NSW Game 2 team

[NSW of Origin]

Scott plays left centre for the Dragons so i'm sure he is capable of playing left in the backrow. Scott can also play tight in the middle with Bird shifting left. Also saying Watmough prefers left is a stretch - 95% of his runs are straight up the middle.

I'm sure Stuart will look to accomodate Scott into the side. The biggest problem is not who plays what side but how we give each player enough minutes. But keeping our backrowers to 30-50 minute stints enables us to have that fast line speed which we dominated QLD with in game 1.

Point is, G Stewart and Scott are right sided players and you had them in your starting team where one will need to defend on the left. If you have four players who play a similar role with 2 who predominantly play right every week, and 2 who are more familiar with the left, then you play them in those positions.

You are wrong about Scott. He was the right centre when Gaz was running around in pink in France, and became the right forward when he came back. Cooper has been left centre for the Dragons for as long as anyone can remember.

The majority of 'backrow' forwards take runs up the middle, not just Watmough. In defence, he lines up inside TRex at Manly. He is 5th man in from the left. He is practically in the middle here and the majority of his set attacking play is on the left. It's why I said 'generally'. G Stewart is on the right.

I said Lewis 'prefers' the left. He can play anywhere, but this is where he plays his best football and is most comfortable, and he has a combination on the left with Jennings both at Penrith and for NSW.

 

[Fire]

Yeah not trying to be a smartarse RABK but Scott plays right side for us. The left side under Bennett was always Morris, Cooper and Creagh.

 

[Tiger Hawk]

Scott plays right for St George to protect Soward.

Stewart plays right for Manly, Williams left and Watmough tight, although does roam to both edges. Williams also will play tight on the odd occasion. Stewart pretty much sticks to his right.

Woods looked pretty impressive against both Scott and Tamou, admittedly both were backing up. Have a feeling he'll get a call up as he's had back to back monster games (197 metres p/game) against big packs and played big minutes (66 yesterday and 72 against the Warriors). What's the deal with Watmough - is he injured? That would make Sims, Williams & Watmough all out of contention, so I'd be willing to bet the bench will be Buhrer, Creagh, Merrin & Woods (would still prefer no Buhrer and no Creagh).

 

[Hutty1986]

Scott plays right for St George to protect Soward.

Stewart plays right for Manly, Williams left and Watmough tight, although does roam to both edges. Williams also will play tight on the odd occasion. Stewart pretty much sticks to his right.

Woods looked pretty impressive against both Scott and Tamou, admittedly both were backing up. Have a feeling he'll get a call up as he's had back to back monster games (197 metres p/game) against big packs and played big minutes (66 yesterday and 72 against the Warriors). What's the deal with Watmough - is he injured? That would make Sims, Williams & Watmough all out of contention, so I'd be willing to bet the bench will be Buhrer, Creagh, Merrin & Woods (would still prefer no Buhrer and no Creagh).

Choc came off with another 'burner' to his arm yesterday.. not sure there's been any word yet as to whether he'll miss any games

 

[betcats]

You're losing your shit if you think Beau Scott deserves to be there.......

He's been terrible this year.

Worse then Boyd?

 

[Tiger Hawk]

Choc came off with another 'burner' to his arm yesterday.. not sure there's been any word yet as to whether he'll miss any games

Well that's two in three games then so the question is would you risk him? If he cops another and can't continue in Origin, should he be there? If he says he's fit I'd include him personally.

 

[Joker's Wild]

You're losing your shit if you think Beau Scott deserves to be there.......

He's been terrible this year.

Boyd
Hayne
Jennings
Bird (early on)

All have been in terrible form this year yet stepped up when selected for game 1

Club form means shit when a player has proven SOO performances under their belts

 

[Deleted member 10972]

I do agree that Origin form should take precedence over club form - Scott has always been a proven performer. However, like it was mentioned, Scott plays on the right much like Stewart, and I don't think its fair to drop Stewart, who is playing quite well. Scott offers more starch in defense, definitely, but without someone like Lyon hovering on our right edge, we need someone with the ball skills to operate effectively on that edge. Stewart fulfills this role well.

Lewis on the left, Stewart on the right, Bird up the guts with his offloading game is a very effective and strong back row.

 

[Hutty1986]

Well that's two in three games then so the question is would you risk him? If he cops another and can't continue in Origin, should he be there? If he says he's fit I'd include him personally.

That's my concern, I was thinking it's pretty worrying when it's happened twice in fairly quick succession. If he pulls up okay, he'd have to be a lock-in for a bench spot. He's too damaging to leave out, esp in a must-win game

 

[RABK]

I thought when Cooper has been out, which as always is often, Scott has played quite a bit of left centre for you. Maybe i am wrong but i think im not.

 

[Deleted member 10972]

These are the highest metre-eating NSW props available.f

#1 - James Tamou - 11 games, 185 runs for 1739 metres, average 17 runs for 158 metres (5 offloads, 3 linebreaks, 1 tries)
#2 - Tim Grant - 6 games, 104 runs for 875 metres, average 17 runs for 146 metres (1 offloads)
#3 - Trent Merrin - 11 games, 183 runs for 1515 metres, average 17 runs for 138 metres (21 offloads, 1 linebreaks)
#4 - Aaron Woods - 11 games, 173 runs for 1460 metres, average 16 runs for 133 metres (14 offloads)
#5 - Keith Galloway - 7 games, 107 runs for 915 metres, average 15 runs for 131 metres (5 offloads)
#6 - Aiden Tolman (not including tonights game) - 11 games, 174 runs for 1338 metres, average 16 runs for 122 metres (5 offloads)
#7 - Bryce Gibbs - 8 games, 108 runs for 960 metres, average 14 runs for 120 metres (7 offloads)
#8 - Kade Snowden - 11 games, 162 runs for 1310 metres, average 15 runs for 119 metres (12 offloads, 1 linebreaks)
#9 - Tim Mannah - 11 games, 137 runs for 1261 metres, average 12 runs for 115 metres (5 offloads, 1 linebreaks, 1 tries)
#10 - Jason King - 11 games, 143 runs for 1165 metres, average 13 runs for 106 metres (13 offloads, 1 linebreaks, 1 tries)
#11 - Luke Douglas - 11 games, 133 runs for 1103 metres, average 12 runs for 100 metres (7 offloads)
#12 - Tom Learoyd-Lahrs - 10 games, 109 runs for 966 metres, average 11 runs for 97 metres (2 offloads, 1 linebreaks)
#13 - Mick Weyman - 10 games, 114 runs for 956 metres, average 11 runs for 96 metres (8 offloads, 2 linebreaks, 2 tries)
#14 - Andrew Fifita - 10 games, 105 runs for 876 metres, average 11 runs for 88 metres (5 offloads, 1 linebreaks, 1 tries)
#15 - Dan Hunt - 10 games, 115 runs for 866 metres, average 12 runs for 87 metres (4 offloads, 1 linebreaks, 1 tries)

 

[RABK]

Point is, G Stewart and Scott are right sided players and you had them in your starting team where one will need to defend on the left. If you have four players who play a similar role with 2 who predominantly play right every week, and 2 who are more familiar with the left, then you play them in those positions.

You are wrong about Scott. He was the right centre when Gaz was running around in pink in France, and became the right forward when he came back. Cooper has been left centre for the Dragons for as long as anyone can remember.

The majority of 'backrow' forwards take runs up the middle, not just Watmough. In defence, he lines up inside TRex at Manly. He is 5th man in from the left. He is practically in the middle here and the majority of his set attacking play is on the left. It's why I said 'generally'. G Stewart is on the right.

I said Lewis 'prefers' the left. He can play anywhere, but this is where he plays his best football and is most comfortable, and he has a combination on the left with Jennings both at Penrith and for NSW.

Yes that's all well and good but the players are not bolted to treadmills that allow them to run along one side of the field only.

Bird shifted to running the left during Origin and looked very dangerous doing so.

Fact is guys like Lewis, Bird, Watmough and Stewart all roam and are capable of playing in tight or on the fringe in both attack and defence. Yes it's nice to play a guy where he plays 90% of his club football but look at Josh Morris. Sometimes it's just about fitting the best players in. Btw Lewis did shit all on the left fringe. It was Bird shifting left that gave Jennings all the space in the second half.

I like to get into strategy more than any other poster in regards to positioning of players, set plays etc but i can assure you these backrowers can handle playing on a different blade of glass than what your whiteboards might suggest.

I agree that Lewis, Bird, Stewart is a good backrow but you're stupid if you don't think Stuart won't try to fit Scott in if he remains healthy. He would have been first backrower chosen by Stuart a month ago.

 

[RABK]

I'm yet to get the Luke Lewis love as well. Hugely ineffective like Creagh at Origin level yet gets a free ride as some sort of rep God deserving of unquestionable selection. Has Lewis ever made more than 70m in a rep game?

I'd like to see him actually make or assist in a line break before declaring him some sort of left side Origin specialist.

 

[Fire]

I thought when Cooper has been out, which as always is often, Scott has played quite a bit of left centre for you. Maybe i am wrong but i think im not.

Maybe in two or three games of the past three years. Usually Kyle Stanley fills in on the left.

Talking about Coops being injured regularly, we can't afford to lose him along with Young and Hornby this year. Hope he stays injury free now.

 

[Tiger Hawk]

Lewis turned the game for us when he came on last year in game 2 IMO. However I agree he was very average in game 1. I'm reluctant to make changes to the starting XIII however I would go for Lewis to replace Buhrer on the bench and start Bird, Stewart & Watmough (if Watmough was fit that is).

 

[Hutty1986]

I'm yet to get the Luke Lewis love as well. Hugely ineffective like Creagh at Origin level yet gets a free ride as some sort of rep God deserving of unquestionable selection. Has Lewis ever made more than 70m in a rep game?

I'd like to see him actually make or assist in a line break before declaring him some sort of left side Origin specialist.

Glenn Stewart is a bigger concern imo, he looked completely confused and option-less (definitely a technical term) in game one

 

[RABK]

Glenn Stewart got the ball too early and deep which allowed QLD to slide. So he just ran back into the ruck to find metres instead of trying to ball play to Morris.

If Carney does his job properly in Game 2 we'll see him run to the line, commit defenders and give Stewart ball at the line which won't allow QLD to slide as well and give Stewart more ball playing options.

 

[Boganater]

Glenn Stewart is a bigger concern imo, he looked completely confused and option-less (definitely a technical term) in game one

Exactly, if Lewis has supposedly been quiet then Stewart has been a dead set corpse in a blue jersey.

 

[Hutty1986]

Glenn Stewart got the ball too early and deep which allowed QLD to slide. So he just ran back into the ruck to find metres instead of trying to ball play to Morris.

If Carney does his job properly in Game 2 we'll see him run to the line, commit defenders and give Stewart ball at the line which won't allow QLD to slide as well and give Stewart more ball playing options.

Carney will need to lift big time for us to win game 2, he was completely MIA. Stewart was that cramped for room all night, hopefully there's plenty of improvement on the way for us in Sydney

 

[NSW of Origin]

Yes that's all well and good but the players are not bolted to treadmills that allow them to run along one side of the field only.

Bird shifted to running the left during Origin and looked very dangerous doing so.

Fact is guys like Lewis, Bird, Watmough and Stewart all roam and are capable of playing in tight or on the fringe in both attack and defence. Yes it's nice to play a guy where he plays 90% of his club football but look at Josh Morris. Sometimes it's just about fitting the best players in. Btw Lewis did shit all on the left fringe. It was Bird shifting left that gave Jennings all the space in the second half.

I like to get into strategy more than any other poster in regards to positioning of players, set plays etc but i can assure you these backrowers can handle playing on a different blade of glass than what your whiteboards might suggest.

I agree that Lewis, Bird, Stewart is a good backrow but you're stupid if you don't think Stuart won't try to fit Scott in if he remains healthy. He would have been first backrower chosen by Stuart a month ago.

I love talking strategy and tactics. Most people think that rugby league is just one out barge and that players must be noticed to be doing something good, but a lot of shit goes on unnoticed where players are effectively doing their job.

At NRL and Origin level, specialisation is becoming the difference maker amongst athletes that are more even in ability in the professional era.

There are players who are versatile and can play around the field without losing much of their impact, but many players are having a preferred side, depending on the side they can pass better on, the leg they lead on to take the first step, etc. When players play a certain side or position weekly then this becomes their strength and as much as they say that they'll play anywhere as long as they get a jersey, they all have a strength which is enhanced from regularity and familiarity. This might not be as important in attack for forwards although it can affect the leg they may like to step off onto the inside (more important for the centre), but it is paramount in defence where sliding and the first step is crucial.

Now when trying to put together a team that can beat one such as this QLD team, playing players in roles that they are used to is extremely important because the Maroons have had their combinations set and players in the roles & sides they are on for years. You don't see Inglis and Hodges swapping sides, or Thaiday moving from the right to play on Harrison's left etc. The role they play is familiar to them and this means that they don't need to be re-educated on this each time they come into camp.

I was loathe to bring up J Morris because I've already singled him out as the main cause for QLDs two tries in Game 1 in other threads, but I can't let you use him as an example to support your point without arguing that it was a poor decision to play him at right centre. QLD targeted the NSW right edge and came up trumps because:
(a) It was yet another new combination in opposition to QLD's steady left-side one of Harrison-Inglis-Boyd with Slater chiming in. last year for NSW, it was Uate-Gasnier-Soward-Scott, this year it is Uate-J Morris-Carney-G Stewart. They have rarely played with each other;
(b) J Morris is a predominantly a left side player;
(c) J Morris would be so preoccupied with stopping Inglis and sliding right to defend an attacking move would be unfamiliar to him that he would abandon the basic defensive move.

On both occasions, QLD used Inglis to lure J Morris as the decoy, J Morris stopped the slide and joined G Stewart and Carney (who continued to slide right) in covering Inglis, and the overlap was generated leaving Uate to deal with the overlap.

Chris Lawrence would've been a better choice at right centre as it is a position he is extremely familiar with week in-week out.

Finally, the constant deriding of NSW players' performances after one match is another issue that hampers the progress of the NSW Origin team. Invariably, it leads to changes, which leads to new combinations which leads to another weakness, which leads to more re-educating in the week prior to the game. Lewis wasn't on fire in attack, but he was solid with the familiar left-side combo of Hayne-Jennings-Pearce-Lewis in defence. Hodges did f**k all in Game 1 and was exposed in defence too so should he now be dumped onto the bench or moved to the left-side, etc?

If there are too many players that play the similar side or role then this unbalances the team. The four you selected are 2 predominantly right-side and 2 predominantly left-side forwards which is good and is balanced. So I don't argue against the choice of your players so much as they need to be played in the roles that strengthen the team overall.