OT: Current Affairs and Politics

[the phantom menace]

 

[the phantom menace]

 

[the phantom menace]

Done a decent job stirring you

You made the posts about Labour

Not sure I did tonight (other than to argue that the referendum isn't party political)... but when I do, I spell it correctly - Labor

Btw here is your Favourite First Nation Person

https://www.news.com.au/national/voice-referendum-jacinta-nampijinpa-price-is-real-winner-of-the-vote-as-she-becomes-major-political-star/news-story/df9fc4ba616449eed553dbc14c4fd4ba

Yes, I watched her speech with Dutton tonight.

As I'd previously replied to Avenger, she's handled herself well during the campaign (better than loose unit Lydia Thorpe or Labor's Linda Burney) and the future is in her hands... Just a pity she seems a(nother) privileged conservative with nothing new to bring to the table to help her people.

 

[TheRam]

@TheRam do you like a slice of ham and pineapple pizza?

Who doesn't like a classic Ham and Pineapple pizza Hindy? Is that a trick Question? The cheesy salty fatty ham and then the sweet acidity of the pineapple to cut it up and balance the whole thing. Freakin awesome!

Mmmm....

Oh damn. Now see what you have done? Made me hanker for a pizza at this time of night. Damn!

Different thoughts, different thoughts...

Oh yeah...Viva La NO VOTE!!!!

Yee ha all you Yes vote suckers!

I love a good gloat.

Night all.

 

[JokerEel]

Not sure I did tonight (other than to argue that the referendum isn't party political)... but when I do, I spell it correctly - Labor

Yes, I watched her speech with Dutton tonight.

As I'd previously replied to Avenger, she's handled herself well during the campaign (better than loose unit Lydia Thorpe or Labor's Linda Burney) and the future is in her hands... Just a pity she seems a(nother) privileged conservative with nothing new to bring to the table to help her people.

bitter pill to swallow mate hey..

I love when there is a first nation person in power that isn't on the same side as the wanker whinging about them they pull out the privileged card

I guess she brings the same to the table as every other politician then

 

[the phantom menace]

bitter pill to swallow mate hey..

It's actually not... since it's not the quality of my life that was impacted by how we as a country voted today. See the two posts of Rachel Perkins statement above re impacts on the people that matter in all this.

I love when there is a first nation person in power that isn't on the same side as the wanker whinging about them they pull out the privileged card

I never said any other Indigenous Senator (Thorpe, Burney) wasn't equally privileged. But we were talking about whether Price is representative on NT Indigenous people... my main criticism is while she spoke succinctly during campaigning for her views, as a conservative she isn't bringing anything new to the table (that hasn't been tried and failed before) to try and improve the issues there.

I guess she brings the same to the table as every other politician then

Well, that's probably a fair enough call generally...

 

[JokerEel]

It's actually not... since it's not the quality of my life that was impacted by how we as a country voted today. See the two posts of Rachel Perkins statement above re impacts on the people that matter in all this.

I never said any other Indigenous Senator (Thorpe, Burney) wasn't equally privileged. But we were talking about whether Price is representative on NT Indigenous people... my main criticism is while she spoke succinctly during campaigning for her views, as a conservative she isn't bringing anything new to the table (that hasn't been tried and failed before) to try and improve the issues there.

Well, that's probably a fair enough call generally...

I doubt it changed your life I'll assume your in one of the electoral seats that had more yes votes...

Probably should have explained how the voice was going to be a real change...

Might have changed alot of people's opinions..

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

My electorate seems to have beaten the national average of No voters.

BBC reported the decision. Not quite right, but close:


I must say, I didn’t like Albos appeal that we should vote yes because it will reflect badly on us overseas. That was one of the reasons he gave. Pretty awful.

Right up there with “ Don’t know, vote No” which being a call to ignorance was embarrassing for the No campaign.

Flies in the face of the composed and thoughtful society we aspire to be.

 

[the phantom menace]

I doubt it changed your life I'll assume your in one of the electoral seats that had more yes votes...

Exactly why it's not a hard pill for me to swallow. I'm not Indigenous, it doesn't impact me. But yes my area voted 60% Yes.

Probably should have explained how the voice was going to be a real change...

Might have changed alot of people's opinions..

Yes, the Yes campaign didn't explain the reason this Voice proposal could result in better outcomes well enough for the majority to agree... as seemed pretty obvious for a while, against the combined powers of Murdoch, Gina, Clive, Pauline, Dutton...

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

There were a lot of holes in the Yes proposal, but i guess it remained truthful to the broader symbolic value.

Calling it a voice was a mistake because that assumes there is no existing voice.

But this kind of symbolic stuff, permeates a lot of what we see and read. Details are hidden or dispensed with. Sometimes even forgotten about.

If it had been called an indigenous council or something less emotive, it might have fared better.

 

[JokerEel]

Well in the end it was a fruitless exercise by Albo and it hasn't put us forward and has divided us even more... Well done Albo

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

Well in the end it was a fruitless exercise by Albo and it hasn't put us forward and has divided us even more... Well done Albo

I tend to agree with that blunt assessment.

Half a billion dollars, that’s $650 for every indigenous person In Australia.

You could otherwise have spent the dough on hospitals, schools, creating businesses, alternatives to gaol, police, farms, cultural things, social workers, land, housing, roads, farms, political lobbyists, tech and other beneficial things for the most needy and remote of our indigenous people.

Just invest it and you’ve got interest to try to help struggling indigenous families for decades to come.

Even work out the detail and hold a referendum at a better time. Educate the public slowly and buffer them from scare campaigns.

Albo bit off more than he could chew, entirely out of his depth. Doesn’t make him bad or anything. These things happen.

$18.50 for each Australian.

For some people, that’s $18.50 more than they’ve got tonight.

All as it turns out, pissed up against the wall. This country scares me sometimes.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Your unsolicited attack on me last night was noted Gary.

I expect an apology at some stage today.

You were giffed.

 

[Gronk]

He can pardon himself and once it’s done it’s double jeopardy.

He can only pardon himself from federal charges. He his facing jail time for state offences.

 

[Gronk]

Only for fed shit, he can't do shit about the state shit.

Mind he aint going to jail anyways, guilty or not, that just isn't how shit works.

FFS

 

[Gronk]

I tend to agree with that blunt assessment.

Half a billion dollars, that’s $650 for every indigenous person In Australia.

You could otherwise have spent the dough on hospitals, schools, creating businesses, alternatives to gaol, police, farms, cultural things, social workers, land, housing, roads, farms, political lobbyists, tech and other beneficial things for the most needy and remote of our indigenous people.

Just invest it and you’ve got interest to try to help struggling indigenous families for decades to come.

Even work out the detail and hold a referendum at a better time. Educate the public slowly and buffer them from scare campaigns.

Albo bit off more than he could chew, entirely out of his depth. Doesn’t make him bad or anything. These things happen.

$18.50 for each Australian.

For some people, that’s $18.50 more than they’ve got tonight.

All as it turns out, pissed up against the wall. This country scares me sometimes.

This type of pile on, cash and division, will be Dutton’s bread and butter for a while. Ask the majority of indigenous people if this offering of reconciliation was a waste of time.

Truth be told Dutton wasted cash like it grew on trees when he was Home Affairs Minister. Need I remind you the ridiculous amount (nearly 8 figures) he spent against the Biloela family, even more on reopening Christmas Island and fighting in court bring sick refugees to AU from Nauru.

Personally I can stand tall that my electorate of Wentworth and those adjoining of Kingsford Smith, Grayndler and Sydney all voted yes. Others will need to reflect on what brought them to vote no, when polling was once suggesting a positive result.

Fact check: Do the polls show that Indigenous support for the Voice is between 80 and 90 per cent?

Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has claimed surveys show Indigenous Australians support the Voice at a rate between 80 and 90 per cent. Is that correct? RMIT ABC Fact Check investigates.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Gronk]

Australia rejects constitutional reform to recognise Indigenous people​

The proposal did not garner enough votes among the country’s six states, nor an overall majority with its population.

Australians have resoundingly rejected a proposed reformto the country’s constitution that would recognise Indigenous people, a referendum’s results have shown.

With most of the vote counted on Saturday, it became clear that the “Yes” votes have failed to reach the required threshold with the goal of creating an Indigenous advisory body called the “Indigenous Voice to Parliament”.

Those opposed to the reforms led those in favour 60 percent to 40 percent, with all but one of the six states that needed to also be in favour actually voting to reject the proposal.

The highest number of yes votes were registered in Victoria with 46 percent, with Queensland seeing the lowest at 32 percent.

However, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese defended his decision to push for a referendum, and said “We must seek a new way forward with the same optimism.”

“Tonight is not the end of the road and is certainly not the end of our efforts to bring people together,” he said.

The Indigenous citizens in Australia make up about 3.8 percent of the country’s population of 26 million, and have inhabited the land for some 65,000 years. But they are not mentioned in the constitution, and are believed to be some of the most economically disadvantaged people in the country.

Supporters of the proposal to make changes to the country’s 122-year constitution believe adding an Indigenous voice to the document would help reconcile the country, but opponents have called it divisive and ineffective.

Misinformation implications​

From the 44 referendums that have been held in Australia since its founding in 1901, only eight have successfully passed. This is the first referendum in Australia since voters rejected a proposal to become a republic almost a quarter of a century ago.

The vote on Saturday may also have implications for misinformation in Australia, as a large campaign had spread through social media prior to the vote that sparked fears that the Indigenous Voice to Parliament – a purely advisory body – would become a third chamber of parliament and bring Aboriginal people more federal funding.

Albanese also touched on this and criticised sections of the media that he said had steered the referendum debate away from the core issues.

“We have had, including in outlets represented in this room, discussions about a range of things that were nothing to do with what was on the ballot paper tonight,” the prime minister told reporters on Saturday.

Australia rejects constitutional reform to recognise Indigenous people

The proposal did not garner enough votes among the country’s six states, nor an overall majority with its population.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[Avenger]

If indigenous people make up 3.8% of the population and wanted a voice to parliament could some people who identify themselves by religion rather than ethnicity try and do the same when the become a significant minority, say 10% or more?

What’s stopping them applying pressure to the government?

 

[Happy MEel]

Perhaps.

But it's worth remembering that when announced poll support for the voice was like 65-70%, that's not exactly telling you it's gonna fail.

That highlights it had support as a concept and I reckon if people knew its makeup, the types of issues it would advise on and how it operates, I think that support would have continued. I can only assume that the voting public assumed that all of that information would be known before going to the polls. People have overwhelmingly voted against it in its proposed form and that support you mentioned started to dwindle pretty soon after that (about 12 months ago).

 

[Chipmunk]

If indigenous people make up 3.8% of the population and wanted a voice to parliament could some people who identify themselves by religion rather than ethnicity try and do the same when the become a significant minority, say 10% or more?

What’s stopping them applying pressure to the government?

Christianity would already be well above 10% presently (I guess they're not minority though), but I get your point.

Interestingly enough there is a larger Chinese population in Australia now than there is Indigenous.