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NFT-Corby Found Guilty

borat

Bench
Messages
3,511
The Little People said:
She is one of the only people that will ever know if she is guilty or not? If she is - she's put in an amazing academy performance.

Lets get serious? Dope? 20 Years. People in Oz only get 8 years for Murder. If it was Heroin yeah sure.. but the 7 months she has been imprisoned already is sufficient for having dope even if she IS guilty.

All the aid we have given Indonesia? the 9 lives lost in the helicopter crash - the 9 Mules we surrendered to the Bali Government. Marajuana doesnt kill people - Heroin does!

Howard is a pratt sitting on his butt not wanting to upset the political balance. We should call for ALL Australians to now Boycott Bali as a holiday destination immediately!

Who are we to dictate how long the sentences should be in Indonesia. We don't let other countries dictate to us on our laws like drugs, terrorism, murder etc. Surely its up to the citizens of Indonesia to decide what their own punishment to crimes committed in their own country. Maybe Indonesia is tired of being used as a gateway for drug smugglers and got tough.
 
Messages
377
borat said:
Who are we to dictate how long the sentences should be in Indonesia. We don't let other countries dictate to us on our laws like drugs, terrorism, murder etc. Surely its up to the citizens of Indonesia to decide what their own punishment to crimes committed in their own country. Maybe Indonesia is tired of being used as a gateway for drug smugglers and got tough.
We can dictate if we think its unjust. IF AN AUSSIE CITIZEN has been unfairly and unjustly treated its our governments duty to step in and right any wrong.

ps: Howard has been weak here and its time he grew a few balls. He have done Bali enough favours already. Its payback time.

pps: Its also time Howard coughed up the other $30M to finish off Energy Australia Stadium so it too can look at least something like Suncorp.
 

borat

Bench
Messages
3,511
antonius said:
I'm not talking about her being guilty or not, I'm talking about the sentance she got compared with those murdering scum that blew up the night clubs over there, the whole indonesian judicial system is a bloody farce. It you get 20 years for drug smuggling you'd think that smiling assin, and his mates would've been shot. They got what amounts to a slap on the wrist for what they did.

4 are currently on death row including the smiling assasin? Is that serious enough? Bashir got off because they couldn't get a case on him.
 

antonius

Coach
Messages
10,104
borat said:
Who are we to dictate how long the sentences should be in Indonesia. We don't let other countries dictate to us on our laws like drugs, terrorism, murder etc. Surely its up to the citizens of Indonesia to decide what their own punishment to crimes committed in their own country. Maybe Indonesia is tired of being used as a gateway for drug smugglers and got tough.
A Gateway??? they produce most of the stuff themselves FFS. The fact remains that 88 Australians were murdered by a bloke (an Indonesian)that got 18 months jail for it. An Australian citizen was caught with 4KG of dope and gets 20years???? Pleeeeease it's a no contest something is very smelly about a system like that. In the least I would be expecting our esteemed leader (Johnny) to be asking a few questions about the Bombers sentances, but he wont, and we know why he wont, he doesn't want to rock the boat.
 
Messages
377
borat said:
4 are currently on death row including the smiling assasin? Is that serious enough? Bashir got off because they couldn't get a case on him.

You must be a Saint Borat.

Have you ever smoked dope?

Did you have a near death experience?

F&%$ Balinese Laws. Shapelle is an Aussie citizen and should be protected at all costs. The Bali 9 Mules - thats another matter. What they did endangered the lives of hundreds of people. Corbys alleged crime didnt.

End of Story
 

RABK

Referee
Messages
20,694
A man who masterminded the death of 202 people gets 30 months.

Corby gets 20 years for drug smuggling.


Rodney Ardler commits coporate fraud and gets 4 years.

Two days later the four teenagers who killed that 21 year old man by slamming his head into a telegraph pole get 2 years.

Our justice system is just as big a crock of sh*t as their's is.
 

antonius

Coach
Messages
10,104
borat said:
4 are currently on death row including the smiling assasin? Is that serious enough? Bashir got off because they couldn't get a case on him.
How long have they been on death row? The original word was that in Indonesia if your sentanced to death it's carried out within a week. Lets see if they actually get shot. Given the amount of time that's passed I doubt it. As for Bashir, To use your phrase. "He's as guilty as sin" and they know it. In fact he was found guilty. 30 months for planning the thing, that means he murdered them just as sure as if he'd shot them all himself.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005...9700587889.html


Alleged terror leader Abu Bakar Bashir was sentenced today to two and a half years in prison for criminal conspiracy for the 2002 Bali bombings, which killed 202 people, including 88 Australians.
 

borat

Bench
Messages
3,511
antonius said:
A Gateway??? they produce most of the stuff themselves FFS. The fact remains that 88 Australians were murdered by a bloke (an Indonesian)that got 18 months jail for it. An Australian citizen was caught with 4KG of dope and gets 20years???? Pleeeeease it's a no contest something is very smelly about a system like that. In the least I would be expecting our esteemed leader (Johnny) to be asking a few questions about the Bombers sentances, but he wont, and we know why he wont, he doesn't want to rock the boat.

Sorry Tony, I was refering to the bali 9 who were smuggling heroin from Burma. Those are their laws and she chose to take them on. How do you know they produce it themselves? I have never heard of Indosian drug smuggling sydicates, normally thai or Burma etc.

I don't see your point on the bombers. As I said 4 are on death row which is a tougher sentence than they could have got in Australia.

If you are talking about bahsir they just didn't have enough evidence to get him. They still might. They had to prove he was the ring leader which was hard to do when only 1 person implicated him. I hope they do get him.
However plenty of murderers in Australia get off on technicalities or get light sentences. We are far from perfect.
 

borat

Bench
Messages
3,511
antonius said:
How long have they been on death row? The original word was that in Indonesia if your sentanced to death it's carried out within a week. Lets see if they actually get shot. Given the amount of time that's passed I doubt it. As for Bashir, To use your phrase. "He's as guilty as sin" and they know it. In fact he was found guilty. 30 months for planning the thing, that means he murdered them just as sure as if he'd shot them all himself.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005...9700587889.html

Tony people sit on death row in the states for 10-20 years. And we don't have a death penalty so whatever happens they have a worse fate than in either Australia or USA.
 

borat

Bench
Messages
3,511
The Little People said:
You must be a Saint Borat.

Have you ever smoked dope?

Did you have a near death experience?

F&%$ Balinese Laws. Shapelle is an Aussie citizen and should be protected at all costs. The Bali 9 Mules - thats another matter. What they did endangered the lives of hundreds of people. Corbys alleged crime didnt.

End of Story

WTF is that supposed to mean? Have sit down TLP and try to comprehend the difference between having a couple of spliffs and 4.1kgs
 

Alex28

Coach
Messages
11,832
It is an utter disgrace that someone can be found guilty without such basic evidence such as fingerprinting of evidence. A judge in any normal country would not be able to express his opinion on a case on television before the final judgement is made - but thats no problem in Indo.

The Federal Government has let her down incredibly as well - nice of them to offer legal assistance - now! Nice of them to write a letter in her support - once all the evidence has already been presented and it is unadmissable.

I cant believe that someone can be sentanced like that where there is so much doubt in either side of the case. Sure - the defence is basically hear/say, but the proscecution has no real evidence that it was hers and that she placed it in there. I find it hard to believe that Qantas didn't weigh the bag before she checked it in - they weren't charging for excess baggage weight that day? Give me a f***ing break...

It is an utter tragedy whats happened here. Her treatment has been appalling - right down to forcing her through that media scrum after the trial. Where was the "100 police" that were supposed to be guarding her?

Indo has treated Australia with contempt today - after everything we have done for them. Next time they have a tragedy happen over there (which happens pretty often), I'll be thinking of their help of Australians in need before I help them.
 

Alex28

Coach
Messages
11,832
antonius said:
A Gateway??? they produce most of the stuff themselves FFS. The fact remains that 88 Australians were murdered by a bloke (an Indonesian)that got 18 months jail for it. An Australian citizen was caught with 4KG of dope and gets 20years???? Pleeeeease it's a no contest something is very smelly about a system like that. In the least I would be expecting our esteemed leader (Johnny) to be asking a few questions about the Bombers sentances, but he wont, and we know why he wont, he doesn't want to rock the boat.

agree tony - why you would import $40,000 worth of dope into Indo to sell it for $5,000 is beyond me. Out of all those people on death row - how many of them were importing into Indo from a more expensive market?
 

Doctor

Bench
Messages
3,612
Geez, you have to feel sorry for her. She strikes me as an incredibly beautiful and intelligent young lady, who was blessed with a pretty good upbringing. She was, by most accounts, in Bali having a holiday with some friends. Suddenly she's in gaol, facing the death penalty for drug smuggling, and later sentenced to an equally shocking 20-years imprisonment. It just seems out of character, and most Australians seem to agree.

Would she have been found guilty in Australia? No, simply because an Australian court would have given credence to the overwhelming evidence of a drug-racket operating through the international airports in this country. I suspect someone from the Federal Government will cop criticism for not providing sufficient assistance to Corby, by way of evidence of illegal trafficking at the airports. There is no doubt evidence there that wasn't used.

I suppose the problem is that the Indonesian legal system is based on completely different fundamentals compared to ours. There is no presumption of innocence. The task for both sides is to make your case the most compelling -- the best argument wins. And if the courtroom won't pay attention to just about all of the defence's evidence, then you have no hope in hell of avoiding a guilty verdict.

Not only are Indonesian police reknown for their corruption, so too is the legal system I suspect. I wouldn't trust their system with anything. It brings to two the list of countries I won't be visiting:
1. USA -- due to their over-the-top inspections and the presumption that you're a terrorist etc.
2. Indonesia -- pure for the corruption and the farce that is their inadequate legal system.

But this thread isn't about me. It's not about the lessons I have learned about travel. It's about a 20-something Australian, who had no motive and no previous history of anything remotely shadey, being found guilty of a crime she did not commit. I'm told Lindy Chamberlain (who was wrongly convicted of killing her own baby, and later cleared) has sent her best wishes and prayers to Schapelle. I think the only thing I can offer Schapelle is my own thoughts and prayers. This verdict makes me feel terrible in the gut. It makes me very saddened to see her life crippled by all this. 20 years is a long time -- personally I hope the appeals system works better than the normal legal system.

Our thoughts and prayers are with Schapelle.
 

bluesbreaker

Bench
Messages
4,195
Don't know whether she's guilty or innocent - not my place to announce a verdict without knowing what happened - but the sentence is pretty frigging hefty.
 
Messages
377
borat said:
WTF is that supposed to mean? Have sit down TLP and try to comprehend the difference between having a couple of spliffs and 4.1kgs

What I am saying is I would say 60% of people I know still do or have smoked dope at some stage. And it doesnt kill us does it? So I was differntiating between Dope and Heroin. Nobody should get 20 years for anything to do with Marijuana..... even if you grew $1M of it - its not a killer.

Guilty or not guitly 20 years is way too harsh.
 
Messages
10
What disgusts me about the whole Corby saga is how a young woman's personal tragegy was allowed to turn into a media circus. Tell me how did the "worm" help Schapelle's defense? How did plastering her tear-stained face all over the front page of the newpapers day after day help her defense? How did Malcolm Elliott's derogatory remarks about the Indonesian president help her defense?? If you're incensed by the apparently indiscriminating treatment of suspected drug traffickers and suspected terrorists by the Indonesian court, presumably you are similarly offended by the commercial channels' ponderous solemnity in broadcasting the live verdict today: was not that level of national concern only reserved for such events as the Bali bombing trials previously?

The media frenzy did nothing to further Schapelle Corby's cause except to further fuel racial prejudice in our already xenophobic land. Richard Glover says it all:

"When did Australians become such bullies? ...we fume about the Indonesian legal system, and its treatment of Schapelle Corby and, to a lesser extent, the Bali nine. Racist emails circulate attacking the Indonesians, demanding people pledge never to visit, never give aid donations. Their police are derided as stupid, their courts corrupt.

I happen to think Corby is innocent but, if you accept her defence, the authors of her terrible situation are all Australian. Her problems are the result of Australian drug dealers, using Australian baggage handlers to move Australian drugs through Australian airports, aided by the inadequate security set up by Australian airlines.

The crucial evidence that could have saved her was never collected by our own authorities, or was not secured in time to help her. And all this is Indonesia's fault?"

It's time for a little more inward soul-searching and a little less outward, self-righteous finger-pointing.
 

strewth_mate

Bench
Messages
2,989
20 years is certainly a long time, but we've known about Indonesia's policies towards drug smuggling for ages. They found her guilty without any reasonable doubt; her defense had more holes in it than Newcastle's defense though it must be said she was dudded when it came to the supporting evidence available to her. They should have weighed the bags, they should have taken fingerprints, they should have allowed external evidence to be considered, etc. but with the case she did present, there is no surprise whatsoever that she got what she did. I do agree that her story is plausible and she may very well have been wrongly convicted, but it didn't look like that in the face of the case against her and now this has happened.

People over here would applaud Johnny for his unfaltering stance on immigrants because it would give the impression he has integrity (personally it makes me sick). But likewise the Indonesian court is not going to back down from its stance on drugs; it is their law. They do not want drugs being imported, and they want to send a message out, and as such 20 years is not unexpected. We in turn send a message out by destroying huge numbers of lives with our policies. It has got nothing to do with whether or not marijuana is more of a threat than heroin; suffice to say if she'd been caught with heroin she wouldn't be alive come the end of the month. And it's true that the sentences handed down between our countries are poles apart but neither is a good system.

I find it incredibly sad that the media is having a field day with this. The coverage of the verdict today was disgusting and embarrasing. She'll be the headline for another week or so after they appeal next Wednesday then chances are she'll be largely forgotten. It's in her favour that she's a reasonably attractive young caucasian woman cos everyone will support her and there is already a huge media bias on her side. Never mind everyone else who has been treated similarly or worse by the legal system of another country; she's the postergirl.

For some reason, part of me is relieved that Australians didn't get their way as such this time; if this case was in Australia she would have probably got off due to public pressure and media garbage like A Current Affair and Today Tonight. My gripe is that the media seems monumentally biased to the point where it's trivialising her life. But don't get me wrong; I would love to see her acquitted but only for her own sake, not to prove a point. Here's hoping...
 

antonius

Coach
Messages
10,104
borat said:
Tony people sit on death row in the states for 10-20 years. And we don't have a death penalty so whatever happens they have a worse fate than in either Australia or USA.

That's just it though, I don't believe they will ever have their sentance carried out (how long has it been now?). As for Bashir, he was found guilty of conspiring in the bombings,
Alleged terror leader Abu Bakar Bashir was sentenced today to two and a half years in prison for criminal conspiracy for the 2002 Bali bombings, which killed 202 people, including 88 Australians.
the prosecutors originally called for the death sentance, then reduced that to 8 years, the judges sentanced him to 30 months. So I say again, the two sentances are a mile apart when you consider the crimes. I'm not saying she is or isn't guilty, I'm just disgusted at the obvious double standards between her case and Bashir, and I repeat, I reckon the other bombers will get off as well eventually.
 
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