NRL launches touch football premiership

[Stallion]

With respect, you obviously play at a low level though. I have played touch when it had the play the ball with the foot and have also played in competitions that had 1 marker. As soon as you get to any level above park level it is just about impossible to score once you slow the game down. Players at any rep level are just far too strong in defence. The reason it works in tag is you have to remove a tag and not simply touch an attacking player. It's also the reason the number of players on the field was reduced.

For touch to work at an elite level it needs the ability of removing defenders from the defensive line that the dump provides.

I would rid the dump and opt for other avenues like withdrawing players at specific times. It's a real issue. Bad habits are sneaking into rugbyleague players. After all touch came from tippy league. And yes I really enjoyed the play the ball aspect . Playing someone offside is not fun in my opinion. Take players out if need be but playing them to get offside is not in the spirit of what the games rules really aspired to. Perhaps comps with "original touch rules " may be an option? for the tough choice assicuation. It really is missed( the ball with foot rule ) by many ex footballers. It wouldn't do any harm. And it would get guys like me back into touch footy.

 

[unforgiven]

I would rid the dump and opt for other avenues like withdrawing players at specific times. It's a real issue. Bad habits are sneaking into rugbyleague players. After all touch came from tippy league. And yes I really enjoyed the play the ball aspect . Playing someone offside is not fun in my opinion. Take players out if need be but playing them to get offside is not in the spirit of what the games rules really aspired to. Perhaps comps with "original touch rules " may be an option? for the tough choice assicuation. It really is missed( the ball with foot rule ) by many ex footballers. It wouldn't do any harm. And it would get guys like me back into touch footy.

I do understand what you are saying and the comps that I played in with markers and the foot ptb were setup that way for the exact reasons you are describing. The reason the foot ptb was removed was to speed the game up because defences were ruling. I didn't overly enjoy these comps as it was too difficult to create scoring opportunites and were really setup to allow overweight older footballers to compete, I say that as a 110kg 40 year old lol

I prefer the faster game and in honesty you are making light of the skill involved to "play those players offside" as you put it. The aim is to get multiple defenders into the ruck and have the ball on the ground as fast as possible to remove multiple players from the defence.
The skill to attract 2 defenders and dump should not be underestimated.

 

[unforgiven]

I would rid the dump and opt for other avenues like withdrawing pIayers at specific times. It's a real issue. Bad habits are sneaking into rugbyleague players. After all touch came from tippy league. And yes I really enjoyed the play the ball aspect . Playing someone offside is not fun in my opinion. Take players out if need be but playing them to get offside is not in the spirit of what the games rules really aspired to. Perhaps comps with "original touch rules " may be an option? for the tough choice assicuation. It really is missed( the ball with foot rule ) by many ex footballers. It wouldn't do any harm. And it would get guys like me back into touch footy.

Ill also say the reason you enjoy that style of play is that because of the social level you are playing the players you are playing against make mistakes in defence creating those opportunities. The fit young athletes that will be playing in this comp will not make those mistakes unless the speed of the game is increased.

 

[unforgiven]

I would rid the dump and opt for other avenues like withdrawing players at specific times. It's a real issue. Bad habits are sneaking into rugbyleague players. After all touch came from tippy league. And yes I really enjoyed the play the ball aspect . Playing someone offside is not fun in my opinion. Take players out if need be but playing them to get offside is not in the spirit of what the games rules really aspired to. Perhaps comps with "original touch rules " may be an option? for the tough choice assicuation. It really is missed( the ball with foot rule ) by many ex footballers. It wouldn't do any harm. And it would get guys like me back into touch footy.

One other thing that I just remembered, that you may find interesting, was in 1996 I participated in a trial for new rules in touch that they were calling Touch 2000 or some other equally crappy name. It included kicking on the last including that if you could kick from your side of halfway and kick out between two markers 5 mtrs out from the tryline you received a new set of 6.

 

[Stallion]

I do understand what you are saying and the comps that I played in with markers and the foot ptb were setup that way for the exact reasons you are describing. The reason the foot ptb was removed was to speed the game up because defences were ruling. I didn't overly enjoy these comps as it was too difficult to create scoring opportunites and were really setup to allow overweight older footballers to compete, I say that as a 110kg 40 year old lol

I prefer the faster game and in honesty you are making light of the skill involved to "play those players offside" as you put it. The aim is to get multiple defenders into the ruck and have the ball on the ground as fast as possible to remove multiple players from the defence.
The skill to attract 2 defenders and dump should not be underestimated.

To me what you have highlighted as a skill (enticing players into the rich by stealth) is not my idea of a footy related skill. If you have any input I would suggest that an Original touch option be revisited for touch. Think you will gain plenty of people playing tag back to touch . Just a positive suggestion from a tag player whom used to play touch.

 

[unforgiven]

To me what you have highlighted as a skill (enticing players into the rich by stealth) is not my idea of a footy related skill. If you have any input I would suggest that an Original touch option be revisited for touch. Think you will gain plenty of people playing tag back to touch . Just a positive suggestion from a tag player whom used to play touch.

Drawing 2 players into the ruck is most definitely a football skill and is definitely not done by stealth, it is usually accomplished through footwork and agility which are both football skills.

The problem you re having here is you are talking about changes that will bring more social players to the game, and I agree that yes social players prefer those aspects. We however are not talking about the game at the social level here, this thread is about an elite competition and the changes you are suggesting would have a negative impact at the elite level.

 

[Stallion]

Drawing 2 players into the ruck is most definitely a football skill and is definitely not done by stealth, it is usually accomplished through footwork and agility which are both football skills.

The problem you re having here is you are talking about changes that will bring more social players to the game, and I agree that yes social players prefer those aspects. We however are not talking about the game at the social level here, this thread is about an elite competition and the changes you are suggesting would have a negative impact at the elite level.

? I think we are discussing touch football and is did have the play the ball it's necessarily relevant. Touch football can do far worse than ignore the multitude of players that enjoyed the subtle ruck challenges faced in the games original rules of playing the ball with the foot. Think it's worth revisiting for sure. Even if its a complementary form called ORIGINAL TOUCH FOOTBALL. You would see plenty of players coming back. And elite touch footy is still achievable with a concentration on play the ball skills. You have isolated foot movement as a skill and negated the effects of guile and skills around the ruck.

 

[T-Boon]

One other thing that I just remembered, that you may find interesting, was in 1996 I participated in a trial for new rules in touch that they were calling Touch 2000 or some other equally crappy name. It included kicking on the last including that if you could kick from your side of halfway and kick out between two markers 5 mtrs out from the tryline you received a new set of 6.

Have they ever looked at allowing short kicks? I think a rule allowing kicks provided the ball does not hit the ground could work well and potentially allow for line breaks. If the ball does hit the ground it is a turn over from where the play the ball happened. The defense would need to play with a sweeper and that would create a potential overlap.

 

[Perth Red]

Given its popualirty and growth around the world what they’ve got is clearly working, why change something that isnt broken? Just change its name to trl and make sure everyone playing it knows and feels like they are playing a version of RL.

 

[unforgiven]

? I think we are discussing touch football and is did have the play the ball it's necessarily relevant. Touch football can do far worse than ignore the multitude of players that enjoyed the subtle ruck challenges faced in the games original rules of playing the ball with the foot. Think it's worth revisiting for sure. Even if its a complementary form called ORIGINAL TOUCH FOOTBALL. You would see plenty of players coming back. And elite touch footy is still achievable with a concentration on play the ball skills. You have isolated foot movement as a skill and negated the effects of guile and skills around the ruck.

This thread is about the NRL Touch Premiership, introducing playing the ball with the foot would make that competition unwatchable as most games would be 0-0 results. I understand why you enjoy the being slowed down and at the social level it is still quite enjoyable to play, but it wont work at an elite level as the players are far too strong in defence.

 

[unforgiven]

Have they ever looked at allowing short kicks? I think a rule allowing kicks provided the ball does not hit the ground could work well and potentially allow for line breaks. If the ball does hit the ground it is a turn over from where the play the ball happened. The defense would need to play with a sweeper and that would create a potential overlap.

Yeah the Touch 2000 trials I participated in while playing for the Hunter Hornets included short kicks on the last tackle, I think they were trialling this to address the rise of Oztag in the 90's hence the introduction of kicking. The biggest draw of Oztag though are the points that Stallion have been raising in this thread.
and the new rules did not address that at all.

 

[Stallion]

This thread is about the NRL Touch Premiership, introducing playing the ball with the foot would make that competition unwatchable as most games would be 0-0 results. I understand why you enjoy the being slowed down and at the social level it is still quite enjoyable to play, but it wont work at an elite level as the players are far too strong in defence.

Not my point. I do think their should be an avenue for original touch football rules to be played. And variations such as being able to kick in play would open up the game even more and a proper play the ball would add to the contest. We differ and I appreciate your honest appraisalso. But my option would gain back plenty of ex footballers. Ignoring this as a valid strategy to entice players back to touch football is dissappointing. From my point of view, I would revisit touch footy if the ruck rules avoided the run and dump process. You agree this is so but don't mention the positivity associated with an ORIGINAL TOUCH FOOTY competition version being reintroduced complementing what you call the 'elite version' of run and dump.

 

[T-Boon]

Yeah the Touch 2000 trials I participated in while playing for the Hunter Hornets included short kicks on the last tackle, I think they were trialling this to address the rise of Oztag in the 90's hence the introduction of kicking. The biggest draw of Oztag though are the points that Stallion have been raising in this thread.
and the new rules did not address that at all.

I don't know why they wanted to insist on it only being on the last tackle. In touch that is usually on the opposition try line and the attack is awesome down there. They should allow the short kicks only from within own half because it is there that it is a little bit predictable and one out.

 

[unforgiven]

Not my point. I do think their should be an avenue for original touch football rules to be played. And variations such as being able to kick in play would open up the game even more and a proper play the ball would add to the contest. We differ and I appreciate your honest appraisalso. But my option would gain back plenty of ex footballers. Ignoring this as a valid strategy to entice players back to touch football is dissappointing. From my point of view, I would revisit touch footy if the ruck rules avoided the run and dump process. You agree this is so but don't mention the positivity associated with an ORIGINAL TOUCH FOOTY competition version being reintroduced complementing what you call the 'elite version' of run and dump.

Definitely agree that it would bring players such as yourself back to playing touch, it may also stop others from playing, I have stated all along that I can see the points you are raising in that regard. When you raised the suggestion of adding the foot back to the play the ball, it was a whole sport change you were promoting. I simple stated I'd prefer for it to remain the same as it would have a negative impact on touch at an elite level, which is what this thread is about.

I did play in competitions in the Hunter that were closer aligned to older touch football rules until around the mid 2000's. Aberdeen Touch had the traditional play the ball and markers until around this time.

I'm not calling touch with the rollball as an "elite version", so please do not attribute that to me. I do however believe that removing the rollball will damage the sport at a representative (elite) level. There was a reason the rollball was introduced, what do you think the reasoning would have been?

 

[unforgiven]

I don't know why they wanted to insist on it only being on the last tackle. In touch that is usually on the opposition try line and the attack is awesome down there. They should allow the short kicks only from within own half because it is there that it is a little bit predictable and one out.

No idea, I was plying under 20's reps at the time and they had us trialling it, so never really heard the reasoning behind it. Thinking about it now they may have allowed kicking after the 4th tackle. I'm sure they have trialled other variations in rules over the years, including kicking.

 

[unforgiven]

I also want to state that I'm not trying to be disrespectful and I understand your point of view, I just don't 100% agree with it

 

[Stallion]

Definitely agree that it would bring players such as yourself back to playing touch, it may also stop others from playing, I have stated all along that I can see the points you are raising in that regard. When you raised the suggestion of adding the foot back to the play the ball, it was a whole sport change you were promoting. I simple stated I'd prefer for it to remain the same as it would have a negative impact on touch at an elite level, which is what this thread is about.

I did play in competitions in the Hunter that were closer aligned to older touch football rules until around the mid 2000's. Aberdeen Touch had the traditional play the ball and markers until around this time.

I'm not calling touch with the rollball as an "elite version", so please do not attribute that to me. I do however believe that removing the rollball will damage the sport at a representative (elite) level. There was a reason the rollball was introduced, what do you think the reasoning would have been?

The reason was to play people offside from my view. It negated a significant skill / discipline aspect that was fundamental to the games original rules.I'm advocating an original touch footy version to compliment the current version. That option would bring players back to touch. And alot more whom are unaware of the intricasies etablished involved with ruck play would gain a new appreciation of touch that is currently lost with touch nowadays. This will have touch even more closely alligned with rugby league where it's origins are at. I also think the kick is underutilized in touch which would complement the original version if given a chance. Guile and skills at the ruck plus discipline is being missed in the current format. Just would enjoy that option back in touch. I understand your standpoint and you are decent and respectful enough to see the original touch attraction. It does matter. And I think it would be great for touch and rugby league to have both going forward.
As an anecdote to this point, I introduced original rules into a touch footy game which was a bit of an initial discipline shock to these young touch footy players. The players soon appreciated the skill and discipline involved. The game was enjoyable but with subtle ruck variations that added to the spice of the contest. The boys particularly liked and appreciated the "old school"rules.

 

[unforgiven]

The reason was to play people offside from my view. It negated a significant skill / discipline aspect that was fundamental to the games original rules.I'm advocating an original touch footy version to compliment the current version. That option would bring players back to touch. And alot more whom are unaware of the intricasiestablished involved with ruck play would gain a new appreciation of touch that is currently lost with touch nowadays. This will have touch even more closely alligned with rugby league where it's origins are at. I also think the kick is underutilized in touch which would complement the original version if given a chance. Guile and skills at the ruck plus discipline is being missed in the current format. Just would enjoy that option back in touch. I understand your standpoint and you are decent and respectful enough to see the original touch attraction. It does matter. And I think it would be great for touch and rugby league to have both going forward.

Believe me as I get older (fatter) I definitely see the advantages of slowing the game down. I just think its a negative step for the game of touch.

Interestingly this is not the first time touch has been a major leadup game in Rugby league, in 1976 it was played as a curtain raiser to the Grand Final.

 

[Stallion]

Believe me as I get older (fatter) I definitely see the advantages of slowing the game down. I just think its a negative step for the game of touch.

Interestingly this is not the first time touch has been a major leadup game in Rugby league, in 1976 it was played as a curtain raiser to the Grand Final.

With original rules no doubt. . Just think that touch could entertain ORIGINAL TOUCH as an option to its current format. It would really make touch truelly inclusive and far more rugby league alligned.

 

[unforgiven]

With original rules no doubt. . Just think that touch could entertain ORIGINAL TOUCH as an option to its current format. It would really make touch truelly inclusive and far more rugby league alligned.

Maybe someone should organise a league unlimited forum touch football day, we could even play under the old rules.