Parra
Referee
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But you shouldnt be ashamed.
Of course you shouldn't. But they all are.
A very good indicator that something is not right.
But you shouldnt be ashamed.
rubbish.
you keep ignoring the fact that the police conducted 80 interviews. Matt Johns says it was consensual and then we learn she was bragging about the act and that she even had sex with two union players in a toilet previously.
All this adds up to strong support for Matt Johns and others having done nothing wrong. And when i say nothing i mean NOTHING. Consensual sex is not something to be ashamed of , in any form. You dont necessarily need to be proud of it. But you shouldnt be ashamed.
Consensual sex is not something to be ashamed of , in any form. You dont necessarily need to be proud of it. But you shouldnt be ashamed.
The fact that these is not enough evidence to proceed with a case in these circumstances often means that what took place was consentual.It doesn't even really matter. Police have to satisfy particular criteria when deciding whether or not to press charges. Often they will believe the account of a complainant while not being able to press charges. The fact that charges were not pressed in no way proves that what went on was consensual and above board, just that the police were not able to compile enough evidence to build a case that would withstand the rigours of a court case. That's hardly unusual in cases like this where it's she said/he said (and 'he' in this case refers to 'they' anyway).
dean yes, sassy's post does deserve your praise. probably one of the only 3 good things you have ever said![]()
So how do you reconcile that with the fact that "Clare" is ashamed and so are the players (given everyone except Johns has gone to ground and many who were in Christchurch were falling over themselves to distance themselves from it?)
The fact that these is not enough evidence to proceed with a case in these circumstances often means that what took place was consentual.
A woman has every right to say no and resist, if something of this nature took place and sexual intercouse still took place you would be able to see physical bruising and being a hotel with rooms closeby obviously there would be witnesses hearing the woman screaming for help.
The fact that these elements which happen to be some of the most basic criteria for instances of rape are not present indicates more than likely nothing happened. The woman might not have liked what was going on and was entitled to speak up if that was the case but you cannot blame the players for not being mindreaders.
I'm still amazed that of all the stories put forward on the matter you seem to STILL think Clare's is the only factual one... :?
Of course you shouldn't. But they all are.
A very good indicator that something is not right.
Where does this figure of 80 police interviews come from? I also have only read about the union players on this forum, haven't seen it in the media at all. If anyone has links that'd be appreciated.
THE investigation into the sex scandal that cost disgraced rugby league personality Matthew Johns his job will not be reopened, New Zealand police say.
Johns' media and coaching career is in tatters after the ABC's Four Corners program aired allegations about his involvement in a 2002 group sex incident in Christchurch while he was playing for Cronulla.
Johns was one of several Cronulla players who took part in the act with a 19-year-old woman.
At the time, New Zealand police investigated the woman's claims that the sex was non-consensual, but the investigation cleared all players of wrongdoing.
Detective Inspector David Long, from Christchurch police, said the original investigation involved up to 80 interviews, and was thorough and conclusive.
"I'm completely satisfied that we got full and truthful accounts at the time and that no crime was committed,'' Det Insp Long said.
"There's renewed interest now, obviously from this television program, but there's been no new information whatsoever that's come forward that changes anything.
"So as far as reopening it, it's just not going to happen.''
He said the moral issues around group sex with a teenager were best left to commentators and were not a matter for police.
"There are moral aspects to this ... but these are not for the police to consider when enforcing the law,'' Det Insp Long said.
He also said the woman involved had been in touch with him again recently regarding the case, but that contact had not altered the situation.
Johns has been stood down by the Nine Network and has quit his position as an assistant coach at the Melbourne Storm in light of the recent developments.
He said he was not guilty of abuse, but he was guilty of infidelity and stupidity.
Michaelson,80 is a number,just like 100 or 10,000.We all have our own number based on our particular agenda:lol:
It doesn't even really matter. Police have to satisfy particular criteria when deciding whether or not to press charges. Often they will believe the account of a complainant while not being able to press charges. The fact that charges were not pressed in no way proves that what went on was consensual and above board, just that the police were not able to compile enough evidence to build a case that would withstand the rigours of a court case. That's hardly unusual in cases like this where it's she said/he said (and 'he' in this case refers to 'they' anyway).
THE investigation into the sex scandal that cost disgraced rugby league personality Matthew Johns his job will not be reopened, New Zealand police say.
Johns' media and coaching career is in tatters after the ABC's Four Corners program aired allegations about his involvement in a 2002 group sex incident in Christchurch while he was playing for Cronulla.
Johns was one of several Cronulla players who took part in the act with a 19-year-old woman.
At the time, New Zealand police investigated the woman's claims that the sex was non-consensual, but the investigation cleared all players of wrongdoing.
Detective Inspector David Long, from Christchurch police, said the original investigation involved up to 80 interviews, and was thorough and conclusive.
"I'm completely satisfied that we got full and truthful accounts at the time and that no crime was committed,'' Det Insp Long said.
"There's renewed interest now, obviously from this television program, but there's been no new information whatsoever that's come forward that changes anything.
"So as far as reopening it, it's just not going to happen.''
He said the moral issues around group sex with a teenager were best left to commentators and were not a matter for police.
"There are moral aspects to this ... but these are not for the police to consider when enforcing the law,'' Det Insp Long said.
He also said the woman involved had been in touch with him again recently regarding the case, but that contact had not altered the situation.
Johns has been stood down by the Nine Network and has quit his position as an assistant coach at the Melbourne Storm in light of the recent developments.
He said he was not guilty of abuse, but he was guilty of infidelity and stupidity
Where does this figure of 80 police interviews come from? I also have only read about the union players on this forum, haven't seen it in the media at all. If anyone has links that'd be appreciated.
More Sharks players present during a night of group sex seven years ago have been named as another claim about her involvement in multiple partner intercourse emerge.
Nine News named former Cronulla players Luke Branighan and Daniel Ninness as players who had some form of involvement with the woman, known only as Clare, at the Racecourse Hotel in Christchurch in 2002.
Branighan, who is now playing Super League in the UK, was allegedly in the room when Clare was having sex with former players Matthew Johns and Brett Firman.
When "Clare" gestured for another player to have sex with her after Johns and Firman, Branighan stepped forward.
The woman then reportedly knocked Branighan back and requested Johns to have sex with her again, to which Johns claimed he denied.
Nine News also revealed that former Sharks prop Daniel Ninness was in attendance on the night, but he has denied he participated in the group sex.
"I was present towards the end of the evening," Ninness said in a statement.
"I did not see any of the events said to have occurred and did not participate.
Ninness confirmed he went back to the woman's home after she invited him to do so but did not have sex with her.
Meanwhile another claim about the past of the woman at the centre of the scandal have been reported.
Seven News reports "Clare" once had sex with two rugby union players in a nightclub toilet.
It's the latest in a series of sordid claims related to the woman.
Tania Boyd worked with the then-19-year-old at the Racecourse Hotel in Christchurch and told Nine News she did not appear at all distressed after the incident.(Read more: Sex scandal woman 'bragged about it')
"She was absolutely excited about the fact: she was bragging about it to the staff and quite willing, openly saying how she had sex with several players," Ms Boyd said.
"We were quite disgusted about it ... there was no trauma whatsoever."
The boss of both women at the time says "Clare" was a "decent, stable type with her head screwed on.
Keith Burgess, the woman's manager at the Racecourse Hotel in Christchurch, where the incident occurred, said he had sympathy for the woman but also for the sportsmen involved.(Read more: Woman in NRL scandal was 'decent')
"It's all a big bloody mess, if you ask me," Burgess said.
So how do you reconcile that with the fact that "Clare" is ashamed and so are the players (given everyone except Johns has gone to ground and many who were in Christchurch were falling over themselves to distance themselves from it?)