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Patrick Herbert

Glenn012

Juniors
Messages
171
From what I have seen, one could make a case that Garrick is better than either of our wingers. If he was let go because there are still better juniors coming through, time to give them a chance in the NRL now.
 

LINESPEED

Juniors
Messages
1,551
Garrick yes, we don't seem to have replaced like with like with out recruitment for the replacement of Macdonald or Nightingale. I think Garrick would have been a better solution than either Rava or Pereira.

Mary just needed to instil a bit of confidence in Garrick.

Another try to Garrick
Superb contest for bomb
Superb defence
Goal kicks well too
Being given more responsibility each week by Dessy

What a decent coach can do!


Ran down Ponga from a dead start the other day

Possum mate he was never given a chance because he might have eventually displaced our illustrious #3

Backline rotation & opportunity never happened because of the promises to & protection of Turnstile

It’s been happening under the radar for most for 5 long & failed years now

But surely becoming clearer every week FFS

FMD
I had him & Zac as our future centres, given their chances.
Two strapping, fast lads.

And our current backline has been a basket case

Another good one Brian?
 
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True_Believer

Juniors
Messages
1,724
Another try to Garrick
Superb contest for bomb
Superb defence
Goal kicks well too

All he had to do was fall over the line.
You neglected to mention he got fended off by Croker twice and was lucky there was cover coming across. His defence is suspect.
Both goals he kicked were from virtually in front. He missed one from the sideline.

We haven't lost anything by letting him go.
 

getsmarty

Immortal
Messages
33,485
190429warriorstraining_18.jpg


WARRIORS


Tragedy to triumph: Life-changing calls that shaped Herbert's rise
Author
Dan Walsh NRL.com Reporter
Timestamp
Fri 17 May 2019, 08:04 AM
walshdan-head.png

Patrick Herbert's life has turned on a dime more than once with the simple dialling of a phone.

The Dragons' call to recruit him as a Kiwi schoolboy bound for Super Rugby, with only a few games of league played in his life.

The Warriors' call to bring him home at the end of last year, offering a train-and-trial chance in November, nothing more than an opportunity.

But it’s the hundreds of missed calls that drive him.

A fateful, tragic morning that now casts Herbert's eyes skyward before every game.

"Every game since that day, I look up before kick-off. I'll do it the rest of my career," the Warriors rookie says matter-of-factly.

"I joined the Dragons straight out of school, I left my family when I was just 17.

"My sister Teresa Mae passed away in that time just before last year, she was 17 at the time.

"I don't really know the circumstances so much, but she took her own life.

herbertp-debut-190425_gt_44.jpg

Patrick Herbert after his NRL debut. :copyright:Grant Trouville/NRL Photos
"One day at the Dragons I woke up to about 100 missed calls. I still had to go into training that day too. I was just rattled.

"That was something that really affected me. I took it on myself. I was thinking 'I wasn't around for her'. Mentally, it got to me.

"We were close growing up, we all lived together under the one roof until I left.

"That was obviously pretty tough on me and my family. Being away from my family, that really drew us in, we got in really tight. It was a rough time for us.

"Before every game I go out and play, I sort of use her as motivation.

"I look up to the clouds. Usually people pray to God. I pray to my grandfather and my sister. I ask them to look out for me.

"I know she's up there guiding my journey."

After three years with the Dragons, Herbert was understandably drawn home back across the Tasman.

Warriors recruitment guru Peter O'Sullivan got him there.

"My manager was in negotiations with a lot of clubs but the Warriors were the ones who were onto it and got back to us pretty much immediately," Herbert says.

"That made it pretty clear for me."



Panthers v Warriors - Round 10

Still, it was a fair leap for the 22-year-old.

Plenty of Kiwi talent departs for Australian shores, only to return unfulfilled – to the point football manager Brian Smith is crunching numbers and conducting studies as to why.

Herbert had no guarantee of a new Warriors deal through the pre-season.

"But you could see he had something about him in the summer," coach Stephen Kearney says.

"I've seen that hunger about him from as soon as he got here.

"I think we see that drive in him out of his family. He's pretty quiet about it all, Pat asked me before Christmas for a day off training but didn't say why.

"It ended being around the anniversary [of Teresa Mae's death].

Warriors rookie Patrick Herbert. :copyright:Andrew Cornaga/www.Photosport.nz
"But you see that drive in him I think because of that.

"He's doing this for more than himself. That's really something, that he can work his way through it and use that experience positively."

That he's playing NRL at all draws a wry grin from Herbert.

Most of the talent that passes through Auckland's Saint Kentigern College is channelled into the 15-man game, following All Blacks alumni Jerome Kaino, Joe Rokocoko and John Afoa among others.

It was then-St George Illawarra scout Peter Mulholland who convinced Herbert to break the mould, Suliasi Vunivalu showing how as a Kentigern graduate a year earlier.

"I didn't think I'd be a Warrior or anything like that," Herbert says.

"I had my eyes on rugby union and then I got an opportunity at the Dragons.

"That was the first time I even really looked at rugby league aside from maybe a couple of games here and there. They recruited me as a rugby union player.

"Super Rugby, that was more likely when I finished school to be honest. There were a few clubs there we were talking to.

"But still I wasn't looking at it so much about rugby league, more this is a chance to get to Australia, go see somewhere new, get a taste of something different from NZ."

Five years on, and out the other side of loss that will always stay with him, Herbert got his taste of something different.

First grade. A 21,000-strong Anzac Day crowd, Will Chambers and Melbourne, the most successful club of the past decade.

"I'd heard a lot about [Will] Chambers," he says.

"He's a representative centre and one of the best going around so I knuckled down. I wrote it down in my diary, my goal was pretty simple, just make all my tackles.

Before every game I go out and play, I sort of use her as motivation.

Patrick Herbert
"I didn't even think about attack and it worked out alright.

"I got my family over to watch that game down in Melbourne. They don't really watch rugby league so to get them into the Anzac game, get them into that environment was special."

Herbert has held his place on the Warriors right edge ever since. Solomone Kata, with 10 Tests for Tonga and New Zealand, can't get past him.

Herbert will be there again at Panthers Stadium on Friday night. Just before kick-off, looking to heavens once more.

Help is available 24/7 for anyone who has mental health issues by calling Lifeline Australia on 13 11 14


https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/05/16...ging-calls-that-shaped-patrick-herberts-rise/
 
Messages
2,866
All he had to do was fall over the line.
You neglected to mention he got fended off by Croker twice and was lucky there was cover coming across. His defence is suspect.
Both goals he kicked were from virtually in front. He missed one from the sideline.

We haven't lost anything by letting him go.
I think you are over simplifying the Garrick discussion.
Do you really want to rationalize his performance against Newcastle or do you want to look at his performance overall for Manly?.
Under Hasler, he has developed into a very competent first grader.
His defence is not perfect but he is not suspect IMO.
He scores tries (falling over the line or not), is good under the high ball and is genuinely fast.
He is also a competent goal kicker.
Please tell me which of our current wingers are better?
I think we missed out on progressing a local junior while preferring to contract 3 new wingers from the market.
Namely Maranta, Pearson and Ravalawa.
 

denis preston

First Grade
Messages
8,224
Look , you can't keep them all but it would be good to see how they perform under the pressure of NRL before we let them go. This year for instance there has been an opportunity to slot in Trimm, Kerr, Pearson and up until 2 games ago Field to play but not given a chance.
That's the frustration that i can't understand why the board hasn't stepped in and nudged the coach.The long term squad depth is not served by playing Latimore , injured players and non performing one's

Pretty simple eh?
 
Messages
2,866
Look , you can't keep them all but it would be good to see how they perform under the pressure of NRL before we let them go. This year for instance there has been an opportunity to slot in Trimm, Kerr, Pearson and up until 2 games ago Field to play but not given a chance.
That's the frustration that i can't understand why the board hasn't stepped in and nudged the coach.The long term squad depth is not served by playing Latimore , injured players and non performing one's

Pretty simple eh?
Well said
How will we ever know if some of the fringe players are potential first graders if they don't get a chance?
I think form in reserve grade can be misleading because many kids only reach their potential once they are extended physically and mentally.
Some of them thrive under the pressure cooker environment of FG and others can't handle it.
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
I think you are over simplifying the Garrick discussion.
Do you really want to rationalize his performance against Newcastle or do you want to look at his performance overall for Manly?.
Under Hasler, he has developed into a very competent first grader.
His defence is not perfect but he is not suspect IMO.
He scores tries (falling over the line or not), is good under the high ball and is genuinely fast.
He is also a competent goal kicker.
Please tell me which of our current wingers are better?
I think we missed out on progressing a local junior while preferring to contract 3 new wingers from the market.
Namely Maranta, Pearson and Ravalawa.
But Millward and Mary are doing a great job. Departing, Nightingale, Macdonald, Garrick and Herbert and replacing them with Pereira, Ravalawa, Maragnta and Pearson. Let's just hope that Field and Saab do not go the same way. I'd like to see a more dynamic first grade back five comprising:

1. Dufty/Field
2. Saab
3. Lomax
4. Roberts
5. Oates

For season 2020, let go of Aitken, Lafai, Ravalawa and Pearson and promote some of our young guns to the CC backline.

Does anybody on here think Millward could manage this?
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
Well said
How will we ever know if some of the fringe players are potential first graders if they don't get a chance?
I think form in reserve grade can be misleading because many kids only reach their potential once they are extended physically and mentally.
Some of them thrive under the pressure cooker environment of FG and others can't handle it.
I think it very silly not to put everything into assessing our young guns for suitability for first grade. I'd like to see professional development coaches assigned to coach and assess the potential of players prior to offering them a top 30 contract and prior to showing them the door. Maybe this would be a great way to make a case for keeping players like J Bird and Robson.
 

True_Believer

Juniors
Messages
1,724
I think you are over simplifying the Garrick discussion.
Do you really want to rationalize his performance against Newcastle or do you want to look at his performance overall for Manly?.
Under Hasler, he has developed into a very competent first grader.
His defence is not perfect but he is not suspect IMO.
He scores tries (falling over the line or not), is good under the high ball and is genuinely fast.
He is also a competent goal kicker.
Please tell me which of our current wingers are better?
I think we missed out on progressing a local junior while preferring to contract 3 new wingers from the market.
Namely Maranta, Pearson and Ravalawa.

I believe it's you that's oversimplifying it.

As far as rationalizing his performance against Newcastle, I responded to LINESPEEDS comments which referred to his actions within that game and actually provided a different view - on his performance in that specific game. Although in my opinion, most of the games I've watched him play, his performance has been no better than the Newcastle game.

You are also looking at a team that plays a different style than the Dragons - one where Garricks skills may fit better.

When you look at the stats, he is poor in the stats that are valuable to our game style, ARs, ARMs etc. Rava and in particular JP are much stronger in those areas which suits our style. Whether our style is a good style or not is irrelevant - the wingers we have suit it more than Garrick. So yes, I stand by my statement that we have lost nothing as we have players that score tries, actually make less errors and are good fits for our play style. Are they perfect? Absolutely not - but that isn't the point of this discussion.

You simplify it by suggesting we should have progressed a local junior. I don't believe that is a sole reason for keeping a player - simply because they are local juniors. And rather than changing a whole game style to suit one player, I think they did the right thing by him and the club by letting him go.

**Edit - it was the Canberra game that was being discussed when the original post was made - not the Newcastle game.
 
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nrlnrl

First Grade
Messages
6,833
But Millward and Mary are doing a great job. Departing, Nightingale, Macdonald, Garrick and Herbert and replacing them with Pereira, Ravalawa, Maragnta and Pearson. Let's just hope that Field and Saab do not go the same way. I'd like to see a more dynamic first grade back five comprising:

1. Dufty/Field
2. Saab
3. Lomax
4. Roberts
5. Oates

For season 2020, let go of Aitken, Lafai, Ravalawa and Pearson and promote some of our young guns to the CC backline.

Does anybody on here think Millward could manage this?
No, Oates will re-sign with Broncos.
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
Oates is too expensive for a winger.
With JDB effectively off our books and Widdop wanting to go to the UK next year and with a number of contracts ending at seasons end, we need to re-balance the squad and bring in some talented first grade backs.

We can match the Broncos price for Oates and Roberts, all we need is a good salesman and TPA. Promote Kerr, Timm, Ford and Saab into our 17 this season and with the above mentioned backs we have a good young enthusiastic side that can compete for the premiership.
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
But Millward and Mary are doing a great job. Departing, Nightingale, Macdonald, Garrick and Herbert and replacing them with Pereira, Ravalawa, Maragnta and Pearson. Let's just hope that Field and Saab do not go the same way. I'd like to see a more dynamic first grade back five comprising:

1. Dufty/Field
2. Saab
3. Lomax
4. Roberts
5. Oates

For season 2020, let go of Aitken, Lafai, Ravalawa and Pearson and promote some of our young guns to the CC backline.

Does anybody on here think Millward could manage this?

You know your record including rival players into hypothetical lineups isn’t flash? It’s almost a death kneel meaning there’s no chance now they will join the Dragons. Many years ago before I joined this forum, I remember (as an interested voyeur) your good self writing many times over advocating Sam Kasiano’s inclusion.

We all know what happened there.
 

Saint_JimmyG

First Grade
Messages
5,067
Oates is too expensive for a winger.

Given the urgency (and dilemma) here, Saints have no other recourse that to pay overs for top quality wingers. The same principle applied with Ben Hunt as Saints did not have a fair dinkum long term halfback since Noel Goldthorpe in 1996.

Add to the mix a deeply incompetent coach, the situation is only exemplified.
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
You know your record including rival players into hypothetical lineups isn’t flash? It’s almost a death kneel meaning there’s no chance now they will join the Dragons. Many years ago before I joined this forum, I remember (as an interested voyeur) your good self writing many times over advocating Sam Kasiano’s inclusion.

We all know what happened there.
Hey go easy on me, with Mary as our coach and Millward as our salesman I'm doing the best with what we have. Im sure that if we had the Storms coach or the Rabbits coach or the Rooster's coach, I would not feel the need to wirte about such things.
 

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