Vettel winning were obviously worse than Webber prior to qualifying, however F1 teams have shown time and time again that they will only too happily sacrifice one driver for another.

I think they knew they could get Vettel on pole, and were willing to risk the chance.

However I also think they were likely hoping to have Webber qualify 2nd or 3rd ahead of Alonso so they could then use him as a block.

So they wanted to slow him down just enough to be slower than Vettel, but still quicker than Alonso and the rest?

That would be quite an achievement...

 

[Danish]

They want to try and increase overtaking on the track. They tried it with the failed KERS system, and their newest method is this one of limiting the amount of impact pitting can have on a race so that drivers are forced to overtake each other the old fashioned way.

The problem is that all of the drivers are absolute masters of defensive driving so overtaking is nigh on impossible with the minimal differences between the cars.

Its become very much a race for pole position and then a sprint to the first corner this year.

Personally I love pit stops and the strategy and lottery they bring to racing.

 

[Danish]

So they wanted to slow him down just enough to be slower than Vettel, but still quicker than Alonso and the rest?

That would be quite an achievement...

Ideally, yes.

However ensuring Vettel qualified ahead of Webber was their primary goal, and has been all year. Just this race they happened to need Webber to finish worse than 2nd for Vettel to have a chance at the title so the difference is set ups on each of the cars for qualifying and the race were greater than usual.

 

[Jimbo]

Can one of you F1 fans explain to me the reasoning behind removing refueling? I mean I can't see any advantages out of it and I can see plenty of disadvantages, one of which being removing one of the best opportunities for gaining places in a race through pit stop strategies, shouldn't they be trying to increases position changes as much as possible>?

I believe it came down to costs, although safety was always a concern

It was introduced in the first place to spice up 'the show,' although a couple of drivers ended up generating a little more interest than they would have liked...

 

[Jimbo]

Ideally, yes.

However ensuring Vettel qualified ahead of Webber was their primary goal, and has been all year. Just this race they happened to need Webber to finish worse than 2nd for Vettel to have a chance at the title so the difference is set ups on each of the cars for qualifying and the race were greater than usual.

Alonso was the bigger danger though

Vettel winning with Alonso third would have given Alonso the title

It therefore made no sense to hobble Webber, because they needed him at the front to deprive Alonso of another place

 

[franklin2323]

Personally I love pit stops and the strategy and lottery they bring to racing.

I agree. It's great to have the drivers trying to out smart each other. Someone qualifies good but is running light you can jump them. Now except for poor strategy the 1st corner sets up the race

 

[Danish]

Alonso was the bigger danger though

Vettel winning with Alonso third would have given Alonso the title

It therefore made no sense to hobble Webber, because they needed him at the front to deprive Alonso of another place

But Vettel winn and Webber in 2nd also saw Webber winning.

They had no influence on Alonso's race, and I'm damned sure they would have no way of controlling Webber in terms of asking him to play 2nd fiddle and sacrifice his own shot at winning to allow his team mate a clean run to the title.

IMO Red Bull were happy to sacrifice Webber's chances, as good as they were, for a shot at Vettel snagging it. As it stood Alonso f**ked up with a pit stop and they took it out, so well played to them for getting the result they were after.

 

[Jimbo]

But Vettel winn and Webber in 2nd also saw Webber winning.

Unless Alonso was higher than fifth

They had no influence on Alonso's race, and I'm damned sure they would have no way of controlling Webber in terms of asking him to play 2nd fiddle and sacrifice his own shot at winning to allow his team mate a clean run to the title.

IMO Red Bull were happy to sacrifice Webber's chances, as good as they were, for a shot at Vettel snagging it. As it stood Alonso f**ked up with a pit stop and they took it out, so well played to them for getting the result they were after.

If Alonso had finished better than fifth, Vettel would have been out of business

You seem to think that Red Bull would rather Alonso win the Championship than Webber...

 

[Y2Eel]

But Vettel winn and Webber in 2nd also saw Webber winning.

They had no influence on Alonso's race, and I'm damned sure they would have no way of controlling Webber in terms of asking him to play 2nd fiddle and sacrifice his own shot at winning to allow his team mate a clean run to the title.

IMO Red Bull were happy to sacrifice Webber's chances, as good as they were, for a shot at Vettel snagging it. As it stood Alonso f**ked up with a pit stop and they took it out, so well played to them for getting the result they were after.

If Webber had Been in 2nd place the whole race with Alonso in 3rd Vettel would have let Webber pass him for the lead...

But luckily for Vettel Webber was slow and all of Ferrari's thoughts were on Webber not Vettel..

Webber basically lost it during qualifying..

 

[Y2Eel]

They want to try and increase overtaking on the track. They tried it with the failed KERS system, and their newest method is this one of limiting the amount of impact pitting can have on a race so that drivers are forced to overtake each other the old fashioned way.

The problem is that all of the drivers are absolute masters of defensive driving so overtaking is nigh on impossible with the minimal differences between the cars.

Its become very much a race for pole position and then a sprint to the first corner this year.

Personally I love pit stops and the strategy and lottery they bring to racing.

Kers is back next season with the Adjustable rear wing...